Witold Lutoslawski (1913-1994)

[EigenUser]

Just heard Luto 4 for the first time. Awesome piece!

[Mirror Image]

Just heard Luto 4 for the first time. Awesome piece!

Certainly is. What other Lutoslawski works have you heard, Nate?

[Cato]

Just heard Luto 4 for the first time. Awesome piece!

Thanks to Maciek, you can hear many works on line: here is the Fourth Symphony.

http://threecomposers.pl/utwor/iv-symfonia

[EigenUser]

Certainly is. What other Lutoslawski works have you heard, Nate?

Let's see...
-Symphony No. 4 -- loved
-CFO -- liked
-Cello Concerto -- hated (sorry guys )
-Symphony No. 3 -- didn't like, but I'll give it another go
-Venetian Games -- didn't like
-Piano Concerto -- really liked

[snyprrr]

Let's see...
-Symphony No. 4 -- loved
-CFO -- liked
-Cello Concerto -- hated (sorry guys )
-Symphony No. 3 -- didn't like, but I'll give it another go
-Venetian Games -- didn't like
-Piano Concerto -- really liked

You like Late WL. You should definitely try harder with No.3 (Salonen most preferably). Surely you'll like the other Early Music like Symphony 1 or the Funeral Music. The Cello Concerto is his most misunderstood piece imo,- the word 'farty' pops into mind (I had it in the pile for listening this week- to make some sense of it- yea, it's hard to like). I don't blame you there- but- out of all the Modern Composers, WL is The One you should try to 'Like'. Things like Symphony 2 and 'Venetian Games' should be attempted at regular intervals to force the barrage of notes down your throat- you'll eat your dissonance like a man!!

Sym 3 is a massive Romantic 'End of the World' piece- very big brassy chords and lots of distinctive melody in a very dramatic arc of events- who doesn't thrill to the opening ba-da-da-da? I imagine it written in 1899...

Really, other than Sym 4 and the PC, what major Late Work is there? The Mutter disc?...

[EigenUser]

You like Late WL. You should definitely try harder with No.3 (Salonen most preferably). Surely you'll like the other Early Music like Symphony 1 or the Funeral Music. The Cello Concerto is his most misunderstood piece imo,- the word 'farty' pops into mind (I had it in the pile for listening this week- to make some sense of it- yea, it's hard to like). I don't blame you there- but- out of all the Modern Composers, WL is The One you should try to 'Like'. Things like Symphony 2 and 'Venetian Games' should be attempted at regular intervals to force the barrage of notes down your throat- you'll eat your dissonance like a man!!

Sym 3 is a massive Romantic 'End of the World' piece- very big brassy chords and lots of distinctive melody in a very dramatic arc of events- who doesn't thrill to the opening ba-da-da-da? I imagine it written in 1899...

Really, other than Sym 4 and the PC, what major Late Work is there? The Mutter disc?...

Yeah, the Luto cello concerto reminds me a little bit of the Ligeti cello concerto, which (as much as I love Ligeti) is a piece that I really don't like. I've tried many times -- with the score, without the score, different recordings, in a box, with a fox...

I do not like it, Sam I am!

There is some Luto on the Berlin's digital concert hall and I've been looking at that recently. I think I'll listen to the 2nd symphony next. Is that a 'difficult' one as well? How does it compare to the cello concerto?

[snyprrr]

Yeah, the Luto cello concerto reminds me a little bit of the Ligeti cello concerto, which (as much as I love Ligeti) is a piece that I really don't like. I've tried many times -- with the score, without the score, different recordings, in a box, with a fox...

I do not like it, Sam I am!

There is some Luto on the Berlin's digital concert hall and I've been looking at that recently. I think I'll listen to the 2nd symphony next. Is that a 'difficult' one as well? How does it compare to the cello concerto?

It's more like 'Venetian', random-y and violent! Yaaay!!



btw- everyone was writing unattractive CCs during the '60s.



But, Sym 3 shouldn't be a problem, - just be in the mood for 30 minutes.

[snyprrr]

I'm taking Slava CC in the car. Back l8r

[EigenUser]

I'm taking Slava CC in the car. Back l8r

Make sure to play it loud and disturb others in traffic .

[jochanaan]

...But, Sym 3 shouldn't be a problem, - just be in the mood for 30 minutes.

Lutoslawski 3 has one of the most powerful endings in all music--that long slow buildup to the percussion-filled ending...

[snyprrr]

Make sure to play it loud and disturb others in traffic .

y'know... I enjoyed it a lot this time. I already knew to expect the rrrm rrrm rrrm rrrm rrrm, and I still find it ridiculously convoluted- the opening solo- and - I guess he meant it that way- very Xenakian.

And yea, I knew to expect the brass braying- but, at some point, when it all just sounded like a game being tossed around to different sections, the joy of sound and noise took over and I could start appreciating it. It definitely reminds me of the Xenakis Cello Concerto of 1969- it could very well have come from him in an odd mood- and, considering Xenakis had a little criticism for the Polish non-scientifics- maybe Lutoslawski was showing how far he could go. And this concerto goes pretty far in trying to "be something".

