Author Topic: Krzysztof Penderecki (b. 1933)  (Read 98869 times)

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Offline Mirror Image

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Re: Krzysztof Penderecki (b. 1933)
« Reply #500 on: September 01, 2021, 07:07:08 AM »
I think I might be working my way through the symphonies in numerical order so I'll listen to No. 6 when I get to it. Listened to No. 2 today and loved it, as usual.

Ah, sounds like a good plan to me. Yeah, the Christmas Symphony is an awesome work.
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Offline Maestro267

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Re: Krzysztof Penderecki (b. 1933)
« Reply #501 on: September 02, 2021, 05:26:32 AM »
After completing Nos. 3-5 in a burst early this morning, I've now arrived at No. 6 "Chinese Poems". Reading a review of the recording mentioning the composer "hoping to complete a cycle of nine symphonies" and that being dashed by his passing in March 2020. Obviously we have no record of him mentioning the following but in my mind it would be quite easy to consider A Sea of Dreams Did Breathe On Me as his 9th Symphony. It follows a very similar formula to No.8, a song cycle for soloists, chorus and orchestra, with the extra note that the songs of Sea of Dreams are grouped into three large (symphonic) parts.

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Re: Krzysztof Penderecki (b. 1933)
« Reply #502 on: September 02, 2021, 05:29:49 AM »
I didn't realize that he passed away.

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Re: Krzysztof Penderecki (b. 1933)
« Reply #503 on: September 02, 2021, 05:42:09 AM »
After completing Nos. 3-5 in a burst early this morning, I've now arrived at No. 6 "Chinese Poems". Reading a review of the recording mentioning the composer "hoping to complete a cycle of nine symphonies" and that being dashed by his passing in March 2020. Obviously we have no record of him mentioning the following but in my mind it would be quite easy to consider A Sea of Dreams Did Breathe On Me as his 9th Symphony. It follows a very similar formula to No.8, a song cycle for soloists, chorus and orchestra, with the extra note that the songs of Sea of Dreams are grouped into three large (symphonic) parts.

The curse of the 9th! It seems to plague so many composers, but this is interesting to read about Penderecki wanting to complete nine symphonies. I always just assumed that the 8th was it. That’s a good point about A Sea of Dreams Did Breathe on Me. This could very well be his 9th symphony. The 6th is a song-symphony and the 7th and 8th are choral symphonies. The reason I believe the 8th is a choral symphony and not a song-symphony is because the use of chorus throughout. I also believe that Penderecki himself called this particular symphony a choral symphony. I listened to the 8th for the first-time last night in the Penderecki-led performance on Dux and thoroughly enjoyed it. I enjoyed it so much that I’m planning on listening to the Wit performance tonight. I’ve heard the 6th once, but it was hugely enjoyable and downright gorgeous. It seems that this composer’s long illness softened his approach in the end and he started to incorporate more lyricism into the music. Anyway, I hope you’ve enjoyed your journey so far.
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Offline Mirror Image

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Re: Krzysztof Penderecki (b. 1933)
« Reply #504 on: September 02, 2021, 06:25:32 AM »
I didn't realize that he passed away.

Yeah, we lost him March of last year. :(
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Offline Maestro267

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Re: Krzysztof Penderecki (b. 1933)
« Reply #505 on: September 02, 2021, 06:55:28 AM »
I'll have to make do with the Wit performance of Symphony No. 8 for now. Penderecki's own recording is the complete version, with more poems added. I think the Wit recording was the complete version at the time but it's since been superseded.
« Last Edit: September 02, 2021, 11:03:18 PM by Maestro267 »

