Alternative news sources

[Brian]

Cracked just ran an article on conspiracies today. I didn't realize there was a Pearl Harbor conspiracy!

But the top comment might be most useful here:

Sorry, this article changed exactly zero minds. It just proves you don't understand conspiracy theorists. They WANT to believe the nutball stuff. It's part of their identity. The Gubmint killed Kennedy because he was going to expose the Illuminati's plan to poison errbody with fluoride in the water so we can vaccinate their bsbies into autism. Cobain knew the truth, so he had to be kept silent. And the Jews demolished the WTC so we could blame Islam for Hitler bombing Pearl Harbor. See? It's fun! Now all I have to do is plaster my walls with pictures of Carrie Fisher, start shitting into pizza boxes, and start a blog and a MySpace page.

Most conspiracists could not find their asshole with a funnel.

Even better is this one:

"Nearly all conspiracy theory "research" is done by doing the scientific method backwards--in other words, you come up with a conclusion first, and then try to force-fit any and all evidence to support it."

[Karl Henning]

Cobain knew the truth, so he had to be kept silent.

Man, I laughed fit near to bust a gut.

I mean, pop musicians don't really fall into lethally self-destructive habits, nooooooo . . . .

[Todd]

The Gubmint killed Kennedy because he was going to expose the Illuminati's plan to poison errbody with fluoride in the water so we can vaccinate their bsbies into autism.

This is precisely why Portland, OR is the place to live.  The citizens there recently voted down fluoridating their water, and they have one of the highest vaccine exemption rates in the country, meaning they can celebrate their liberty in all its toothless, sickly glory!

[kaergaard]

Keine Scheiße!

OT: (Nice try, Karl, but "No Shit" doesn't translate too well into German, looses it's umph! My friends and I stick to the original.)

[Karl Henning]

They said the same about Les Garçons de la Plage, but it isn't about the oomph . . . .

[Sean]

MishaK

You'd much rather see yourself as a "free thinker", someone smarter than the "sheeple", someone who stands out. You'd like to justify your existence as a social misfit by convincing yourself that you're better and society just isn't smart enough to appreciate you. You're not.

I like this observation and more than ready to acknowledge how true it is. I'm not sure if I look down on people all the time but the extent to which someone identifies with their surrounding cultural presuppositions as propped up by the media, and can only question things from above that point, is a give-away to how meaningful a relation I can have with them. Most people quickly realize with horror that my idea of socializing isn't five hours of two second conversations and simplistic banter, stacked up on frightened world viewpoints in the background.

As you probably know every statement in your summary of 9/11 has been challenged and challenged. The most important point however is perhaps how the buildings should respond to the airliner impacts, and in Building 7's case how it should respond to no impacts. Take a look at the A&E documentary called something like ...explosive evidence, architects and engineers speak out..., over an hour of many professional architects explaining why the official account of the collapses is wrong and that there had to be some sort of accelerant.

The alternative false flag theory by contrast makes perfect sense in terms of the military industrial complex, oil access and geopolitics. Nanothermitic explosives were placed at the joints of the beams with the core columns and detonated by timed sequence to bring the buildings down. This is an extremely well understood process carried out by numerous companies around the world and doesn't involve the tortuous explanations about office fires up on a few out of 110 floors cause the failure of the rest of the building in a normal state with its enormous and redundant vertical resistance.

Also take a look at Richard Gage's Blueprint for truth and the various Steven Jones and David Ray Griffin, and David Chandler videos.

And see the film clip of the firefighter making a phone call when a huge explosion in Building 7 goes off, shortly before its demolition.
Explosive squibs are further visible all down the sides of the towers in all the videos you can find.

[drogulus]

"Nanothermitic explosives were placed at the joints of the beams with the core columns and detonated by timed sequence to bring the buildings down."

     No one who worked at the WTC noticed or objected to what must have taken weeks for the contractors to complete? Who was the contractor for this job? Who were the subcontractors? Did they sign in and show their IDs? They must have been well known to get this job. This isn't something military or CIA types could do without anyone being tipped off not to question or even look at these guys 'cause it's a super big secret which no one can ever know ever, yet every conspiracy buff in the world knows aaalll about it!

   

[kishnevi]

Jeffrey


A large chunk of the population just doesn't agree with you.

