Guillaume Dufay

[Mandryka]

    

I must say I find all three of these recordings of motets and songs really attractive.


There's a review on Amazon.co.uk where someone complains that the phrasing is graceless, but IMO the phrasing is one of the main strengths: they make the music sound like it's made of meaningful components.

The instrumental pars are fabulous, like a shimmering glittering web around the voices, a really beautiful filigree. True, sometimes it sounds a bit like a trumpet concerto, but not to the extent of actually obscuring the polyphony. We're talking about very early music with Dufay, and even from the point of view of historical performance preparation it's not obvious that the voices would have been as equal as in a Bach fugue! At least, as far as I know.

Tempos seem really ideal to me. Too much focus on moving the music forward makes for a glib reading, too little for a lifeless one, and they avoid both pitfalls expertly.

And the general tone of them is rapt, prayerful and room-sized. Possibly a large room in a place, but not a theatre or a cathedral. The overall pitch is not too low, I hate it when singing is dominated by low voices. Also, you have a sense of individual singers.

My only complaint is that they tend to obscure dissonant clashes in the voices by flattening. But this may be an unjustified objection. I don't know what it would sound like with a radically different approach to the cross relations, one which was more liberal about embracing clashes.

I much prefer what they do to Huelgas Ensemble in the same music, for all the reasons above, which make them like Nevel's polar opposite almost.

Basically these are three of my favourite Dufay  recordings.

[San Antone]

   

I must say I find both these recordings of motets really attractive.

I haven't heard either of these recordings.  But in other recordings by Cantica Symphonia I did not find the added instruments to my liking.  I much prefer vocal polyphony to be just that.

[Mandryka]

I haven't heard either of these recordings.  But in other recordings by Cantica Symphonia I did not find the added instruments to my liking.  I much prefer vocal polyphony to be just that.

Yes well I can go both ways.

[NJ Joe]

I'd just like to say I've read through this thread several times, and have been listening to samples of the recommended recordings and really been enjoying them.  The only Renaissance composer I'm even vaguely familiar with is Tallis, but lately I find myself drawn more and more to music of the Medieval and Renaissance periods (I've been listening to a weekly radio show that features Medieval, Renaissance, and Baroque music). I can see how one can become hooked on this music. Thanks for the thread, the discussion, and the recommendations!

[San Antone]

I wish the thread were in the Composer Discussion section, though.

EDIT: Gosh.  That was fast.



Thanks!

[San Antone]

Found this in my collection - an excellent recording I forgot I had.

Dufay and the Court of Savoy
Andrew Kirkman and the Binchois Consort

[Ken B]

I haven't heard either of these recordings.  But in other recordings by Cantica Symphonia I did not find the added instruments to my liking.  I much prefer vocal polyphony to be just that.

Don't know those recordings, but in general and on principle +1
I have heard some recordings with sackbuts pleasing, but the best result is always from just voices.

[Ken B]

I'd just like to say I've read through this thread several times, and have been listening to samples of the recommended recordings and really been enjoying them.  The only Renaissance composer I'm even vaguely familiar with is Tallis, but lately I find myself drawn more and more to music of the Medieval and Renaissance periods (I've been listening to a weekly radio show that features Medieval, Renaissance, and Baroque music). I can see how one can become hooked on this music. Thanks for the thread, the discussion, and the recommendations!

There's a whole world of stuff, and you won't go wrong with most recordings of the usual suspects as long as you choose specialist ensembles (ie NOT the big English cathedral choirs who should be avoided in this repertoire) but I want to especially mention the Fayrfax masses recorded by Andrew Carwood.

[ComposerOfAvantGarde]

Recently been reading stuff about Dufay's works. What I find particularly interesting is his appropriation and fusion of aspects from French and Italian styles of composition.

Can anyone recommend good ensembles which have performed his secular works?

[Ken B]

Recently been reading stuff about Dufay's works. What I find particularly interesting is his appropriation and fusion of aspects from French and Italian styles of composition.

