Shostakovich Symphony no.14 Op.135

[snyprrr]

Inbal is the last of the BigName Conductors on my list. I have dismissed Jarvi, Jansons, Rattle... Bernstein and Britten... I'm even dismissing Rozhdestvensky because, though his is as fine as any of the (less well recorded) others, the sound quality (though very good for Melodiya) can't compete with even Rostropovich's 1973 Russian sound.

So, I took all factors into consideration, and noticed that Inbal has a lot going for himself in the 14th (whatever one may say about the rest of his Cycle). Soloists? Check. Good Great Denon Sound? Check. Interpretation? Check. The fact is, a lot of others' string ensemble is either too big or too small, or just not caught properly, and it seems as though this is one thing that Denon got right. And the percussion seemed just about right, too.

So, anyhow, take another look at the list. if my calculations are correct, Inbal may be the actual best, all around, for a strictly 'Western' take on this Symphony. The Amazon Reviewer makes a case for this being DSCH's most '2nd Viennese School' work, and, apparently, Inbal brings out the Bergian qualities here. Well, I can't wait!

[Karl Henning]

Inbal is the last of the BigName Conductors on my list. I have dismissed Jarvi, Jansons, Rattle... Bernstein and Britten...

Not sure I've heard Jansons here.  Why have you dismissed it?

[North Star]

Not sure I've heard Jansons here.  Why have you dismissed it?

IIRC, snyps didn't care for the singers (Larissa Gogolewskaya, Sergei Aleksashkin).
I have no quarrel with them, or Jansons & BRSO, in the recording..

[Karl Henning]

I certainly have enjoyed anything I've heard Aleksashkin sing.

[snyprrr]

I certainly have enjoyed anything I've heard Aleksashkin sing.

No, it was the soprano. (I think Inbal uses Aleksashkin too?) Most all of the men have been at least ok, but, ugh, these women- mm mm mm- what are we going to do with them? Vishy seems as good as just about anyone- I mean, what BigName soprano sang the 14th? Maybe the Currentzis and Slovak singers are a little more death-friendly in their delivery, but so many of these sopranos are just too much for me- why not Bryn-Julson?


SERIOUSLY- Slovak's singers are pretty right up there-

And you should really try some samples of the Caetani, but especially the Kofman- that particular MDG recording (maybe it was the strings-percussion-voices dilemma) is frightenly transparent- it sounds like the strings are around the singers (like it should be)- I mean, the recording is chilling, and Kofman's choices here (and the singers) are a bit special. So, for 13-14 take a listen to Caetani and Kofman- you may have a new digital 14. I mean, they WILL give Petrenko a run for his money...


I have listen to waaay to much 14th lately- geeeh, such miserable atheist requiem- poor Shosty- could he possibly have know of Our Lord's Saving Grace? Oh, the sincerely earthbound, what a shame. He could have written SUCH Music!!

[North Star]

I mean, what BigName soprano sang the 14th?

Is Karita Mattila big enough for you?

[snyprrr]

Is Karita Mattila big enough for you?

???Is that the Ondine???

[North Star]

???Is that the Ondine???

Dude, I would have thought you knew this one..
[asin]B000EQ449I[/asin]

[snyprrr]

Slovak (Naxos)

I just drove 40 miles to get this Slovak from the UsedCD Store. This is a slightly morose performance, though not Sanderling so, and the singers are both very controlled and somewhat darker sounding than others (haven't heard any shrieking yet!). The recording sounds like your typical MarcoPolo, which is better than Melodiya!- and the Naxos sound really fits the interpretation very well. Maybe we're missing some 20kHz, but we can hear the percussion fine.

I actually enjoyed listening to this, whereas I felt as though I HAD to listen to Lazarev and Jarvi. No, here, Slovak strips whatever it was that those two lacked. Slovak's may not be the last word in incisive string ensemble, but he's much better than Lazarev- actually having some bite. And he's not as puffed up as Jarvi.

No, this is a very 'slav' feeling recording, totally appropriate. Go ahead, it's only $2!

[snyprrr]

Dude, I would have thought you knew this one..
[asin]B000EQ449I[/asin]

One of the few I haven't heard any samples from. ehhh... ahhhh...  I guess i totally dismissed it 'cause I didn't want Fishlips singing bass. mm...

How does he compare to FisherD? (please, stop throwing tomatoes at me!!)

[Mandryka]

I refuse to put too much effort into this Symphony until I have ploughed all the available fields (whaaat?), and studying this piece can be a bit wearying. And considering the forces involved (2 vocalists, strings, and odd percussion), the recordings available have a host of problems to deal with that others musics don't.