Offline kyjo

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Re: Krzysztof Penderecki (b. 1933)
« Reply #506 on: September 02, 2021, 06:20:43 PM »
A follow-up to my previous message: not all of Penderecki’s music is ‘doom and gloom’. Give a listen to the Sinfoniettas, the Adagietto from Paradise Lost, A sea of dreams did breathe on me..., the Horn Concerto, Three Pieces in the Old Style, Symphony No. 6 et. al. I also want to say I think Kyle is forgetting about the bleak, withdrawn styles that Schnittke and Pettersson adapted in their later years. A prime example are Schnittke’s last symphonies --- these are desolate, bleak works shrouded in shadow with the bold exception of the last movement of his 8th symphony where it sounds like some kind of ascension into the heavens. Also, Pettersson’s style became more and more bleak and anguished as time wore on, especially after the middle trilogy of symphonies: the 6th, 7th and 8th. All three of these composers wrote dark, disturbed music, but I’d never call it depressing, because I don’t hear the music that way. Another quick note and what do we make of Shostakovich’s later style? How about Weinberg’s? These composers don’t exactly bask in the sunshine either. :)

I think Kyle will begin to enjoy Penderecki as he gains more listening experience, because I truly believe that if I can have a breakthrough with this composer, then anything is possible!

Thanks for this and your previous post, John. I'll give some of these works a try at some point in the near future, but I may need some prodding! ;) Like you, I've also been dealing with some bouts of depression recently, but more often than not I cope with it by listening to music that is optimistic and hopeful (at least in the end!) rather than dark and pessimistic. Everyone's different! :)
"Music is enough for a lifetime, but a lifetime is not enough for music" - Sergei Rachmaninoff

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Re: Krzysztof Penderecki (b. 1933)
« Reply #507 on: September 02, 2021, 06:41:19 PM »
I'll have to make do with the Wit performance for now. Penderecki's own recording is the complete version, with more poems added. I think the Wit recording was the complete version at the time but it's since been superseded.

Interesting. I had no idea that Wit’s performance isn’t the complete version and that Penderecki had revised the work. Well, this kind of makes both performances special I think. 8)
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Re: Krzysztof Penderecki (b. 1933)
« Reply #508 on: September 02, 2021, 06:50:48 PM »
Thanks for this and your previous post, John. I'll give some of these works a try at some point in the near future, but I may need some prodding! ;) Like you, I've also been dealing with some bouts of depression recently, but more often than not I cope with it by listening to music that is optimistic and hopeful (at least in the end!) rather than dark and pessimistic. Everyone's different! :)

You’re welcome, Kyle. I also think you’ll enjoy his String Quartet No. 3, “Leaves of an unwritten diary”. The way the work develops into a long lament of sorts about halfway through and sustains this mood makes my heart melt a bit I must say. For me, and this is just my own perspective, but writing music that is jovial or uplifting is some of the most difficult to pull off, because I’m kind of a pessimistic person in several ways, but I do realize that it’s important to keep a good outlook in life and not get bogged down by all the negativity that can happen, but I still love dark-sounding music. I just don’t let anything get me down, but I guess what I’m trying to say is I appreciate where these composers are coming from musically when they write this kind of music.
« Last Edit: September 02, 2021, 06:54:10 PM by Mirror Image »
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Re: Krzysztof Penderecki (b. 1933)
« Reply #509 on: September 07, 2021, 10:21:09 AM »
An interesting guide to some key Penderecki works:

https://www.classical-music.com/features/articles/best-works-krzysztof-penderecki/

To be honest, I think the list is short and doesn’t really give much of an overview of his work. I suppose it might be a fine list for someone just getting into his music and don’t know exactly what to listen to first.

I’d add the following six works to this list: Symphony No. 2, “Christmas Symphony”, String Quartet No. 3, “Leaves of an unwritten diary”, Polish Requiem, Violin Sonata No. 2, Sextet and Kosmogonia.
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Offline OrchestralNut

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Re: Krzysztof Penderecki (b. 1933)
« Reply #510 on: September 07, 2021, 11:27:44 AM »
An interesting guide to some key Penderecki works:

https://www.classical-music.com/features/articles/best-works-krzysztof-penderecki/

To be honest, I think the list is short and doesn’t really give much of an overview of his work. I suppose it might be a fine list for someone just getting into his music and don’t know exactly what to listen to first.

I’d add the following six works to this list: Symphony No. 2, “Christmas Symphony”, String Quartet No. 3, “Leaves of an unwritten diary”, Polish Requiem, Violin Sonata No. 2, Sextet and Kosmogonia.

Definitely have to add Polymorphia to that list. Perhaps the most frightening piece of music I have ever heard.