This merely proves a large chunk of the population doesn't know how to use their thinking skills.  (Which means you and I agree on one thing at least.)

And regarding mistakes in the programme for 9/11 there were several, the main one that Flight 93 crashed in Pennsylvania and didn't hit what was probably its target of Building 7. 7 was stuffed like a turkey with explosives and had no excuse to fall, but a decision had to be made at 5.20 to pull it after even the pitiful office fires had gone out, and it came down in perfectly symmetrical free-fall acceleration, a 47 story immense steel frame skyscraper, providing the most mysterious building collapse in the entire history of architecture.

Buildings demolished by explosions fall in a completely different fashion.  Exposure to intense heat and the latent effect of shock waves from the collapse of the other buildings, which can take some time to become apparent and therefore can not be expected to be simultaneous with the fall of the two "big" buildings, is all that is needed to account for Building 7. 
There's also the fact that if someone was to actually have engineered this conspiracy, it would be far more logical for them to pick a site with no connection to the WTC. 
Add to this the fact that if the Bush administration wanted the results you assert it wanted from this consipiracy,  far simpler, less dangerous options existed. 

As an aside, Towers 1 and 2 were hit by flights 11 and 175. 11 + 175 = 186. 186 / 2 = 93.

93, 93, 93. Apparently the number 93 has numerological significance...

It does, in Thelema.  But although I never joined the OTO, I do know a few members of it, and can vouch for the fact that they would not be involved in such nonsense--not as conspirators and not as conspiracy freaks.

[Sean]

Jeffrey, drogulus, MishaK et al, why don't you give in, admit your psychosis and make that phone call for some help.



Your thoughts are duly noted and duly binned. I commend you to Youtube and the relevant wealth of internet sites that deal with these objections...

[kishnevi]

I'll quote this statement of Sean a second time.
http://www.good-music-guide.com/community/index.php/topic,21862.msg720842.html#msg720842

most people just absolutely do not want to know thank you very much if their little perspective on the world is going to be threatened.

Very considerate of him to make himself an immediate demonstration of the claim he makes there.

[The new erato]

Jeffrey, drogulus, MishaK et al, why don't you give in, admit your psychosis and make that phone call for some help.



Your thoughts are duly noted and duly binned. I commend you to Youtube and the relevant wealth of internet sites that deal with these objections...

Please, please; why are you leaving me out of the company of sane people?

[Sean]

Jeffrey you should be committed, even if I know there was a contradiction somewhere in my posts... Time for the next OTT topic.

[Karl Henning]

"Nanothermitic explosives were placed at the joints of the beams with the core columns and detonated by timed sequence to bring the buildings down."

     No one who worked at the WTC noticed or objected to what must have taken weeks for the contractors to complete? Who was the contractor for this job? Who were the subcontractors? Did they sign in and show their IDs? They must have been well known to get this job. This isn't something military or CIA types could do without anyone being tipped off not to question or even look at these guys 'cause it's a super big secret which no one can ever know ever, yet every conspiracy buff in the world knows aaalll about it!

Which brings us back to Brian's surgical contribution:

"Nearly all conspiracy theory "research" is done by doing the scientific method backwards--in other words, you come up with a conclusion first, and then try to force-fit any and all evidence to support it."

[MishaK]

I like this observation and more than ready to acknowledge how true it is.

Thank you. Truthfulness to yourself is the first step on the path to healing.

I'm not sure if I look down on people all the time  [...] Most people quickly realize with horror that my idea of socializing isn't five hours of two second conversations and simplistic banter, stacked up on frightened world viewpoints in the background.

q.e.d.

The alternative false flag theory by contrast makes perfect sense

But what IS the alternative theory? Please spell it out from A to Z. From planning to execution and aftermath, like I did with the standard theory. What is the theory? All I have seen is semi-competent, psudo-scientific challenges of this or that piece of evidence, not a coherent theory. That's all I'm asking you to do. Spell out the goddam theory. What is it?

[Sean]

Hi Mishak, I know you want me to try detailing out a scenario that may seem more complicated than the official account and thus with Ocam's razor etc it's unlikely to be true.

However Operation Northwoods as a pretext for a Cuban invasion for Kennedy was complicated, arranging the Reichstag fire was complicated, and the Gulf of Tonkin reports were complicated...

[MishaK]

Hi Mishak, I know you want me to try detailing out a scenario that may seem more complicated than the official account and thus with Ocam's razor etc it's unlikely to be true.

I didn't say it's more complicated. I have no idea whether it is or isn't more complicated. Complexity in and of itself isn't a killer. I just asked you for a theory. I have never heard the alternative theory set forth in a straightforward linear historic thread. Is that really too much to ask for?

[Karl Henning]

Hi Mishak, I know you want me to try detailing out a scenario ...

... but I have no scenario, just a kneejerk rejection of the official, and documented, account.

[Sean]

I didn't say it's more complicated. I have no idea whether it is or isn't more complicated. Complexity in and of itself isn't a killer. I just asked you for a theory. I have never heard the alternative theory set forth in a straightforward linear historic thread. Is that really too much to ask for?

Well I'm a bit jaded with 9/11 actually and if you want to chalk up this thread as one to MishaK & Karl then you're welcome... Best, Sean

[dyn]

I didn't say it's more complicated. I have no idea whether it is or isn't more complicated. Complexity in and of itself isn't a killer. I just asked you for a theory. I have never heard the alternative theory set forth in a straightforward linear historic thread. Is that really too much to ask for?

You see, it's very simple. The NSA has been fluoridating the water in New York City and administering vaccines to children for decades now, both of which render one susceptible to mind control waves broadcasted from cell phone towers. This brainwashing allowed their hired men to enter the World Trade Center & Pentagon unquestioned as they simply repeated the numerological codes that television advertisements have subliminally planted in people's minds, hypnotising people into being unable to see them. These hired men installed explosives within the buildings and Flight 93, unaware of what they were doing and believing they were installing smoke detectors (of course, bear in mind that so-called "smoke detectors" actually emit LSD fumes to keep the population in a continual state of susceptibility to suggestion, but this is a different story). On September 11th 2001, the American-funded and sponsored "terrorist group" Al Qaeda was given the ability to hijack several commercial airliners by the CIA, which arranged for NORAD to be down on the day in question. The explosives were detonated simultaneous with the "terrorist attacks" and a false black box recording was planted on Flight 93 to make it seem as though it was a genuine hijacking. People wonder why no one ever came forth to corroborate this story, but, of course, it's very easy to hide dead bodies in a site where bodies are already expected to be found! (And any who escaped the initial purge could be disposed of under the pretenses of some kind of "war in Iraq", of course.) Really, given all the assassinations of US citizens the government's ordered in the past seventy years (JFK, RFK, MLK, etc) and gotten away with, you'd think it would be obvious.

I'd add something along the lines of "WAKE UP SHEEPLE!" but as xkcd has demonstrated that can have unexpected results

[Gurn Blanston]

You see, it's very simple. The NSA has been fluoridating the water in New York City and administering vaccines to children for decades now, both of which render one susceptible to mind control waves broadcasted from cell phone towers. This brainwashing allowed their hired men to enter the World Trade Center & Pentagon unquestioned as they simply repeated the numerological codes that television advertisements have subliminally planted in people's minds, hypnotising people into being unable to see them. These hired men installed explosives within the buildings and Flight 93, unaware of what they were doing and believing they were installing smoke detectors (of course, bear in mind that so-called "smoke detectors" actually emit LSD fumes to keep the population in a continual state of susceptibility to suggestion, but this is a different story). On September 11th 2001, the American-funded and sponsored "terrorist group" Al Qaeda was given the ability to hijack several commercial airliners by the CIA, which arranged for NORAD to be down on the day in question. The explosives were detonated simultaneous with the "terrorist attacks" and a false black box recording was planted on Flight 93 to make it seem as though it was a genuine hijacking. People wonder why no one ever came forth to corroborate this story, but, of course, it's very easy to hide dead bodies in a site where bodies are already expected to be found! (And any who escaped the initial purge could be disposed of under the pretenses of some kind of "war in Iraq", of course.) Really, given all the assassinations of US citizens the government's ordered in the past seventy years (JFK, RFK, MLK, etc) and gotten away with, you'd think it would be obvious.

I'd add something along the lines of "WAKE UP SHEEPLE!" but as xkcd has demonstrated that can have unexpected results

I knew it!!!   

Well, you certainly took the pressure off of Sean.