Beethoven's String Quartets

Started by marvinbrown, July 14, 2007, 02:29:06 PM

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Reverend Bong

#600
Well I've just read right through this thread and I'm sorry I wasn't around when it was busy. It has prompted me to dig out the late quartets, assuming I would have all the main ones under discussion, but no!  I really thought I had enough of these since I've got them performed by all of the following quartets:

Busch
Budapest
Alban Berg
Yale
Lener
Lindsay
Vanbrugh
Italian
Janacek
Amadeus
Smetana
Vlach
Koeckert
Griller
Collegium Aureum
Hungarian (stereo)
Fine Arts

You'd think that would do, you really would, but I haven't got the Vegh Quartet and since it's clear that 9 out of 10 forum members think they are as hot as their pants, I have to buy some more!  Dammit!  Well it's going to have to be one out one in like a nightclub, that's all I can say.  There's going to have to be a big listening session to find the weakest link.





Dancing Divertimentian

Quote from: Reverend Bong on November 13, 2012, 01:34:28 PM
You'd think that would do, you really would, but I haven't got the Vegh Quartet and since it's clear that 9 out of 10 forum members think they are as hot as their pants, I have to buy some more!  Dammit!  Well it's going to have to be one out one in like a nightclub, that's all I can say.  There's going to have to be a big listening session to find the weakest link.

Vegh = automatic. There's also the Hagen for even more "great lates" (mostly out of print, however).


[asin]B00003ZA68[/asin]
Veit Bach-a baker who found his greatest pleasure in a little cittern which he took with him even into the mill and played while the grinding was going on. In this way he had a chance to have the rhythm drilled into him. And this was the beginning of a musical inclination in his descendants. JS Bach

Reverend Bong

Does anyone know how to pronounce 'Vegh'?  Is the 'gh' silent? gutteral?  I assume they aren't 'vague'

Rinaldo

Quote from: Reverend Bong on November 14, 2012, 01:21:19 AM
Does anyone know how to pronounce 'Vegh'?  Is the 'gh' silent? gutteral?  I assume they aren't 'vague'

Check out Sándor Végh on this list.

Reverend Bong

Quote from: Rinaldo on November 14, 2012, 03:52:18 AM
Check out Sándor Végh on this list.
'Vague' it is, then.  Thank you for that, what an amazingly useful use of the internet.  I'm pleased to find I was right about everyone listed there that I was uncertain of, other than Ligeti, poor man, I've always wrongly put the stress on the second syllable, and he's one of my favourite composers.

Cleared up my lingering uncertainty about Milhaud too.  What is it with the French abandoning their consonants?

The new erato

Quote from: Reverend Bong on November 14, 2012, 06:08:58 AM

Cleared up my lingering uncertainty about Milhaud too.  What is it with the French abandoning their consonants?
Sacrificed in the interest of fluidity (or flow). Beatiful, but occasionally difficult to comprehend.

North Star

Quote from: Rinaldo on November 14, 2012, 03:52:18 AM
Check out Sándor Végh on this list.
Who the heck is Essa-Pekka Salonen...  8) That kind of typo doesn't exactly reflect well on the site.
"Everything has beauty, but not everyone sees it." - Confucius

My photographs on Flickr

kishnevi

Quote from: The new erato on November 14, 2012, 06:22:32 AM
Sacrificed in the interest of fluidity (or flow). Beatiful, but difficult to comprehend.

FTFY.


Thread duty: now listening to the Endellions playing Razumovsky No. 3 and the Harp Quartet.  So far this set is proving very well done, although I didn't hear them burn rubber in Razumovsky 3 like Brian said they would.  (It was good--don't get me wrong--I'm just not sure what led him to describe their playing that way.)

Brian

Quote from: Jeffrey Smith on November 14, 2012, 06:11:10 PM
Thread duty: now listening to the Endellions playing Razumovsky No. 3 and the Harp Quartet.  So far this set is proving very well done, although I didn't hear them burn rubber in Razumovsky 3 like Brian said they would.  (It was good--don't get me wrong--I'm just not sure what led him to describe their playing that way.)

Start of the recap in the finale. I was a little vexed as, immediately after I posted that, they played the coda without haste and therefore made my comment relevant to only about 90 seconds  ;D

xochitl

endellion is quickly becoming my favorite overall

kishnevi

Quote from: Brian on November 14, 2012, 06:53:23 PM
Start of the recap in the finale. I was a little vexed as, immediately after I posted that, they played the coda without haste and therefore made my comment relevant to only about 90 seconds  ;D

Oh, that 90 seconds!  Yes, you're right about that.

Anyway, so far a very good take (I listened to two CDs tonight, and have three to go.)

Tonight is turning out to be a Ludwig-thon.  First those string quartets, and now Glenn Gould playing two sets of bagatelles and Sonata 24.

Reverend Bong

#611
Well, the Vicarage was filled with the sound of strings (and bottles of stout) until gone midnight last night.  The overall impressions were, first, as with the Violin Concerto, how extraordinarily diverse different interpretations are, and second, what a lot of really good performances of the late quartets are available.  However there are definite losers, quite a few are on the sale pile this morning.

