Krzysztof Penderecki (1933-2020)

[kyjo]

Why, specifically, didn't you like Penderecki's music, John?

[Mirror Image]

Why, specifically, didn't you like Penderecki's music, John?

After his more avant-garde works, I found his turn to tonality to be a step backwards instead of forwards. Also, I don't think he's particularly that interesting of a composer. I had an interest in his music and I hoped that I would gain something positive from the music, but I never did. All of his symphonies, to my simpleton ears, sound the same and employ the same gimmicks and compositional tricks over and over again. I felt his choral works, an area he's highly praised in by critics and listeners alike, lacked warmth and never seemed to rise to the occasion. Penderecki isn't a composer like Schnittke who embraced all of music and continued to grow with it organically and still retain elements of his own style. I also find that there aren't enough contrasts in his music to warrant a deeper listening on my end. There's just not enough 'meat' in his music, so over time I just lost any kind of interest I had in his music and when I do this someone else greatly benefits.

[kyjo]

After his more avant-garde works, I found his turn to tonality to be a step backwards instead of forwards. Also, I don't think he's particularly that interesting of a composer. I had an interest in his music and I hoped that I would gain something positive from the music, but I never did. All of his symphonies, to my simpleton ears, sound the same and employ the same gimmicks and compositional tricks over and over again. I felt his choral works, an area he's highly praised in by critics and listeners alike, lacked warmth and never seemed to rise to the occasion. Penderecki isn't a composer like Schnittke who embraced all of music and continued to grow with it organically and still retain elements of his own style. I also find that there aren't enough contrasts in his music to warrant a deeper listening on my end. There's just not enough 'meat' in his music, so over time I just lost any kind of interest I had in his music and when I do this someone else greatly benefits.

Fair enough. No, I cannot say Penderecki is one of my very favorite composers, but I enjoy what he has been doing recently in his return to tonality. His early works are fascinating, but I can't say I really enjoy them.

[Mirror Image]

Fair enough. No, I cannot say Penderecki is one of my very favorite composers, but I enjoy what he has been doing recently in his return to tonality. His early works are fascinating, but I can't say I really enjoy them.

I'm not necessarily fond of his of early works either but I'll admit they're much more creative than what he's doing now. I don't look at his return to tonality as something that's fascinating. I find it all quite boring actually. I tend to not look at music now as whether it's tonal or atonal but rather there's enough of both worlds to keep my mind locked in. Penderecki just doesn't engage my mind.

[snyprrr]

Haha! You're welcome, Ray!

Uh, hellllloooooo!!!!!!! Starving artist here!!!!

[Mirror Image]

Uh, hellllloooooo!!!!!!! Starving artist here!!!!

I don't know you outside of GMG, snyprrr.

[Brahmsian]

Some fantastic news for the ChamberNut Penderecki collection.  It is about to increase substantially!! 

That is because a very generous gift by John (Mirror Image) is coming my way.  He needs to make room in his library, and all Penderecki must go!   

In all seriousness, thank you so much John!    I am very much looking forward to the arrival of your gift to me.  I very much appreciate it!

I am very grateful to John, the Penderecki arrived earlier this week.  These 12 beauties (ok, I had 4 of these already), but I will 'pay it forward' and send then to someone who might enjoy them.  Details to follow later.

I will list the gifts that John sent to me (PS - John, I only have 3 discs left to listen to!) 

[asin]B000I2IUTS[/asin]

[asin]B00008IHVW[/asin]

[asin]B001F1YBUI[/asin]

[asin]B003VC51WQ[/asin]

[asin]B00004HYN6[/asin]

[asin]B00004R7N7[/asin]

[asin]B000ZJVI6Q[/asin]

[asin]B0000DJEM2[/asin]


These 8 above are all new to me, and I've only 3 of these discs left to discover for the 1st time!! 

The following 4 below I already have in my collection, so if anyone is interested, PM me!

[asin]B00004D3II[/asin]

[asin]B000U7V9EY[/asin]

[asin]B000675OFS[/asin]

[asin]B001U1L9UI[/asin]

[Archaic Torso of Apollo]

For a guy who calls himself "ChamberNut," I am very surprised you don't have the disc with the Sextet et al. It's some of his best recent music.

[Brahmsian]

For a guy who calls himself "ChamberNut," I am very surprised you don't have the disc with the Sextet et al. It's some of his best recent music.

I do have it actually!    It also includes the Clarinet Quartet, Three Miniatures for Clarinet and Piano, Prelude for Solo Clarinet and Divertimento for Solo Cello.  All fantastic pieces! 

