Bruckner's 6th Symphony - Blind Comparison

Started by TheGSMoeller, May 02, 2014, 05:05:52 AM

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Sergeant Rock

Quote from: TheGSMoeller on September 08, 2014, 04:48:00 AM
Also, I did purchase several of these recordings just for the comparison, so at the end I may put some up for a disc swap if anyone is interested. Even though I love this piece, I think I could live with a little less than 22 recordings.

I have 20...seems about right  ;)

Sarge
the phone rings and somebody says,
"hey, they made a movie about
Mahler, you ought to go see it.
he was as f*cked-up as you are."
                               --Charles Bukowski, "Mahler"

Sergeant Rock

Quote from: Brian on September 08, 2014, 08:57:27 AMA was Cato's "Group of Death" and all four voters actually liked Nagano, Neal and Sarge in particular.

I did like it. I had to almost invent something to dislike about it, in both rounds. I called it "perfection" in the first round, but still placed it fourth  :o  And yes, the A group in the second round was brutal. I even came to like the old Jochum in the end. I suppose the only reason I couldn't score the Nagano higher was its, to my ears, relative emotional reticence.

Sarge
the phone rings and somebody says,
"hey, they made a movie about
Mahler, you ought to go see it.
he was as f*cked-up as you are."
                               --Charles Bukowski, "Mahler"

Brian

#462
Quote from: Sergeant Rock on September 08, 2014, 01:02:25 PM
I did like it. I had to almost invent something to dislike about it, in both rounds. I called it "perfection" in the first round, but still placed it fourth  :o  And yes, the A group in the second round was brutal. I even came to like the old Jochum in the end. I suppose the only reason I couldn't score the Nagano higher was its, to my ears, relative emotional reticence.

Sarge
Which works in context. In the first round, only that artificial sudden diminuendo-crescendo right near the end kept me from awarding a perfect 10/10.

This game IS hard. Conductors really bringing their best. Not like the Berlioz game, where I disliked most all but Martinon, of the finalists. (EDIT)

Brahmsian

Well, I feel better knowing that I didn't have a hand in eliminating A4 (Jochum DG).  :(

Brahmsian

I also think I've found an even more polar opposite GMG member than Sarge, when it comes to recordings.

Neal.   :D  Both in the Bruckner 6 and Schubert String Quintet blind comparisons.  ;D

mc ukrneal

Quote from: ChamberNut on September 09, 2014, 05:03:14 AM
I also think I've found an even more polar opposite GMG member than Sarge, when it comes to recordings.

Neal.   :D  Both in the Bruckner 6 and Schubert String Quintet blind comparisons.  ;D
Maybe lately, but usually I am the opposite of Sarge, born out by several blind listenings. But, gasp! Maybe I HAVE been lured over to the dark side but didn't notice it! Those crafty buggers! :)
Be kind to your fellow posters!!

Sergeant Rock

Quote from: mc ukrneal on September 09, 2014, 05:14:17 AM
Maybe lately, but usually I am the opposite of Sarge, born out by several blind listenings. But, gasp! Maybe I HAVE been lured over to the dark side but didn't notice it! Those crafty buggers! :)

Maybe you and I will end up on opposite sides in the next round, thereby bringing, once again, balance to the universe   8)

Sarge
the phone rings and somebody says,
"hey, they made a movie about
Mahler, you ought to go see it.
he was as f*cked-up as you are."
                               --Charles Bukowski, "Mahler"

TheGSMoeller

Look for links to the semi-finals later today! Let's get this thing rolling!  8)

mc ukrneal

Quote from: Sergeant Rock on September 09, 2014, 05:18:23 AM
Maybe you and I will end up on opposite sides in the next round, thereby bringing, once again, balance to the universe   8)

Sarge
Or maybe we have a similar taste in Bruckner, after all I did like the really slow one. We both like the Haitink's Bruckner 9 and we were both similar on the Jochums. Ah, Bruckner has brought balance to the universe indeed. I think we should both have some German white and call it a day! :)
Be kind to your fellow posters!!

Karl Henning

Karl Henning, Ph.D.
Composer & Clarinetist
Boston MA
http://www.karlhenning.com/
[Matisse] was interested neither in fending off opposition,
nor in competing for the favor of wayward friends.
His only competition was with himself. — Françoise Gilot

Ken B

Quote from: karlhenning on September 09, 2014, 06:08:56 AM
Just say yes to Harmony!
Don't let Pierre Boulez know where you live.



Britney Spears either.

>:D

Cato

Quote from: ChamberNut on September 08, 2014, 04:28:28 AM
No!!!!!!  :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'(

No!!!!!!  :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'(

No!!!!!!  :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'(

No!!!!!!  :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'(

Oh well!  I just had to get that out of my system!

On to Round 3!
"Meet Miss Ruth Sherwood, from Columbus, Ohio, the Middle of the Universe!"