But, at the moment, I'm giving the shadow of the doubt to WL. (nice piano and percussion interplay)

[not edward]

There is some Luto on the Berlin's digital concert hall and I've been looking at that recently. I think I'll listen to the 2nd symphony next. Is that a 'difficult' one as well? How does it compare to the cello concerto?

I'd say the 2nd symphony is as tough listening as it gets, Lutoslawski-wise. Definitely a harder sell than the cello concerto. For the mid-period, gritty Lutoslawski (1960-1976) I'd suggest Livre, Mi-parti or Paroles tissees as perhaps easier to connect with than the symphony.

But your mileage may very; after all, the cello concerto's my single favourite Lutoslawski work.

[snyprrr]

after all, the cello concerto's my single favourite Lutoslawski work.

It's quite a unique structure- but what do you like? The solo scales in the beginning sound kind of Xenakian, as does a lot of the obsessive atmosphere and the sense that we are experimenting on the spot in a lab gives the impression of High Modernity (it is the late '50s after all). The crashing back and forth between groups... I find the structure to be tube-like- it just goes in one straight line from beginning to end (though it's quite a  messy ride)... what do you think?

[EigenUser]

Is anyone here familiar with the Luto "Ten Polish Dances" for orchestra (John, I'm looking at you )? I acquired a large conductor's score of this work for $3.50 today (it was an oversize score of a familiar name -- how could I resist at that price?), but I have never heard of it previously. I listened on YouTube later today and it reminds me of the thing for clarinet and orchestra that he did.

It even comes with what appears to be a detachable poster of Lutoslawski! Reminds me of a quote I saw commenting on how the CSO website has a downloadable picture of Boulez for desktop wallpaper:

The Chicago Symphony Orchestra thinks a race of people exists who want to download an image of Boulez onto their computer desktop.

[Mirror Image]

Is anyone here familiar with the Luto "Ten Polish Dances" for orchestra (John, I'm looking at you )? I acquired a large conductor's score of this work for $3.50 today (it was an oversize score of a familiar name -- how could I resist at that price?), but I have never heard of it previously. I listened on YouTube later today and it reminds me of the thing for clarinet and orchestra that he did.

It even comes with what appears to be a detachable poster of Lutoslawski! Reminds me of a quote I saw commenting on how the CSO website has a downloadable picture of Boulez for desktop wallpaper:

Yep, I know the work and really enjoy it. Of course, it's written in his 'folk-influenced style' but it's still good fun nonetheless. The pinnacle of this folk-influenced style is the Concerto for Orchestra, which Lutoslawski wasn't terribly fond of.

[EigenUser]

Yep, I know the work and really enjoy it. Of course, it's written in his 'folk-influenced style' but it's still good fun nonetheless. The pinnacle of this folk-influenced style is the Concerto for Orchestra, which Lutoslawski wasn't terribly fond of.

Ah, the CFO -- I've been meaning to hear that again. I've heard it twice so far and really enjoyed it.

Do you like the 2nd symphony? I've still been meaning to hear that one as well. Apparently it's kind of a gnarly work.

[Mirror Image]

Ah, the CFO -- I've been meaning to hear that again. I've heard it twice so far and really enjoyed it.

Do you like the 2nd symphony? I've still been meaning to hear that one as well. Apparently it's kind of a gnarly work.

Honestly, I don't like Symphony No. 2 with Symphonies 3 & 4 being much more to my taste. Symphony No. 1 is quite good too for an early work. If I were to be even more honest, some of my favorite Lutoslawski are the works he wrote for voice and orchestra. These works are completely spellbinding. I still enjoy many of his purely orchestral works and the concertante works, except the Cello Concerto, which I've never warmed to and can't get my head around it.

Do you own any Lutoslawski recordings yet?

[snyprrr]

except the Cello Concerto, which I've never warmed to and can't get my head around it.

oh, you and he aught to get along just fine!

[EigenUser]

Honestly, I don't like Symphony No. 2 with Symphonies 3 & 4 being much more to my taste. Symphony No. 1 is quite good too for an early work. If I were to be even more honest, some of my favorite Lutoslawski are the works he wrote for voice and orchestra. These works are completely spellbinding. I still enjoy many of his purely orchestral works and the concertante works, except the Cello Concerto, which I've never warmed to and can't get my head around it.

Do you own any Lutoslawski recordings yet?

No, I've been listening via YouTube. I also have a subscription to the Berlin DCH which I love because the concerts stream from my iPhone to the AppleTV connected to the big screen and sound system. They have the 2nd (among others) -- I think I'll watch it tomorrow.

[EigenUser]

Okay, I just saw Luto's 2nd symphony and was ready to not like it. I thought that the first movement ("Hesitant") was kind of dull, but I actually admit that I enjoyed the second movement ("Direct"). It was exciting!