Three Composers You Feel To Be Unfairly Neglected

[Ken B]

Pierre Boulez never controlled funding for any Parisian (or French) musical institution beyond his own. I.e. the Orchestre de Paris, the Opéra, the radio orchestra, etc., etc., were funded directly by the competent authorities, and did very well during Boulez's "control" (to use your term).

I'm not downplaying anything, I'm denying a fallacy that has become widespread. That Boulez was outspoken and brash at times is undeniable, but so were many of his predecessors and contemporaries when they defended their aesthetic positions, and that does not turn him or them into musical tyrants or anything of the kind.

IRCAM.

[ritter]

IRCAM.

Exactly my point...PB controlled (to use my term) IRCAM and the EIC, and got ample funding for these. But as state subsidies for the arts increased dramatically in France when Mitterrand took office and Jack Lang was appointed Minister for Culture, the Boulez ventures did not benefit disproportionately compared to other institutions (on which Boulez had no authority and, if anything, only tangential influence). I insist, do people expect Boulez to have given an all-Sauguet program with the EIC? That's like asking Karajan to program Glass's Akhenaten in Salzburg (and I never read anything accusing Karajan—the "Generalmusikdirektor of Europe", and a widely influential figure in his day—of suppressing anything).

[Ken B]

Exactly my point...PB controlled (to use my term) IRCAM and the EIC, and got ample funding for these. But as state subsidies for the arts increased dramatically in France when Mitterrand took office and Jack Lang was appointed Minister for Culture, the Boulez ventures did not benefit disproportionately compared to other institutions (on which Boulez had no authority and, if anything, only tangential influence). I insist, do people expect Boulez to have given an all-Sauguet program with the EIC? That's like asking Karajan to program Glass's Akhenaten in Salzburg (and I never read anything accusing Karajan—the "Generalmusikdirektor of Europe", and a widely influential figure in his day—of suppressing anything).

Well, if it's your point it's a bad one, because the point at issue is not whether Boulez alone and unaided tipped the playing field against tonal composers. IRCAM, and university departments, and granting agencies ( of paramount importance) and opinion makers like Boulez were *all* tipping the field.

We discussed this at great length years ago on this site.

[ritter]

Well, if it's your point it's a bad one, because the point at issue is not whether Boulez alone and unaided tipped the playing field against tonal composers. IRCAM, and university departments, and granting agencies ( of paramount importance) and opinion makers like Boulez were *all* tipping the field.

We discussed this at great length years ago on this site.

I fail to grasp your point. First it was Boulez who controlled financing, now it's "granting agencies" (which granting agencies?) and universities that are the culprits. But if you want to keep PB (aided by other "opinion makers") as the bête noire to blame for the alleged suppression of tonal music (and ignore the evidence of was being performed in Europe—including France and the UK—and America in those years), that's OK.  .

TD:

Three composers I think would merit wider recognition are Florent Schmitt, Ernst Krenek and Ernesto Halffter.

[some guy]

Well, if it's your point it's a bad one, because the point at issue is not whether Boulez alone and unaided tipped the playing field against tonal composers. IRCAM, and university departments, and granting agencies ( of paramount importance) and opinion makers like Boulez were *all* tipping the field.

We discussed this at great length years ago on this site.

Another framing thing. The field that Boulez was faced with had been tipped against non-tonal composers from before he was even born. To characterize someone trying to make the field level as someone who is "tipping" the field just doesn't seem quite the thing.

Also, I'm starting to think that the "great length" you then refer to is very possibly a function of certain members moving the goalposts (on the unlevel playing field) with each new comment.

[vandermolen]

On the strength of his 8th Symphony I'd add Ragnar Soderlind to this list.

[Cato]

GMG member Vandermolen (Jeffrey) has already mentioned Vyacheslav Ovchinnikov, whose neglect is a disgrace.


Julian Carrillo, Mexican quarter-tone, microtone composer:


https://www.youtube.com/v/7tEx3M1-9O0


Ivan Wyschnegradsky, Russian quarter-tone, microtone composer:


https://www.youtube.com/v/B9WPfkXQa_Y



Mildred Couper, American quarter-tone, microtone composer:


https://www.youtube.com/v/PEOp3tFNaiI

[Xenophanes]

Deems Taylor

Morton Subotnick

George Rochberg

Johann Baptist Vanhal

Joseph Martin Kraus

Franz Berwald