Bach on the piano

[Florestan]

It is a transcription

Would it be possible to settle, once and for all, the matter of transcription and arrangement? Which one is which?

The way I see it, transcription applies only from one solo instrument to another: say, a piano piece transcribed for solo violin or viceversa, or a concerto for flute and orchestra transcribed for oboe and orchestra. Arrangement applies for a piece in which the original instrumentation is altered not only in kind but also in number: a piano piece arranged for violin and piano (Ysaye-Chopin), a symphony arranged for piano duet (Liszt-Beethoven), an operatic aria arranged for piano (Thalberg-|Bellini).

What say you?

[Dry Brett Kavanaugh]

It is a transcription, like Busoni made transcriptions. Or it's an arrangement, like Finnissy made arrangements. Take this by Gershwin

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IfpzUTjBM88&ab_channel=PhillipPrimrose

and this arrangement by Michael Finnissy

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QHJP_DoaCoA&ab_channel=TheClassicalFun

I think Jazz people just call them renditions, and there are no 'intellectual' people who question technicality/accuracy of the term.

Slightly related topics, but does anybody still improvise in Baroque/Bach music in live/recordings today? Do you comrades like it? I imagine improvisations could be well received even today, but a modification of compositions otherwise.

[Mandryka]

The big problem about the (very interesting) Rodrigues is the piano sound, which is just dead, lifeless. She gets away with it in that prelude because the counterpoint and rhythms are so full of life they compensate, as it were.

@Dry Brett Kavanaugh -- yes improvisation is a big thing in baroque music today. I haven't come across any which has stuck in my mind as being special, but there's a lot of it. On the other hand, in earlier music, 14th century music for example, I think there are some tremendous improvisations on record.

[Mandryka]

Would it be possible to settle, once and for all, the matter of transcription and arrangement? Which one is which?

The way I see it, transcription applies only from one solo instrument to another: say, a piano piece transcribed for solo violin or viceversa, or a concerto for flute and orchestra transcribed for oboe and orchestra. Arrangement applies for a piece in which the original instrumentation is altered not only in kind but also in number: a piano piece arranged for violin and piano (Ysaye-Chopin), a symphony arranged for piano duet (Liszt-Beethoven), an operatic aria arranged for piano (Thalberg-|Bellini).

What say you?

I just don't think the terms are very well defined, the way people use them in practice is not consistent and in English, use is all that matters -- there is nothing corresponding to the Académie Française (thank goodness!)

[Verena]

It is a transcription, like Busoni made transcriptions. Or it's an arrangement, like Finnissy made arrangements. Take this by Gershwin

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IfpzUTjBM88&ab_channel=PhillipPrimrose

and this arrangement by Michael Finnissy

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QHJP_DoaCoA&ab_channel=TheClassicalFun

Thanks Howard. Arrangement / transcription sounds excellent and captures exactly what's meant.

[Florestan]

Slightly related topics, but does anybody still improvise in Baroque/Bach music in live/recordings today? Do you comrades like it? I imagine improvisations could be well received even today, but a modification of compositions otherwise.

I, for one, would more than welcome any pianist who, instead of playing a famous encore after having played a famous piano concerto, would improvise on themes from the said concerto or, even better, on a theme taken at random from a list of themes suggested before the concert by each and every member of the audience. Now, that would be something else by today's standards, although it would have been common in the first half of the 19th century.

I'm afraid, though, that improvisation in "classical" music is just as lost an art as that of writting letters. 

[premont]

I'm afraid, though, that improvisation in "classical" music is just as lost an art as that of writting letters. 

A lot of organists keep the art of improvising alive today.

[Florestan]

A lot of organists keep the art of improvising alive today.

Kudos for them and bad for me --- the (Greek, misnomer) Orthodox  Christian music is strictly vocal.

[Dry Brett Kavanaugh]

A lot of organists keep the art of improvising alive today.

Wonderful!

[Mandryka]

I  first came across Tianqi Du through his Goldbergs, which I like very much. This WTC/Shostakovich concert recording also sounds very successful to me

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Oxf3-3W9kXQ&ab_channel=DannyDu

[vers la flamme]

Taking recs for something good of a pianist playing Bach.

What I like is David Fray, Glenn Gould, András Schiff, Sviatoslav Richter etc. Though it's been a while since I've heard any of it.

[OrchestralNut]

Taking recs for something good of a pianist playing Bach.

What I like is David Fray, Glenn Gould, András Schiff, Sviatoslav Richter etc. Though it's been a while since I've heard any of it.

I do really enjoy Angela Hewitt for Bach on the piano.

[George]

Taking recs for something good of a pianist playing Bach.

What I like is David Fray, Glenn Gould, András Schiff, Sviatoslav Richter etc. Though it's been a while since I've heard any of it.

[JBS]

I've always liked Perahia's Bach.
Hewitt and Schiff would be my other go-to pianists in Bach.
I love Gould but he's in a category of his own.

[Dry Brett Kavanaugh]

[JBS]

I was going to suggest him, but I thought he was effectively unobtainable. But now that I look I see the individual CDs are available for DL, and Amazon US actually has a copy of the set listed as "new".
https://www.amazon.com/J-S-Bach-Complete-Keyboard/dp/B0053HBKZO/

[Todd]

Janssen's recordings are apparently available directly from his label: https://www.voidclassics.com/webshop/product-categorie/bach-cycle/