Author Topic: Mozart in Period Performances (HIP)  (Read 183645 times)

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Ken B

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Re: Mozart in Period Performances (HIP)
« Reply #920 on: May 07, 2014, 11:31:04 AM »
he Higwood discs wil in all proability turn up in the promised future L'Oiseau-Lyre Classical box. Provided they avoid Hogwood's Haynd symphonies that already are in another box, I will buy it.
Me too. I cannot see them omitting Hoggy Haydn entirely, but hopefully they take some care. I have passed on some juicy boxes because of excessive duplication.

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Re: Mozart in Period Performances (HIP)
« Reply #921 on: May 07, 2014, 11:57:02 AM »
he Higwood discs wil in all proability turn up in the promised future L'Oiseau-Lyre Classical box. Provided they avoid Hogwood's Haynd symphonies that already are in another box, I will buy it.

I already have Hogwood's  (Higwood? maybe...)  Haydn and Mozart complete, symphonies and everything else, plus the Beethoven symphonies. I don't know what else I would want from them. Are you talking one of those Life and Times of... theme boxes?  :)

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Offline milk

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Re: Mozart in Period Performances (HIP)
« Reply #922 on: January 14, 2015, 04:56:30 AM »

I just downloaded this (concertos 14&21). How are people here feeling about this series?

Offline betterthanfine

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Re: Mozart in Period Performances (HIP)
« Reply #923 on: January 17, 2015, 07:03:52 AM »

I just downloaded this (concertos 14&21). How are people here feeling about this series?

While none of the previous releases really did anything for me, this recording of concerto 21 blew me away!

Offline amw

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Re: Mozart in Period Performances (HIP)
« Reply #924 on: March 11, 2016, 05:04:45 PM »
Re Mozart Piano Concertos—

I have had Jos van Immerseel's set since time immemorial, and two others (Zacharias/MDG and Kraus) since slightly more recently. Knowing the music very well, I don't seem to listen to it very often, except when an album comes up on shuffle. That happened recently with Immerseel's 466/467, and I was very surprised to find that this set of recordings (which had essentially been my "introductions" to the works) now seemed very insufficient. In particular, K466 was disappointing; the graceful and somewhat low-energy style seemed done with much less character than Zacharias, and the cadenzas were disappointing. And a subsequent listen to Kraus put both of them in the shade.

Anyway my overall impression is that Immerseel and Zacharias are very similar and I don't need both—but despite greatly preferring the period instruments in sound, I find Zacharias not only more structurally convincing but interpretively to do the same thing as Immerseel (mix of charm and pre-Chopinesque melancholy, grace, intimacy) except better. So for Mozart the Melancholist I think I will be getting rid of Immerseel (or some of the volumes anyway) with much regret. I also have already Mozart the Well-Rounded Personality in Kraus, though the orchestra is only average and curiously anechoic; would consider other options, but I don't think the piano playing can be bettered. Who is a good recommendation for Mozart the Dramatist? Bilson, Brautigam, Sofronitsky, Levin, Staier, another person? (I'd prefer a complete set on period instruments, even if some mix-and-match is involved. Not in the market for another MI set, but individual releases will be considered.) Do any of them have good cadenzas?

kishnevi

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Re: Mozart in Period Performances (HIP)
« Reply #925 on: March 11, 2016, 05:53:45 PM »
Re Mozart Piano Concertos—

I have had Jos van Immerseel's set since time immemorial, and two others (Zacharias/MDG and Kraus) since slightly more recently. Knowing the music very well, I don't seem to listen to it very often, except when an album comes up on shuffle. That happened recently with Immerseel's 466/467, and I was very surprised to find that this set of recordings (which had essentially been my "introductions" to the works) now seemed very insufficient. In particular, K466 was disappointing; the graceful and somewhat low-energy style seemed done with much less character than Zacharias, and the cadenzas were disappointing. And a subsequent listen to Kraus put both of them in the shade.

Anyway my overall impression is that Immerseel and Zacharias are very similar and I don't need both—but despite greatly preferring the period instruments in sound, I find Zacharias not only more structurally convincing but interpretively to do the same thing as Immerseel (mix of charm and pre-Chopinesque melancholy, grace, intimacy) except better. So for Mozart the Melancholist I think I will be getting rid of Immerseel (or some of the volumes anyway) with much regret. I also have already Mozart the Well-Rounded Personality in Kraus, though the orchestra is only average and curiously anechoic; would consider other options, but I don't think the piano playing can be bettered. Who is a good recommendation for Mozart the Dramatist? Bilson, Brautigam, Sofronitsky, Levin, Staier, another person? (I'd prefer a complete set on period instruments, even if some mix-and-match is involved. Not in the market for another MI set, but individual releases will be considered.) Do any of them have good cadenzas?

Hmmm....
I got the first two CDs of Brautigam, and no more because it seemed hohum.

But all the cycles I have are probably in the Well Rounded Personality category:  Brendel, Perahia, Sofronitsky.  With those three I don't find much motivation to get others.  But I do have one or two installments of Barenboim, and he would probably fit your need for Drama, even if he is MI.

