Schoenberg's Sheen

[Mandryka]

I've had Chen Pi-Hsien playing Schoenberg in my heavy rotation, boy is she good! It's all great, but op. 25 in particular is superb. This is my first time hearing his earliest piano music as well and I enjoyed it. Any suggestions for other discs that contain this music? I see Presto has this:

I have zero interest in those early pieces myself so this must not be taken as any sort of recommendation, but I do have them on record from Herbert Henk.

[T. D.]

I've had Chen Pi-Hsien playing Schoenberg in my heavy rotation, boy is she good! It's all great, but op. 25 in particular is superb. This is my first time hearing his earliest piano music as well and I enjoyed it....

Can't suggest alternatives, but OTOH can't resist butting in to say that I love that Chen disc.

[vers la flamme]

Enjoying some Schoenberg lately: Pierrot Lunaire, Verklärte Nacht, Erwartung, the first Chamber Symphony, the Serenade, etc. I'm for the most part trying to steer clear of the 12-tone music (for now) and focus on the great earlier stuff. I took a long break from his music but it feels good to be getting back into it in a big way.

There are some major omissions from my library that I'd like some help with. I don't have Pelleas, who has made a good one? I've been looking at the Karajan 3CD which also includes the Variations, the orchestral Verklärte, and some Berg and Webern. I don't know of any others. Also, I don't have a complete string quartets set. What are some good ones? Most of them are OOP and prohibitively expensive. I'm probably going to pull the trigger on the Asasello Quartett set on Genuin which sounds good and is still in print and affordable, but I'm open to alternative suggestions, if anyone has any.

[amw]

Ardittis or Diotimas are first choices in the quartets. Asasello is probably a decent third choice though. Schoenberg Quartet (Chandos) is not as much to my taste but does have some worthwhile extras.

[MusicTurner]

Enjoying some Schoenberg lately: Pierrot Lunaire, Verklärte Nacht, Erwartung, the first Chamber Symphony, the Serenade, etc. I'm for the most part trying to steer clear of the 12-tone music (for now) and focus on the great earlier stuff. I took a long break from his music but it feels good to be getting back into it in a big way.

There are some major omissions from my library that I'd like some help with. I don't have Pelleas, who has made a good one? I've been looking at the Karajan 3CD which also includes the Variations, the orchestral Verklärte, and some Berg and Webern. I don't know of any others. Also, I don't have a complete string quartets set. What are some good ones? Most of them are OOP and prohibitively expensive. I'm probably going to pull the trigger on the Asasello Quartett set on Genuin which sounds good and is still in print and affordable, but I'm open to alternative suggestions, if anyone has any.

Yes, I guess these are some of the most widely available ones:

- Boulez/Sony box https://www.discogs.com/Arnold-Schoenberg-Pierre-Boulez-Pierre-Boulez-conducts-Schoenberg/release/5798652
- Karajan/DG, various boxes including https://www.discogs.com/Sch%C3%B6nberg-Berg-Webern-Herbert-von-Karajan-Berliner-Philharmoniker-Sch%C3%B6nberg-Berg-Webern/release/8803917
- Gielen Edition/SWR https://www.gielen-edition.de/deutsch/die-edition/volume-8-neue-wiener-schule/

I've got all of them.

(( Also, there's a Sinopoli Neue Wiener Schule box not containing the works you mention https://www.discogs.com/Berg-Schoenberg-Webern-Staatskapelle-Dresden-Giuseppe-Sinopoli-Schoenberg-Berg-Webern/release/1995801 ))

The Karajan Neue Wiener set is good. Better than say Boulez/Sony, who's less expressive and warm, IMHO. But the content of the boxes vary. As for "Pelleas ...", not in the Boulez/Sony box, I've also got Scherchen, Rozhdestvensky, Barbirolli, Swarowsky and an obscure, poor Zukovsky recording (because of accompanying repertoire), plus the Gielens box. Among which Gielen could be a choice too. Gielen's Kammersinfonien are the ones that gave the works appeal for me, adding more late-romantic warmth to the pieces IMHO. I generally find that Swarowsky focuses a lot on the 'Now' in his recordings, less on architecture; Scherchen has bad sound; Rozhdestvensky is rare, and so is Barbirolli. But I can't give detailed reviews of all these recordings; these are just my general impressions.

[Mandryka]

Enjoying some Schoenberg lately: Pierrot Lunaire, Verklärte Nacht, Erwartung, the first Chamber Symphony, the Serenade, etc. I'm for the most part trying to steer clear of the 12-tone music (for now) and focus on the great earlier stuff. I took a long break from his music but it feels good to be getting back into it in a big way.

There are some major omissions from my library that I'd like some help with. I don't have Pelleas, who has made a good one? I've been looking at the Karajan 3CD which also includes the Variations, the orchestral Verklärte, and some Berg and Webern. I don't know of any others. Also, I don't have a complete string quartets set. What are some good ones? Most of them are OOP and prohibitively expensive. I'm probably going to pull the trigger on the Asasello Quartett set on Genuin which sounds good and is still in print and affordable, but I'm open to alternative suggestions, if anyone has any.

Leipzig Quartet.

[krummholz]

I have the LaSalle Quartets, and like them, but they are certainly not the final word (as if any could be). I cannot name the ensemble right now, but I have heard the last movement of the 2nd Quartet taken considerably more slowly than the LaSalles do, and I prefer the slower tempo. Overall the sound and the performances are quite good though.

