Fortepiano or pianoforte?

[Brian]

I say fortepiano, but just read Pride and Prejudice, and everyone calls it a pianoforte, so I think I'm completely wrong.

[Wakefield]

Conventionally, "fortepiano" is often used in reference to keyboards built in the XVIII Century. "Pianoforte" is used for the (still) early pianos built in the XIX Century.

As a curiosity, Italians still refers the piano as "pianoforte".

[amw]

Hammerflügel!

[Wakefield]

Hammerflügel!

Hammerflügel or hammerklavier? 

[Gurn Blanston]

Conventionally, "fortepiano" is often used in reference to keyboards built in the XVIII Century. "Pianoforte" is used for the (still) early pianos built in the XIX Century.

As a curiosity, Italians still refers the piano as "pianoforte".

I completely agree.

[springrite]

The Chinese word for piano is "steel (stringed) instrument". So it only refers to the modern one. So the fortepiano is called "ancient (or antique) piano".

[Wakefield]

The Chinese word for piano is "steel (stringed) instrument". So it only refers to the modern one. So the fortepiano is called "ancient (or antique) piano".

Google shows this translation:

钢琴

Nice. 

[springrite]

FYI, harpsichords, etc. are "feather keyboard instruments".

[SonicMan46]

Boy, this sounds familiar - 

In my mind as a simplification, the early pianos (let's call them fortepianos) were constructed mainly w/ 'wood frames' and thinner strings not strung tightly; by the early to mid-19th century, single piece metal frames could be produced allowing more strongly strung strings - thus my major distinction in using these terms; NOW, that has little to do w/ the keyboard mechanisms that involved in tangent w/ this change in the piano frames; SO, how are the strings strung, i.e. on wood or one-piece metal frames - Dave

[springrite]

fortepiano.

The modern piano can in fact still be called pianoforte.

No?

[Wakefield]

FYI, harpsichords, etc. are "feather keyboard instruments".

This looks as a very historically informed name.

[Gurn Blanston]

Boy, this sounds familiar - 

In my mind as a simplification, the early pianos (let's call them fortepianos) were constructed mainly w/ 'wood frames' and thinner strings not strung tightly; by the early to mid-19th century, single piece metal frames could be produced allowing more strongly strung strings - thus my major distinction in using these terms; NOW, that has little to do w/ the keyboard mechanisms that involved in tangent w/ this change in the piano frames; SO, how are the strings strung, i.e. on wood or one-piece metal frames - Dave

Dave,
I would say that the change to an iron frame marks the time when you would call that instrument a piano. Generally, at least among period instrument geeks, the post-1800 instrument where the compass began to approach the modern number, and the notes were triple strung throughout, even though the frame was still wooden, is called a pianoforte. Beethoven's Graf is a pianoforte, for example. Two or three people could easily haul Mozart's fortepiano up 5 flights of stairs returning from a concert. Beethoven's pianoforte stayed home!!

fortepiano.

The modern piano can in fact still be called pianoforte.

No?

Well, not in English. At least, no one does. It would sound very archaic and also tend to be attached to a different instrument (see above). However, in Italian and possibly other language, the correct name of pianoforte. Has been since Cristofori, AFAIK.

[Gurn Blanston]

This looks as a very historically informed name.

Yes, isn't it? If it translated as 'quilled' instead of 'feathered', it would be even more so! 

[Wakefield]

Well, not in English. At least, no one does. It would sound very archaic and also tend to be attached to a different instrument (see above). However, in Italian and possibly other language, the correct name of pianoforte. Has been since Cristofori, AFAIK.

Not in Spanish either. The modern piano is simply called "piano", as in English.

[SonicMan46]

Dave,
I would say that the change to an iron frame marks the time when you would call that instrument a piano. Generally, at least among period instrument geeks, the post-1800 instrument where the compass began to approach the modern number, and the notes were triple strung throughout, even though the frame was still wooden, is called a pianoforte. Beethoven's Graf is a pianoforte, for example. Two or three people could easily haul Mozart's fortepiano up 5 flights of stairs returning from a concert. Beethoven's pianoforte stayed home!!

Hi Gurn - yes, I know the complexities of these changes, especially in the early 19th century - but I tend to be a 'lumper' rather than a 'splitter', so trying to find a simple bridge was my suggestion - of course, this simplification of mine will not be accepted my many; however, to throw in an 'intermediary' (i.e. pianoforte) does not fit well in my universe -    Bottom line, to me the 'modern' piano is based on a single piece cast iron frame.  But hey, so many changes in-between!  Dave