Offline Jo498

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Re: Mozart in Period Performances (HIP)
« Reply #926 on: March 12, 2016, 12:31:43 AM »
On period instruments I only have Bilson/Gardiner and Staier (9,17-19, there is another disc with 27). I like Staier a lot and Bilson/Gardiner are, to my recollection, "cooler", not very dramatic (but the orchestral contribution is probably more dramatic than Bilson's playing). I seem to recall that Levin/Hogwood was preferred by some to Bilson but Levin was not completed and the single discs are usually oop and expensive (so I never heard any of them).

I definitely recommend Staier but it's far from complete, especially the dramatic 20 and 24 are still missing.

Sofronitsky was controversially received which could mean that she is more dramatic than average...
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Against the drums of dawn.
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Offline amw

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Re: Mozart in Period Performances (HIP)
« Reply #927 on: March 14, 2016, 01:56:20 AM »
I listened to Viviana's K491 and 482. It sounds like period instruments played in modern style, which I guess could be controversial. I agree with Jeffrey that it's well-rounded, and not on a level with Kraus (again), who does that approach best.

I have high hopes for Bilson, though I am wary of the fact that he supplies his own cadenzas. The incomplete Levin series does seem hard to acquire legally, but it can be pirated—I don't remember which ones he doesn't do, though I think 491 and 595 were among them which is a shame, but I'll get them whenever I have a chance just for sampling. (Probably they're in one of the L'Oiseau-Lyre box sets or something, anyway.) Staier seems like the closest to what I'm looking for but obviously he did only a few. Also there's a disc by Bezuidenhout who is fairly operatic in the sonatas, though I think it duplicates 17 if I were to get it with Staier. Hmm.

Offline Jo498

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Re: Mozart in Period Performances (HIP)
« Reply #928 on: March 14, 2016, 02:16:20 AM »
It's odd that Levin/Hogwood was never completed (supposedly they were a little too late for the combined CD+HIP boom of the 1990s and sales were poor). It seems that of the mature works only 21,24,25,27 are missing (also 6,7,8,10). It is also odd that hardly any of them were ever re-issued as lots of other L'oiseau lyre stuff did get re-issues.

I think I read that Levin was more adventurous than Bilson in adding ornaments, so he is very probably also playing his own cadenzas.
Struck by the sounds before the sun,
I knew the night had gone.
The morning breeze like a bugle blew
Against the drums of dawn.
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Offline amw

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Re: Mozart in Period Performances (HIP)
« Reply #929 on: March 14, 2016, 02:41:21 AM »
I am listening to Bilson's 491. The cadenza is actually decent by HIP recording standards. Gardiner doesn't quite drive things to Don Giovanni levels, though his contributions are more dramatic than Bilson's, who thinks he's Lili Kraus v2.0. He isn't; a bit too pretty, but he's not bad.

Levin is known as an eccentric (I have his DHM disc of Mozart sonatas, planned as a cycle but canceled once they heard all his ornaments) so I am downloading 453/466 for testing, maybe later this week.

jlaurson

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Re: Mozart in Period Performances (HIP)
« Reply #930 on: March 14, 2016, 06:16:39 AM »
Moved from Mozart-in-general:

Latest on Forbes.com:
Classical CD Of The Week: Liszt Inspections

Wolfgang Amadeus Mozart, Keyboard Sonatas vol.8 & 9, Kristian Bezuidenhout (fortepiano), (Harmonia Mundi)

There have been fortepianists before Ronald Brautigam and Kristian Bezuidenhout upon whose shoulders those two might be said to stand. But none had managed to so convincingly bring the fortepiano into the mainstream.


http://www.forbes.com/sites/jenslaurson/2016/03/09/classical-cd-of-the-week-mozart-sonatas-for-fortepiano/


Offline André

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Re: Mozart in Period Performances (HIP)
« Reply #931 on: March 14, 2016, 09:00:18 AM »
Mozart on the fortepiano by a young iconoclast. One has to be strong of heart, but the journey is interesting.


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Re: Mozart in Period Performances (HIP)
« Reply #932 on: March 14, 2016, 10:14:55 AM »
Mozart on the fortepiano by a young iconoclast. One has to be strong of heart, but the journey is interesting.



I am very partial to the 2 or 3 I have in that series, I think Sémerjian is really onto something in Classic Era keyboarding.

I also have a Bezuidenhout disk, not one of the HM series though, and I really do like HIS style too. There are some serious options these days other than the all-time reliable standards, like Badura-Skoda, Bilson and Lubimov. It is an embarrassment of riches!   :)

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kishnevi

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Re: Mozart in Period Performances (HIP)
« Reply #933 on: March 14, 2016, 07:12:16 PM »
I listened to Viviana's K491 and 482. It sounds like period instruments played in modern style, which I guess could be controversial. I agree with Jeffrey that it's well-rounded, and not on a level with Kraus (again), who does that approach best.