[T. D.]

Quartets: Diotimas have been widely recommended, but not easy to find.
The one quartet I heard by Arditti was good.
I went with the LaSalle because of historical appeal and packaging (6 disc box) with Berg, Webern and Zemlinsky. I like it but also wouldn't claim it's the last word. DG seem to have licensed the LaSalle rights to Brilliant, who reissued the set in twofers.

[Cato]

Enjoying some Schoenberg lately: Pierrot Lunaire, Verklärte Nacht, Erwartung, the first Chamber Symphony, the Serenade, etc. I'm for the most part trying to steer clear of the 12-tone music (for now) and focus on the great earlier stuff. I took a long break from his music but it feels good to be getting back into it in a big way.

There are some major omissions from my library that I'd like some help with. I don't have Pelleas, who has made a good one?

I can recommend these very highly:



Available on DGG:

https://www.youtube.com/v/xQge0sHOS1Y

[Karl Henning]

Nice.

[Scion7]

I can recommend these very highly:

Oh, yes - that Chandos is one perfect set.  Even the artwork is superb. 
I've traveled all over with that one in the CD player very often.

[Symphonic Addict]

I must say this is a super photo. I wonder what Einstein thought about Schoenberg's music.

[Jo498]

Einstein was not tall, so Schoenberg and especially Godowsky apparently were quite short. And Einstein's bowtie is both the wrong color and awry but altogether he seems less unkempt than in his latest years after the war.

[DaveF]

Quartets: Diotimas have been widely recommended, but not easy to find.
The one quartet I heard by Arditti was good.
I went with the LaSalle because of historical appeal and packaging (6 disc box) with Berg, Webern and Zemlinsky. I like it but also wouldn't claim it's the last word. DG seem to have licensed the LaSalle rights to Brilliant, who reissued the set in twofers.

If you like downloads, Qobuz have the Diotima set at a very reasonable price: https://www.qobuz.com/gb-en/album/schonberg-berg-webern-complete-string-quartet-works-quatuor-diotima/0822189028466

And yes, it's excellent

[Mirror Image]

Quartets: Diotimas have been widely recommended, but not easy to find.
The one quartet I heard by Arditti was good.
I went with the LaSalle because of historical appeal and packaging (6 disc box) with Berg, Webern and Zemlinsky. I like it but also wouldn't claim it's the last word. DG seem to have licensed the LaSalle rights to Brilliant, who reissued the set in twofers.

I'd go with the Schoenberg Quartet's cycle on Chandos. My reference for all these works.

[staxomega]

I had about the opposite reaction to Schoenberg Quartet's recordings, to me this cycle was smoothed over and congenial. Lacking the pointed angularity that is needed in this music that you get in Arditti Quartet who are my reference for the four string quartets.

Lasalle for for a more "historical" interpretation also really understood this music.

Unfortunately there doesn't seem to be much Arditti on Youtube but I think this opening of Op. 37 is a nice illustration of IMHO how much better they are than Schoenberg Quartet.

https://www.youtube.com/v/9I7AqAnxLVo

To bring this back to a more positive note, Die Jakobsleiter has been back in my heavy rotation after getting a new performance of it, Kazuyoshi Akiyama with Tokyo Symphony Orchestra.

[Mirror Image]

I had about the opposite reaction to Schoenberg Quartet's recordings, to me this cycle was smoothed over and congenial. Lacking the pointed angularity that is needed in this music that you get in Arditti Quartet who are my reference for the four string quartets.

Lasalle for for a more "historical" interpretation also really understood this music.

Unfortunately there doesn't seem to be much Arditti on Youtube but I think this opening of Op. 37 is a nice illustration of IMHO how much better they are than Schoenberg Quartet.

https://www.youtube.com/v/9I7AqAnxLVo

To bring this back to a more positive note, Die Jakobsleiter has been back in my heavy rotation after getting a new performance of it, Kazuyoshi Akiyama with Tokyo Symphony Orchestra.

Well, the reality is you actually don't know what the music 'needs' unless you've performed the music yourself, so it's all personal preference at this juncture. I don't find the Arditti 'better', but I do like their performances. Both quartets perform at a high musical standard regardless of our preference.

[Mandryka]

I just listened to the Kolisch quartet play the third quartet. I don't think they're specially angular and pointed.

Maybe that approach has its origin in America - Juilliard.

[Karl Henning]

I just listened to the Kolisch quartet play the third quartet. I don't think they're specially angular and pointed.

Maybe that approach has its origin in America - Juilliard.

Perhaps. These quartets, like all great music, speak via a variety of interpretations, which illuminate different aspects inherent in the score.

[staxomega]

Well, the reality is you actually don't know what the music 'needs' unless you've performed the music yourself, so it's all personal preference at this juncture. I don't find the Arditti 'better', but I do like their performances. Both quartets perform at a high musical standard regardless of our preference.

Couldn't disagree strongly enough that one needs to perform it to have that opinion. Maybe I could agree that one need be able to read a score to have that opinion. After you've listened to enough of a composer's music, the period in which it was composed, when in his career it was composed and what he/she has written on their music you can get a very good idea what a good interpretation is and what a poor one is.

Otherwise everything just turns into this convivial, "it's all wonderful to you!"

We have to have some metrics by what great music and interpretation is. I'm surprised this is news to you given the rather broad blanket statements you make on dismissing performances.