First off there is the matter of the singers. So many times, the pairings are off, and usually it is the Soprano who is at fault, squawking her way through an immensely difficult part. I would believe that Janson's Soprano falls into this category. Even the histrionic Mrs. Rostropovich fares much much better than some of the plucky lasses who have been wrestled to the ground by this part. Besides her, Haitink's (Decca), Slovak's (Naxos), and Currentzis(?;Alpha?) samples revealed singers with something a bit more than the ordinary. The Basses have struck me all as at least fairly competent, with Lieferkuss(?) and Aleksashian(?) being two singers who have extensively travelled through the terrain (Lieferkuss having 3 or 4 recordings under his belt).

I have been finding the strings a particular problem, with many way too distant to make for clear listening. I imagine that Bernstein's recording would not have this problem, but some seem to have gone for extreme dynamic range, and then play the music as a whisper, which only causes emotions to roil once the obligatory shock volume burst threatens to blow your speakers. The Lazarev on Virgin, touted by some as a model recording, I found to have 'The Classical Problem' to the point of dismissal, fine as it may be otherwise. I refuse to have an auditorium styled recording forced on me, the home listener, where the conductor then, purposely, plays things too quiet and too loud just because one is overtaken with some non-musical consideration (the opposite of DDG's '80s DDD practice of making their recordings sound good on ANY playback?... but, another Thread). Frankly, I would be suspicious off the bat with an SACD of this Symphony.

The percussion, too, can be a problem, what with that monstrous xylophone that can certainly do damage if it isn't positioned properly. And with some, the drums themselves sound wimpy and very un-death like. Listen tor Rostropovich to hear what rattling bones really sound like! I am not sure who has the most imaginative percussion ensemble.

Interpretively, I'd say that this might be in the "the quicker the better" category of Shosty music, and most do tend to not linger. One of the most important tests is the 2nd movement, 'Malaguena', which, in Rosty's 2:28 is white hot, but in Lazarev's 3:09 just doesn't ignite. The 'Cossak's Answer'. also, needs to be around the 2 minute mark, or less, to have that incisive thrust. It would seem that there's not much a Conductor could do to mess with this music, but some do seem to pull things this way or that.

I forgot the List I had in the other Thread, but here are the main contenders we have for the 14th:


Barshai1 (Premiere)
Barshai2 (2nd Premiere) - I forget which one it is, but one of these might as well be Definitive

[b]Rostropovich[/b] - Top3
                                                                                                                                                                        Britten
                                                                                                                                                                       Bernstein - unbearable soprano
                                                                                                                                                                      Ormandy

                       Rozhdestvensky - anyone? DarkHorse?




***Haitink*** (Decca) - acceptable BUT: love Soprano; F-D..take/leave - almost great (but it does have maybe the best ensemble; but BH not Lenny)

                                                                                                                                                     Ashkenazy (Decca-Japanese)

                                                                                                                                                            Turovsky (Chandos)
                                                                                                                                                                   Jarvi (DG)
                                           Inbal (Denon)

                                                                                                                                        Jansons (EMI) - Jansons's Soprano... sorry
                                                                                                                             Rattle (EMI) - wasn't too keen on Quasthoff, for one thing



Barshai (Brilliant)- perhaps not competitive against the next four?               
Petrenko (Naxos) The Contender's Op.135; 2nd-to-last instalment; Ray's Pick
Slovak (Naxos) - actually pretty good; check it out on YT
Caetani (Arts)- very very good in all departments SACD
Kofman (MDG)- maybe the best of his Cycle? very very good in all departments SACD


                          Currentzis - for many this is the current TopCoice, because of sublime singing and a HIP approach to the music



***Swensen (Ondine) - Grammophone Pick
**Wigglesworth (BIS) - some say he hits a home run with this one

***Chung (Koch) - no word on this tantalizing, and extremely expensive OOP
Lazarev (Virgin) - this is what I'm comparing now, and - well, I'd cut it due to ensemble






So, how do you come to grips with this music? Should you only listen at night?... in winter? How do you feel about it? Many claim it as his masterpiece; my personal listening enjoyment runs to about 50/50. mm? eh?

Why is the Britten crossed out. I'll upload it for you if you want, this one

[snyprrr]

Why is the Britten crossed out. I'll upload it for you if you want, this one

Does "upload" mean I'll be able to just push the button on your next Post and it turns on? 0:)

Yes, i've been a little hasty in my dismissing. I mean, if it's the same singers, how bad can it be- unless the sound leaves something to be desired?

[snyprrr]

Rostropovich1973

Inbal (Denon)

Slovak (Naxos)

Jarvi (DG)

Lazarev (Virgin)


Just added Inbal to the rotation, and so far he wins the award for Engineering, as one might expect. He has Aleksashkin; Jarvi has Llieferkus. I'd call it somewhat of a draw; Lieferkus is slightly lighter and recorded slightly back more- Aleksashkin has tremendous presence.