I just listed the discs that John (Mirror Image) sent to me.

[Mirror Image]

Excellent news, Ray! Glad you're enjoying the music!

[kishnevi]

For a guy who calls himself "ChamberNut," I am very surprised you don't have the disc with the Sextet et al. It's some of the best recent music.

FTFY.

Pertinent to the thread, I've got the Naxos CD of the piano and flute concertos waiting to be heard (arrived on Friday).  Do any of you have that one, and if so, any comments?

[kyjo]

FTFY.

Pertinent to the thread, I've got the Naxos CD of the piano and flute concertos waiting to be heard (arrived on Friday).  Do any of you have that one, and if so, any comments?

I know you didn't ask me, Jeffrey, but it's a fine disc! The PC is undoubtedly the main attraction; a dramatic, powerful work full of driving intensity. I was less impressed with the Flute Concerto, as it struck me as a bit emotionally detached. Or maybe it's just because I'm not awfully fond of the flute as a solo instrument.

[Mirror Image]

I know you didn't ask me, Jeffrey, but it's a fine disc! The PC is undoubtedly the main attraction; a dramatic, powerful work full of driving intensity. I was less impressed with the Flute Concerto, as it struck me as a bit emotionally detached. Or maybe it's just because I'm not awfully fond of the flute as a solo instrument.

Aho's Flute Concerto may be one of the best concerti written for flute I've heard in quite some time.

[kishnevi]

I know you didn't ask me, Jeffrey, but it's a fine disc! The PC is undoubtedly the main attraction; a dramatic, powerful work full of driving intensity. I was less impressed with the Flute Concerto, as it struck me as a bit emotionally detached. Or maybe it's just because I'm not awfully fond of the flute as a solo instrument.

I've got about the same reaction to flutes as you do, for works in the last two hundred years.   18th century seems to fit the flute better in my ears, for some reason.   This is, actually, only my second Penderecki CD, despite having had the Sextet CD for many years.

[kyjo]

Aho's Flute Concerto may be one of the best concerti written for flute I've heard in quite some time.

I agree! Nielsen, Ibert, Rautavaara, Rorem, Rodrigo, Rouse, Sallinen, Holmboe and Weinberg have also written some very nice flute concertos.

[Mirror Image]

I agree! Nielsen, Ibert, Rautavaara, Rorem, Rodrigo, Rouse, Sallinen, Holmboe and Weinberg have also written some very nice flute concertos.

Yeah, but none of these concerti captured my imagination quite like Aho's. I can't stand Rouse's music. The Ibert is quite good. Never cared much for Nielsen's concerti. Like the Rorem and Holmboe. Don't care much for Weinberg. Rodrigo is a pleasant enough composer, but I think he wrote better for piano, violin, and guitar. Sallinen's music doesn't do much for me. I do like Rautavaara's.

[kyjo]

Yeah, but none of these concerti captured my imagination quite like Aho's. I can't stand Rouse's music. The Ibert is quite good. Never cared much for Nielsen's concerti. Like the Rorem and Holmboe. Don't care much for Weinberg. Rodrigo is a pleasant enough composer, but I think he wrote better for piano, violin, and guitar. Sallinen's music doesn't do much for me. I do like Rautavaara's.

Thanks for sharing your thoughts, John! Interesting to hear your opinion of Rouse. He's far from one of my favorite composers, but his Flute Concerto is definitely his best work IMO. It boasts a heartbreakingly beautiful and emotionally intense slow movement. Nothing in Rouse's oeuvre comes close to the impact and power of this movement IMO. Have you heard it, John?

[Mirror Image]

Thanks for sharing your thoughts, John! Interesting to hear your opinion of Rouse. He's far from one of my favorite composers, but his Flute Concerto is definitely his best work IMO. It boasts a heartbreakingly beautiful and emotionally intense slow movement. Nothing in Rouse's oeuvre comes close to the impact and power of this movement IMO. Have you heard it, John?

I have heard it, but remain skeptical about it. I'll have to revisit it at some point. Right now, I can't, I'm listening to RVW's A London Symphony (Handley performance).

[kyjo]

I have heard it, but remain skeptical about it. I'll have to revisit it at some point. Right now, I can't, I'm listening to RVW's A London Symphony (Handley performance).

Yes, please do! But finish the RVW first, of course!

[TheGSMoeller]

Spent a few hours last night on Spotify listening to various Penderecki pieces (symphonies, concerto, Requiem...) almost all for the first time, and I could easily sense the beginning of a new obsession  , to be continued...