- Brian Aherne introducing Rosalind Russell in  My Sister Eileen (1942)

TheGSMoeller


Karl Henning

Quote from: Ken B on September 09, 2014, 08:58:09 AM
Don't let Pierre Boulez know where you live.

I'm not worried;  he's fundamentally lazy.  Being a gadfly is a pretty low-threshold investment.

8)
Karl Henning, Ph.D.
Composer & Clarinetist
Boston MA
http://www.karlhenning.com/
[Matisse] was interested neither in fending off opposition,
nor in competing for the favor of wayward friends.
His only competition was with himself. — Françoise Gilot

mc ukrneal

#474
I had some unexpected time today, so here is Group Y

Y1 - Strings not quite as full as I'd like, and brass blatt a bit when they enter. The sound of the full orchestra is beautiful, but I feel the flow is constantly disrupted, which is driven home by the fluctuating tempo. The quieter sections seem to work a bit better, but I feel this one just misses the mark a bit. There also seem to be some unison issues (the issue is that I lose the rhythm sometimes) in multiple locations. The tempo is sometimes sluggish. The maddening thing about this one was that it hard moments that were 'so right'. It could have been a contender. Ultimately - disappointing.  Ranking: 4

Y2 - Not particularly exciting beginning. This one has more consistant tempo, but somehow does not quite touch me much in the climaxes.  Again, unison issues when the full orchestra comes in (and in several other places later on - and much worse later on). The transitions here work a bit better than in Y1, but are still problematic at times. The inner voices seem difficult to make out sometimes. Entrances are often ineffective. So now two in a row that don't really cut it.   Ranking: 4

Y3 - Slower beginning. This one seems to breathe more, though brass entrance is perhaps too laid back. This one has better trasitions and interconnection between the parts, which gives it much more cohesiveness (something Y1 and Y2 lacked). In this regard, it is much better. But the tempo sometimes seems to hold it back, as does the sometimes restrained playing. Better than Y1 and Y2 in some ways, but not in others. I was impatient for it to end. Ranking: 4

Y4 - A bit more taut at the start with a slightly faster tempo. Would have liked a bit more expressiveness. But then they speed up into the unison part and that makes the difference as it is the first one that has some excitement. The tempo tends to change at times (too abruptly for my tastes), but the beat and the integration of the different parts is finally well done. This is not ideal either and could have more intensity and expressiveness, but it is galaxies ahead of the other three. Ranking: 1

We'e all heard of the Group of Death. Well, this was the Group of Deathly Hollows, because 3 of 4 rang hollow and were something of a chore to listen to (aka deathly). And I am guessing that the #1 choice would have been second or third in a different group. Ranking them was nearly impossible. Even my first choice lacked the forward momentum or excitement that can't really be so hard to accomplish, can it? So here is what I would like to do - if I am allowed:

Ranking: First Place - Y4, Last Place - everyone else.

The last three (Y1, Y2 and Y3) don't deserve to go through in my opinion. 

EDIT: My ranking in order is: Y4, Y1, Y3, Y2.
Be kind to your fellow posters!!

Sergeant Rock

#475
Quote from: TheGSMoeller on September 09, 2014, 11:11:59 AM
Links sent. Enjoy!  8)

Quote from: mc ukrneal on September 09, 2014, 11:58:48 PM
Ranking: First Place - Y4, Last Place - everyone else.
The last three (Y1, Y2 and Y3) don't deserve to go through in my opinion. 


Neal, you ignored the imperative. You didn't enjoy   :laugh:

Sarge
the phone rings and somebody says,
"hey, they made a movie about
Mahler, you ought to go see it.
he was as f*cked-up as you are."
                               --Charles Bukowski, "Mahler"

mc ukrneal

Quote from: Sergeant Rock on September 10, 2014, 02:33:12 AM

Neal, you ignored the imperative. You didn't enjoy   :laugh:

Sarge

I tried! I really did! But they made it so hard! :(
Be kind to your fellow posters!!

Cato

Quote from: mc ukrneal on September 10, 2014, 07:09:07 AM
I tried! I really did! But they made it so hard! :(

Possibly the terrible result of bidding farewell to BOTH recordings by Eugen Jochum  ??? ??? ???   ?
"Meet Miss Ruth Sherwood, from Columbus, Ohio, the Middle of the Universe!"

- Brian Aherne introducing Rosalind Russell in  My Sister Eileen (1942)

TheGSMoeller

I will go 1st place = 4 pts, 2nd = 3pts, 3rd = 2pts and last place will get 1 pt.

Neal do you want Y4-4 pts and the others split so each gets 2 pts? Are you sure there's not one of those 3 you liked better?

Ken B

Quote from: Cato on September 10, 2014, 07:26:14 AM
Possibly the terrible result of bidding farewell to BOTH recordings by Eugen Jochum  ??? ??? ???   ?
I gotta say, as a lazy by-stander, this is turning out to be good theatre. Wailing, gnashing of teeth, great recordings zapped.  Fun stuff.  :laugh: