Vaughan Williams's Veranda

[Mirror Image]

So?

How?

[relm1]

How?

I didn't follow the point you meant about Sibelius died in 1957 but 8th fragments were heard in 2011.  Shostakovich died in 1975 and Orango was constructed and first performed in 2015.  So?  What difference does that make?

[North Star]

How much time went by before scraps of Sibelius 8 was heard?

I didn't follow the point you meant about Sibelius died in 1957 but 8th fragments were heard in 2011.  Shostakovich died in 1975 and Orango was constructed and first performed in 2015.  So?  What difference does that make?

You asked, and got an answer...

[Mirror Image]

You asked, and got an answer...

Yes, indeed. Don't ask a question and not expect to get an answer. If it was a rhetorical question, then it's difficult to assimilate the difference online.

[relm1]

Yes, indeed. Don't ask a question and not expect to get an answer. If it was a rhetorical question, then it's difficult to assimilate the difference online.

Of course it was rhetorical. CONTEXT PEOPLE!!!!  Ok so now that I follow, who cares.  Back to topic, it doesn't matter that time passes between when sketches are made and a "performing edition" appears as long as it is reconstructed with thoughtful knowledge from an expert in that composers style and clearly understood to be a best guess of what could have been.   Geesh you pandemic people.   

[Mirror Image]

Of course it was rhetorical. CONTEXT PEOPLE!!!!  Ok so now that I follow, who cares.  Back to topic, it doesn't matter that time passes between when sketches are made and a "performing edition" appears as long as it is reconstructed with thoughtful knowledge from an expert in that composers style and clearly understood to be a best guess of what could have been.   Geesh you pandemic people.   

And as I pointed out, I didn't understand that you weren't actually asking a question --- there's no need to talk down to me.

[aligreto]

Guys, can you two, or the mods, take this somewhere else please??? This valuable thread has been hijacked.

[Christo]

Guys, can you two, or the mods, take this somewhere else please??? This valuable thread has been hijacked.

A mild cough, not developed into a real hijack yet.   Especially, because we'll continue discussing RVW only.

Vaughan Williams: Symphony No. 5 [Gibson]



The wonderful, singing, pastoral opening is well played here. However, by comparison with my other two versions [Boult and Previn], I felt that there was more restraint here as well as more poignancy. This is not a bad thing as it adds an interesting flavour to the interpretation. I like the treatment of the woodwinds and the brass in particular in this first movement.
I like the sense of levity in the second movement but there is a definite dark undercurrent at play here.
The slow movement, Romanza, is a dark version to my ears. The tempo appears quite slow and the tone is heavy, almost oppressive; not quite disconcerting, more forlorn perhaps. I still like it; it offers a different interpretation to that of both Boult and Previn.
The tone of the final movement is far more upbeat, assertive and vociferous. I particularly like the voice of the brass here. The movement concludes with an air of yearning that is enhanced by both the woodwinds and strings.

I find this to be a lyrical version but with the added sentiment of yearning and poignancy prominent throughout. I find it to be a somewhat brooding and contemplative affair overall but I do like it.

Totally agree, like it very much, but find both the Fourth and Sixth in this coupling the more special recordings. Agree with Jeffrey both are among the very best. Still a highly recommended set as a whole, perhaps the best introduction into RVW symphonies one can get.

[aligreto]

Totally agree, like it very much, but find both the Fourth and Sixth in this coupling the more special recordings. Agree with Jeffrey both are among the very best. Still a highly recommended set as a whole, perhaps the best introduction into RVW symphonies one can get.

Cheers, Christo. I do not have a great exposure to or understanding of the music of RWV and this set was recommended to me by vandermolen. I am delighted that I have purchased it and now I too offer it as a recommendation.

[vandermolen]

I'm delighted that the Berglund/Gibson set has been a success and agree with Christo that it would be a great introduction to VW's music. One of the very positive things about the forum is introducing others to new recordings or pieces which they then enjoy. I would probably never have discovered Bax's magnificent Piano Quintet, for example, without the recommendations of others (Symphonic Addict, now sadly disappeared, and Kyle, happily still here). HMV used to have a fine early 'own label' CD series which was more than 'popular classics' and I first came across the Gibson VW Symphony No.5 performance on one of their releases. I also liked their Dilkes/Barbirolli/Bax/Ireland/Moeran release. I've also posted the original EMI CD release of Berglund's VW's 4th Symphony which was a fabulous CD also featuring Silvestri's magnificent 'Tallis Fantasia'. Great stormy cover image as well (which I much prefer to the image of all those wasps!):

[Irons]

I'm delighted that the Berglund/Gibson set has been a success and agree with Christo that it would be a great introduction to VW's music. One of the very positive things about the forum is introducing others to new recordings or pieces which they then enjoy. I would probably never have discovered Bax's magnificent Piano Quintet, for example, without the recommendations of others (Symphonic Addict, now sadly disappeared, and Kyle, happily still here). HMV used to have a fine early 'own label' CD series which was more than 'popular classics' and I first came across the Gibson VW Symphony No.5 performance on one of their releases. I also liked their Dilkes/Barbirolli/Bax/Ireland/Moeran release. I've also posted the original EMI CD release of Berglund's VW's 4th Symphony which was a fabulous CD also featuring Silvestri's magnificent 'Tallis Fantasia'. Great stormy cover image as well (which I much prefer to the image of all those wasps!):

Worth mentioning to Aligreto that both Berglund's 4th & 6th are available on LP. The 6th is a cracking performance, one of the best.