I have high hopes for Bilson, though I am wary of the fact that he supplies his own cadenzas. The incomplete Levin series does seem hard to acquire legally, but it can be pirated—I don't remember which ones he doesn't do, though I think 491 and 595 were among them which is a shame, but I'll get them whenever I have a chance just for sampling. (Probably they're in one of the L'Oiseau-Lyre box sets or something, anyway.) Staier seems like the closest to what I'm looking for but obviously he did only a few. Also there's a disc by Bezuidenhout who is fairly operatic in the sonatas, though I think it duplicates 17 if I were to get it with Staier. Hmm.

Levin Hogwood gets one CD in the L'OL Classical set:  PCs 17 and 20.

Offline Mandryka

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Re: Mozart in Period Performances (HIP)
« Reply #934 on: March 16, 2016, 10:12:15 AM »
Mozart on the fortepiano by a young iconoclast. One has to be strong of heart, but the journey is interesting.



310/i buffo style. Does he say what his guiding ideas are?
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Offline André

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Re: Mozart in Period Performances (HIP)
« Reply #935 on: March 16, 2016, 12:54:57 PM »
A very insightful remark  (really). I assume you listened to mp3 and noticed the jaw-dropping tempo of Movt I. well, Sémerjian contributes some thoughtful notes in the 33 page, 3-language booklet and here's what he says about K. 310: "the violence of the opening movement is such that it spills into the slow movement" .

'Violent' ?  ???  Well, that's how I hear it normally, under the froth and fancy of 1777 salon public audiences, that is. After all, Mozart is Mozart, not Tchaikowsky. That's certainly how it comes across in performances such as Gilels or Lili Kraus. That violence does come across in those readings. But Sémerjian is certainly onto something here: possibly the most 'violently' controlled - nay : suppressed version of pre-1789 emoting. The kind of broom-in-the-ass rigidity and freakish control that only a Pogorelich might have thought of.

That being said, I have kept that version on my shelves for over 10 years and have never thought of giving it away. On the contrary: I'm fascinated by his view on the 'rondo alla turca' or the big c minor works..

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Re: Mozart in Period Performances (HIP)
« Reply #936 on: September 26, 2016, 04:28:23 AM »
I recently ran across a notification in an old (2006) journal (Early Music) about this series:



Anyone know of Siegbert Rampe? Heard these disks? There appear to be 12 disks in the series, I ordered 3 of them (3, 6 & 8 ) which are primarily variations and pieces with just a couple of the sonatas represented. The temporal range on each disk goes from early to late, and he uses harpsichord, clavichord or fortepiano to accommodate.

One way or another, I expect I'll end up with all 12 of them, it's my way. If these first three are as good as I hope, the rest will be a no-brainer!  :D

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Re: Mozart in Period Performances (HIP)
« Reply #937 on: September 26, 2016, 09:50:53 AM »
I have a terrific Händel disc by Rampe ... and three of the Mozart's (bought from the bins) n the pile of unheard discs.
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Offline Mandryka

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Re: Mozart in Period Performances (HIP)
« Reply #938 on: September 26, 2016, 10:08:13 AM »
I recently ran across a notification in an old (2006) journal (Early Music) about this series:



Anyone know of Siegbert Rampe? Heard these disks? There appear to be 12 disks in the series, I ordered 3 of them (3, 6 & 8 ) which are primarily variations and pieces with just a couple of the sonatas represented. The temporal range on each disk goes from early to late, and he uses harpsichord, clavichord or fortepiano to accommodate.

One way or another, I expect I'll end up with all 12 of them, it's my way. If these first three are as good as I hope, the rest will be a no-brainer!  :D

8)

I haven't heard those Mozart recordings.

Rampe is a good clavichord player.

He was a pupil of  Koopman, and I think you can sense an influence in early music (something to do with relishing sounds, I can't explain, but Koopman and Rampe seem to enjoy experimenting with the sounds their instruments make and this gives the performances a sort of directness, physicality, irreverence, earthiness.) 

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Re: Mozart in Period Performances (HIP)
« Reply #939 on: September 26, 2016, 11:51:14 AM »
I have a terrific Händel disc by Rampe ... and three of the Mozart's (bought from the bins) n the pile of unheard discs.

Ah, I saw that Händel while searching for the Mozart. Looked intriguing, although I'm not much of a Händel fan, I do like clavichord though.

I haven't heard those Mozart recordings.

Rampe is a good clavichord player.

He was a pupil of  Koopman, and I think you can sense an influence in early music (something to do with relishing sounds, I can't explain, but Koopman and Rampe seem to enjoy experimenting with the sounds their instruments make and this gives the performances a sort of directness, physicality, irreverence, earthiness.) 

Well, that in itself answers my questions, I think. I have never heard the man's name before, simply put. And like you say about Koopman, I also relish the different sounds from period keyboards; it is one of the things that got me interested in that period to begin with. :)

I didn't used to like Mozart on a harpsichord, but my ears have changed over time, and I have so much Haydn on cembalo that I have grown quite fond of it. Plus, looking at the lineup of keyboards he uses, I am quite intrigued to hear them! :)

Thanks for the input, guys. If anyone else has heard any of them, please chime in. :)

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