As per before, the Naxos singers are quite sublime- as a team they deliver quite a unique rendition, the soprano especially has a... gulp (will snyprrr really say it?... will he??)... a pretty beautiful voice,... I know, it's shocking, but she's quite demur. The ensemble is one of the more incisive, which doesn't say much for Jarvi, Inbal, and any other major conductor who doesn't dig in quite like Rostropovich does.

I guess everyone else is trying to be Professional with the piece, but Rosty just wrecks it up real good like. Of course, someone like Haitink with the Concertgebouw is going to get those incisive strings in 'Malaguena', and not even Rosty can compete with that kind of Professionalism. But, I'm not really discussing Rosty here- we know where he stands, let's just concentrate on the newer stuff.

The Lazarev has the lowest wattage 'audiophile' recording, that, though very nice actually with nicely captured percussion, suffers from ensemble and somewhat lax conducting. In all the most vicious bits, Lazarev is consistently the most tepid, and it doesn't seem his band can produce world class string ensemble sounds. Still, i'm giving it more points than I did initially.

And Jarvi isn't as bad as I initially felt,... maybe! He, too, misses a lot of the horror music, just not digging in in the 'Malaguena', but, throughout, he is afforded sumptuous DDG sound, and has some cool percussion choices including the BigBassDrum! Jarvi certainly trumps Lazarev, but the honors are slightly evenly divided. Out of Inbal, Jarvi, and Lazarev, I'd have to cut the Lazarev, but I'd be sad. It's a good compare,... they all are,... fuuu... now I've done it!

Again, Slovak's singers act much differently than a lot of the Big Names, and he's quite competitive in the extremely problematic Symphony.



Inbal/Aleksashkin's 'Delvig' may be the best so far. (this may be Inbal's very best Shostakovich?)

Inbal's very high up on the list in many many departments. It's a 2nd Viennese School performance, as the reviewer said. But, it could be more incisive and angry, but I'm wondering if aaanyone's going to beat Rosty in the unbridled dept.

[Mandryka]

I'll send you the music files, you just press a button and it will download to your hard drive. Here's a review of the CD

http://dschjournal.com/reviews/cd_reviews/rvs13op135a.htm

Have you heard Barshai's first performance? Wild.

It's good to find someone else who's interested in this "symphony" I'm not a great lover of most of Shostakovich's music, but for some reason this one is quite special for me, haunting.

By the way, the Britten Nocturne on the CD is outstanding.

[snyprrr]

I'll send you the music files, you just press a button and it will download to your hard drive. Here's a review of the CD

http://dschjournal.com/reviews/cd_reviews/rvs13op135a.htm

Have you heard Barshai's first performance? Wild.

It's good to find someone else who's interested in this "symphony" I'm not a great lover of most of Shostakovich's music, but for some reason this one is quite special for me, haunting.

By the way, the Britten Nocturne on the CD is outstanding.

mm... computy's having problems playing your file... I'll see if Mr.Expert can do something...

I've been listening to a LOT of 14 lately, going back and forth between Lazarev, Jarvi, Inbal, Rostropovich, and Slovak- SO many factors,... the sopranos are consistently the weakest link (except I actually DO like Vishy, huh?!?!), though, they all have their moments. Inbal and Slovak have what appears to be the least histrionic singing, with some really nice, subdued singing in parts.

So, Vishy is in Barshai2, Rosty, and Britten,... three? (that review of the Britten doesn't seem like it will displace either of the other two)


Am I wrong, or do we need Dawn Upshaw here? (puts on rain gear in case of flame out!)

[jochanaan]

...(except I actually DO like Vishy, huh?!?!)...So, Vishy is in Barshai2, Rosty, and Britten,... three? (that review of the Britten doesn't seem like it will displace either of the other two)

Well, Mme. Vishnevskaya was Rostropovich's wife and a good friend of both DSCH and Benjamin Britten (by her own account).  And though her style is a little foreign to us Westerners, she really is a great artist.

Am I wrong, or do we need Dawn Upshaw here? (puts on rain gear in case of flame out!)

She's a great artist too, and would do the 14th very well.

[Karl Henning]

More good performances are always The Good Thing.

[snyprrr]

More good performances are always The Good Thing.

I mean... soandso said Jansons's soprano was 'famous'... but why haven't the Kenny Rogers and Barbara Streisand of Classical Music (whomever they be) come together for a skip through the 14th? Hampson and Upshaw- haha- oy vey, maybe not!! But I usually like the men- why do the sopranos have to be so... so...

Who would you like?

[Karl Henning]

You know, snypsss, you're not always on your game, but the Kenny Rogers of Classical Music . . . inspired.

[Karl Henning]

Who would you like?

I'll bet I know a singer who would do a great job.   Let me look at the score and see just where the range lies . . . .