A few notes if anyone's interested:

The Koeckert, a very ancient heavy Heliodor LP labelled 'transcription' and therefore presumably a fairly straight copy from 78s, really sounded like 78s, very old and not with any particular quality to make up for the thinness of sound and surface noise.  Lovely red and gold Heliodor label was its only merit really.  Given the passion and intensity of the Busch recordings, any other clearly historical disc would have to be pretty astounding to be worth keeping.  The Griller went the same way, a fine unboxed Decca LP but nothing there that would make me seek out a clean modern version of this.  If I want historical mono, Adolf Busch is head and shoulders and waistcoat clear of the competition.

The Italians are lovely, really beautiful - the tone, the intonation, the recording - simply gorgeous - even to the extent that at times, perish the thought, I began to wonder if it was almost too elegant and lovely for its own good, perhaps something of the intensity of feeling that others show is lacking at times?  But an absolute must-have, and I see it was the recipient of one of the rare rosettes in my bible, the old Penguin guide.  This set made a good reference.

The Amadeus Quartet.  Oh dear.  I don't know what it is about Brainin and co, but my attention just wanders off as soon as they start.  Something is missing - they don't seem to get it.  Kept coming back to these in puzzlement, one of them was awarded the Deutscher Schallplattenpreis, but the soul of the music seems to be missing. They're on their way out, perhaps some Japanese collector will be seduced by the tulips on the DGG label.

People here may be interested in the only PI recording in the collection, Collegium Aureum.  This is on Harmonia Mundi and as you'd expect an exemplary recording, performed on Stradivariiiii. It was recorded in the Library of Congress, which seems an odd location - in fact it was a condition of the gift of the instruments that they never leave the building.  I don't know what kind of room was used but there doesn't seem to be any kind of ambience at all.  The tone of the instruments is lovely as you'd expect, but they seem to exist in a kind of void.  This is a relatively minor point, the recording is great in all other respects.  More seriously undermining it to me is that the players seem to lack passion.  They play as though it was the day job, or as if they were afraid of breaking the instruments, which is probably precisely the case.  The drama and fire that several, well, many other quartets evoke are simply not there at all.  LP for sale if any PIer here wants it.  Good thing I don't work in sales...

The Smetana Quartet - in sharpest possible contrast to Collegium Boreium, and more closely miked - play with thrilling drama.  Their emotional commitment had us on the edge of our seat.  Every disc of the Smetana we had was genuinely exciting to listen to.  These are my current favourite.  There is MEANING in their late quartets.

Finally, the surprise discovery of the night, never listened to before, the Yale Quartet.  These were bought from a bargain $1 box under the counter in a Toronto record store years ago, and obviously this is my own ignorance, but I had never heard of them or the record label (Vanguard's Cardinal series).  Half a dozen notes is all it took and they jumped the rankings to stand with the Italians, the Smetana, the Alban Berg Quartet.  Brilliant performances, extremely well recorded. These are now sitting by the record player for serious listening.  I shall hold off on detailed discussion until I've compared them closely with the rest of the top rank, but the very first impression was of a slightly more intellectual approach than the sheer emotional force of the Smetana and the gilded beauty of the Italians.  I look forward to coming to know these better.

The new erato

#612
So the Koeckert was "Murder at the Vicarage"?

The Yale BTW are outstanding (I've owned it since LP days); the Italians I feel simply are too civilized for Beethoven (though superbly suited for Mozart).

Reverend Bong

Quote from: The new erato on November 15, 2012, 02:53:51 AM
the Italians I feel simply are too civilized for Beethoven (though superbly suited for Mozart).

'Mozartian' is in fact the adjective we were using about them last night, you're spot-on. 

kishnevi

The Italianos in the Late Quartets were among my very first CD purchases, and probably my first recording of anyone's chamber music.  To be perfectly honest,  I deeply enjoy their approach because it plays down the emotions--I would want to say it's an objective performance, except that no musical performance can be truly objective. 

BTW, Reverend,  that's a very nice wallpaper you've added to the Vicarage listening room....

Reverend Bong

Has anyone heard the first volume of the Belcea Quartet cycle, just announced in Presto's latest email?

Brian

Quote from: Reverend Bong on November 19, 2012, 02:49:35 AM
Has anyone heard the first volume of the Belcea Quartet cycle, just announced in Presto's latest email?

It's due for release soon; you can check Presto's website proper for 60-second clips of every track. I think Todd might have ordered a copy already.

Reverend Bong

Quote from: Brian on November 19, 2012, 04:38:49 AM
It's due for release soon; you can check Presto's website proper for 60-second clips of every track.

Oops sorry, jumping the gun.  I'm still catching up, I just won a set of the Veghs on eBay but the seller has asked double the postage from what it was listed at so we are in dispute at present.

stingo

NPR had a story about Belcea performing Beethoven at Carnegie Hall and there's an hour or so mp3 on their Classical music podcast feed.

petrarch

Quote from: petrarch on October 21, 2012, 02:32:33 PM
New cycle in the making:

[asin]B0092YHIVO[/asin]

I am a Berg and Takács admirer, but my curiosity is piqued. It seems the recordings are all from their recent year-long series of concerts.

Preview:

http://www.youtube.com/v/4aYOZb8T3cE
//p
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