[aligreto]

Worth mentioning to Aligreto that both Berglund's 4th & 6th are available on LP. The 6th is a cracking performance, one of the best.

Thank you for that.

[vandermolen]

Worth mentioning to Aligreto that both Berglund's 4th & 6th are available on LP. The 6th is a cracking performance, one of the best.

Definitely. I bought the original LP release. I think that it was the first LP I bought of VW's 6th Symphony, other than Boult's two earlier releases.

Berglund's fine two performances also feature in his Icon box set, along with the Oboe Concerto and the Lark Ascending. That box also restored Beglund's excellent Bournemoth SO version of Nielsen's 5th Symphony (first CD release) and his excellent Shostakovich recordings as well. In the box set Berglund's recording of VW's Symphony No.6 is coupled with Bliss's 'Miracle in the Gorbals' - two dark and stormy works which I think go rather well together:

[Roasted Swan]

Definitely. I bought the original LP release. I think that it was the first LP I bought of VW's 6th Symphony, other than Boult's two earlier releases.

Berglund's fine two performances also feature in his Icon box set, along with the Oboe Concerto and the Lark Ascending. That box also restored Beglund's excellent Bournemoth SO version of Nielsen's 5th Symphony (first CD release) and his excellent Shostakovich recordings as well. In the box set Berglund's recording of VW's Symphony No.6 is coupled with Bliss's 'Miracle in the Gorbals' - two dark and stormy works which I think go rather well together:

I second Vandermolen's recommendation of the Berglund/Icons box.  Exceptional performances throughout - as well as those mentioned before I especially rate his DSCH No.10.  Back in the days of LP's I remember his No.7 being (deservedly) well received but No.10 is very fine too.  My only sorrow was that this box includes his Helsinki/Kullervo and I think the Bournemouth 'original' is better.  Miracle in the Gorbals is a great piece - one of those "forgotten" British ballets that we will probably never ever see on stage again (I'd love to see RVW's Job danced!).

[vandermolen]

I second Vandermolen's recommendation of the Berglund/Icons box.  Exceptional performances throughout - as well as those mentioned before I especially rate his DSCH No.10.  Back in the days of LP's I remember his No.7 being (deservedly) well received but No.10 is very fine too.  My only sorrow was that this box includes his Helsinki/Kullervo and I think the Bournemouth 'original' is better.  Miracle in the Gorbals is a great piece - one of those "forgotten" British ballets that we will probably never ever see on stage again (I'd love to see RVW's Job danced!).

I agree with you RS about the Bournemouth Kullervo being better than the Helsinki one. Another favourite is Berglund's Bournemouth recording of Shostakovich's Symphony 11 'The Year 1905'. I remember that the double LP set had a very shiny mirror-like cover. Unfortunately it was stolen with various other LPs out of my car many years ago  .
In a way I'm surprised that Berglund never recorded Vaighan Williams's 5th Symphony as it's the most Sibelian of the lot and dedicated to the Finnish composer.

[Brian]

I've surely missed this discussion since the disc is a few years old, but has anyone heard the Dutton CD purporting to be a "new edition" of the Fifth Symphony, correcting various errors and markings which previous editions got wrong because of RVW's bad handwriting?

[vandermolen]

I've surely missed this discussion since the disc is a few years old, but has anyone heard the Dutton CD purporting to be a "new edition" of the Fifth Symphony, correcting various errors and markings which previous editions got wrong because of RVW's bad handwriting?

Yes, indeed, although I have to say that I didn't notice anything different to other recordings.

[vandermolen]

Good review of the new Brabbins CD of symphonies 3 and 4 in the Sunday Times today.

'These fine performances let one take the measure of VW's greatness; the brief, choral-orchestral Sarabande Helen is an attractive filler.'

So, predictably, my nerve has gone and I've ordered the CD.




The cover image reminds me of the Pierre Boulez VW April Fool's Day spoof of some years ago:

[calyptorhynchus]

Talk of Boulez hoax cover reminds me that way back (say around 1985) I found a recording of the Fantasia on a Theme of Thomas Tallis by Karajan in a record shop. It seemed so bizarre, but I didn't have the money to splash out on possibly disasterous recordings. Has anyone heard this recording, and is it notably bad?

[vandermolen]

Talk of Boulez hoax cover reminds me that way back (say around 1985) I found a recording of the Fantasia on a Theme of Thomas Tallis by Karajan in a record shop. It seemed so bizarre, but I didn't have the money to splash out on possibly disasterous recordings. Has anyone heard this recording, and is it notably bad?

I think I've got it somewhere and recall it as being a solid enough performance. Amazingly he recorded Walton's First Symphony.