Composers who are entering the pantheon/standard repertoire

[Karl Henning]

A strange question. What is this pantheon and who is already in it? I'll bet we can't agree on that. I mean, what are entrance criteria? As a result, we'll never agree on the rest.

Bet you're right!

[kyjo]

Oh dear! Why does every thread I start have to bring about a debate on the meaning of a word!

[Mirror Image]

I don't know about "entering the pantheon" but I've noticed some upticks.

Among more recent composers, Lutoslawski, Ligeti, Messiaen and Schnittke seem to be holding steady, and even increasing their performances. Ligeti's piano etudes in particular are almost standard rep now.

Martinu is getting played more, and recorded more too, than he was only a couple of decades ago.

Also, this may just be a regional thing, but I've noticed that British composers are getting a lot more exposure in the US than they used to. (I'm hearing Walton Sym. #1 this Saturday in fact.)

Schnittke, Lutoslawski, and Ligeti are great choices. I don't think I agree with you about the British composers. I mean sure you'll get Holst, RVW, or Elgar on a concert program, but not much else, but hearing Walton's 1st would be great and is definitely a step in the right direction.

[Mirror Image]

Oh dear! Why does every thread I start have to bring about a debate on the meaning of a word!

You're just a controversial guy I guess, Kyle.

[Karl Henning]

Maybe it's like the Rock 'n' Roll Hall of Fame: wait long enough, and everybody will be nominated!

[kyjo]

You're just a controversial guy I guess, Kyle.

I don't try to be!

[Mirror Image]

I don't try to be!

I wish I could say the same for myself.

[Mirror Image]

Do you guys agree with me about Szymanowski?

Yep, I certainly agree about Szymanowski. It seems he's finally getting the 'nod' from the classical music establishment. It's about damn time! Hopefully, I'll be able to see at least one work of Szymanowski's music performed.

[Mirror Image]

I would like to see Weinberg enter at least some of the regular concert repertoire. I think if an audience heard a work like Cello Concerto or even Symphony No. 5, many people may come away wanting to hear more. I certainly do think Weinberg deserves concert repertoire status.

[springrite]

You're just a controversial guy I guess, Kyle.

You both.

Or should I just say you, yes.

[some guy]

A strange question.

Thanks, mc. I didn't want to have to be the one to say it.

But now that you've broken the ice....

Kyjo, I agree that you are not controversial. You do take things for granted that not everyone else does, however. Things that many people take for granted, true. Perhaps most. Things that shouldn't be taken for granted, however. Things that should be questioned. Things that should not be blindly accepted.

That's why it looks like you're being controversial. Your posts cause some consternation among those of us who do not accept the things you just take for granted. So there's often a lot of activity in that regard. A lot of questioning of your premises and such.

I wouldn't call that controversial, either, though.

[Karl Henning]

Anyway, I don't call it controversy, I call it discussion. An activity which, as a rule, I find more fulfilling than cheerleading

[DavidW]

Whoever said Ligeti and Carter, I agree with.  I think they are the Brahms and Wagner for our time, and will be part of the canon.

[North Star]

Ligeti, Carter, Dutilleux, Schnittke, Lutoslawski, Hartmann, and Villa-Lobos should definitely be in the Pandemonium Pantheon.

[Sean]

Well at least you folks are trying to keep the repertory, as I'd call it, in mind. Last time I checked it was sinking from view under the likes of the everything-by-everyone-and-his-dog-is-equal postmodern Amazon or CD store.

[North Star]

Looks like this thread could be combined with the thread on "your favorite 20th century composers" with no damage to continuity.

Well it would be strange if there wasn't any correlation, especially in group with a reasonable number of people.

Would be cool if Messiaen, the spectralists, and Xenakis were in the standard repertoire. And Varèse. And post-Sacre Stravinsky.

[not edward]

Without having any figures to support it, my guess would be that Martinu and Ligeti are the most obvious examples. There seems to have been a great increase in the number of Martinu performances outside of the Czech republic, while Ligeti's perceived stature just seems to keep growing. Amongst performers under 50 or so, it's probably easier to name those who don't play the piano etudes or the violin concerto than those who do.

It's rather sad that in his later years Ligeti was convinced that once he died, interest in his music would rapidly fade away.

[Archaic Torso of Apollo]

It's rather sad that in his later years Ligeti was convinced that once he died, interest in his music would rapidly fade away.

Apparently Brahms thought the same way, so he's in good company.

Last time I checked it was sinking from view under the likes of the everything-by-everyone-and-his-dog-is-equal postmodern Amazon or CD store.

What is this sentence even supposed to mean?

[CRCulver]

Concert programming is so different from country to country these days that it no longer makes sense to speak of one "standard repertoire". In Helsinki, there's been much more Schoenberg on offer than Brahms in recent years, but American concertgoers would not see Schoenberg as a standard.

Among more recent composers ... Schnittke ... seems to be holding steady, and even increasing their performances.

Is this really the case? It seems to me (and I've heard the same complaint from those who have followed Schnittke's music from his first exposure in the West) that Schnittke's popularity fell drastically after his death. It was easier to attract audiences to his music when his music could be tied into the larger Cold War polemics ("look at this rebellious composer from the oppressive USSR!"). The major labels were regularly releasing CDs of his works and major US and UK ensembles were taking up even his more challenging works. That's all gone now, and what little support remains for him tends to be his most lightweight pieces like Moz-Art à la Haydn or (K)ein Sommernachtstraum.

[Mirror Image]

Is this really the case? It seems to me (and I've heard the same complaint from those who have followed Schnittke's music from his first exposure in the West) that Schnittke's popularity fell drastically after his death. It was easier to attract audiences to his music when his music could be tied into the larger Cold War polemics ("look at this rebellious composer from the oppressive USSR!"). The major labels were regularly releasing CDs of his works and major US and UK ensembles were taking up even his more challenging works. That's all gone now, and what little support remains for him tends to be his most lightweight pieces like Moz-Art à la Haydn or (K)ein Sommernachtstraum.

A fair point for sure, CRCulver. If I'm still around, it will be interesting to see what happens to Schnittke's legacy 20-30 years from now. Well he died in 1998 and in 2008 nothing happened, let's see if 2018 holds anything for dear old Alfred.