Can anyone recommend good ensembles which have performed his secular works?

Cannot recall the group but the Florilegium set is excellent. Davies. 

[San Antone]

Recently been reading stuff about Dufay's works. What I find particularly interesting is his appropriation and fusion of aspects from French and Italian styles of composition.

Can anyone recommend good ensembles which have performed his secular works?

There isn't much, it fits on one CD.  I have a couple, this one is okay, but a bit dated:



Since I am mainly interested in the sacred music, I haven't kept up with any newer groups doing the chansons - but there must be something out there.

[Ken B]

There isn't much, it fits on one CD.  I have a couple, this one is okay, but a bit dated:



Since I am mainly interested in the sacred music, I haven't kept up with any newer groups doing the chansons - but there must be something out there.

That's the one. I think there is in fact another disc of non-liturgical stuff by the same group. I think the same group did a larger Ockeghem secular set, which is also fine. Same label anyway.

[ComposerOfAvantGarde]

Thanks very much for your recommendations

[Mandryka]

(ie NOT the big English cathedral choirs who should be avoided in this repertoire)

Sommerely with Oxford Camerata recorded Miss L'Homme Armé, and it is IMO the most deep and satisfying recording of the mass on record, maybe the best recording of any Dufay mass, apart from the one Rebecca Stewart made. Sommerly's way of performing the credo - which is the high point of the mass and the high point of Dufay's mass music IMO - is extraordinarily spiritual, not least because of his daring and imaginative choice of tempo.

[Mandryka]

Re the motets and instruments, I think (I'm not sure) that there are so many more recordings with instruments than without that it's a bit presumptuous to call them "vocal" - I have a feeling that you'll be very limited in the motets you can hear if you avoid instruments completely.

[Mandryka]

Recently been reading stuff about Dufay's works. What I find particularly interesting is his appropriation and fusion of aspects from French and Italian styles of composition.

Can anyone recommend good ensembles which have performed his secular works?

Ensemble Alta Musica, Ensemble Unicorn,  Ensemble Tetraktys, La Rerverdie, Diabolus in Musica, Studio der Frühen Musik. You may also enjoy Ambrose Field's constructions with John Potter  (I do)

[ComposerOfAvantGarde]

Ensemble Alta Musica, Ensemble Unicorn,  Ensemble Tetraktys, La Rerverdie, Diabolus in Musica, Studio der Frühen Musik. You may also enjoy Ambrose Field's constructions with John Potter  (I do)

Thanks a lot for this. I'll keep a note..........

So far I have really been enjoying his liturgical works though. Need to explore some of the secular stuff

[Ken B]

Sommerely with Oxford Camerata recorded Miss L'Homme Armé, and it is IMO the most deep and satisfying recording of the mass on record, maybe the best recording of any Dufay mass, apart from the one Rebecca Stewart made. Sommerly's way of performing the credo - which is the high point of the mass and the high point of Dufay's mass music IMO - is extraordinarily spiritual, not least because of his daring and imaginative choice of tempo.

It is very fine. But they are a specialist ensemble. They are NOT the choir of Queens' College Oxford or King's College Cambridge, much less a large cathedral choir. It's a small, specialist group of about a dozen singers who focus on polyphony.

[San Antone]

Found this on my shelves; nice.



Good singing and tasteful instrumental accompaniment.

[Mandryka]

Found this in my collection - an excellent recording I forgot I had.

Dufay and the Court of Savoy
Andrew Kirkman and the Binchois Consort

It's a sweet and harmonious performance of the Mass Sine Nomine, sung no doubt by Botticelli putti.

For a contrasting view of how to make sense of Dufay, you could try Clemencic's  deliberately archaic, angular, vigorous, discordant interpretation on Harmonia Mundi, sung no doubt by angels with dirty faces.

(Listening to it I wondered whether the essential thing about Oxbridge singing is its disembodiedness, its flight from physical theatre. Clemencic has blood and guts, you know.)