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Re: Krzysztof Penderecki (b. 1933)
« Reply #511 on: September 07, 2021, 11:55:24 AM »
Definitely have to add Polymorphia to that list. Perhaps the most frightening piece of music I have ever heard.

Ah yes! Love that piece, too.
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Re: Krzysztof Penderecki (b. 1933)
« Reply #512 on: September 14, 2021, 05:46:46 AM »
What are people's top five Penderecki works? John (MI)? 😁

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Re: Krzysztof Penderecki (b. 1933)
« Reply #513 on: September 14, 2021, 06:36:24 AM »
What are people's top five Penderecki works? John (MI)? 😁

An excellent question, Ray. I’ll have to go with the following for today (in no particular order):

Cello Concerto No. 2
Horn Concerto, “Winterreise”
St. Luke Passion
Kosmogonia
String Quartet No. 3, “Leaves from an unwritten diary”
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Re: Krzysztof Penderecki (b. 1933)
« Reply #514 on: September 14, 2021, 07:25:06 AM »
An excellent question, Ray. I’ll have to go with the following for today (in no particular order):

Cello Concerto No. 2
Horn Concerto, “Winterreise”
St. Luke Passion
Kosmogonia
String Quartet No. 3, “Leaves from an unwritten diary”


Hmmm, out of those, I think I have only heard the St. Luke Passion.

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Re: Krzysztof Penderecki (b. 1933)
« Reply #515 on: September 14, 2021, 08:11:29 AM »
An interesting guide to some key Penderecki works:

https://www.classical-music.com/features/articles/best-works-krzysztof-penderecki/

To be honest, I think the list is short and doesn’t really give much of an overview of his work. I suppose it might be a fine list for someone just getting into his music and don’t know exactly what to listen to first.

I’d add the following six works to this list: Symphony No. 2, “Christmas Symphony”, String Quartet No. 3, “Leaves of an unwritten diary”, Polish Requiem, Violin Sonata No. 2, Sextet and Kosmogonia.

This is incredibly helpful. I need to elevate Penderecki to near the top of my 'to do' list. I've been tracking your listening with real interest, and it seems his music may well resonate strongly with me, from what I've read. Yet another worthy project ahead. I've lost some traction with the Holmboe quartets recently, due to necessary distraction with some other fine works, but this encourages rather than discourages me.

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Re: Krzysztof Penderecki (b. 1933)
« Reply #516 on: September 14, 2021, 09:43:29 AM »
Hmmm, out of those, I think I have only heard the St. Luke Passion.

Yeah, well, over the past month or so I’ve heard A LOT of Penderecki, but honestly, I feel I’m only getting started as there are many works that I haven’t even heard yet as well.
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Re: Krzysztof Penderecki (b. 1933)
« Reply #517 on: September 14, 2021, 09:44:44 AM »
This is incredibly helpful. I need to elevate Penderecki to near the top of my 'to do' list. I've been tracking your listening with real interest, and it seems his music may well resonate strongly with me, from what I've read. Yet another worthy project ahead. I've lost some traction with the Holmboe quartets recently, due to necessary distraction with some other fine works, but this encourages rather than discourages me.

He’s definitely worth exploring, especially if you’re coming from a diet of symphonists like Kancheli or Pettersson. There’s much to latch onto in his music and I feel that the starkness of his music gives it a special sound-world that is completely his own.
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Re: Krzysztof Penderecki (b. 1933)
« Reply #518 on: September 14, 2021, 09:57:26 AM »
Yeah, well, over the past month or so I’ve heard A LOT of Penderecki, but honestly, I feel I’m only getting started as there are many works that I haven’t even heard yet as well.

I need to add to my collection a lot of pieces. First, I am going to start going through a relisten of what I have.  :)

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Re: Krzysztof Penderecki (b. 1933)
« Reply #519 on: September 14, 2021, 10:01:11 AM »
I need to add to my collection a lot of pieces. First, I am going to start going through a relisten of what I have.  :)

Always a sensible thing to do for sure. It certainly beats my own method, which is buy everything and then give it away later. ;) :P
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