Countdown to Extinction: The 2016 Presidential Election

[zamyrabyrd]

And while I'm at it, the accusations that Hillary "viciously attacked" her husbands victims is mostly false:
http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2016/oct/10/donald-trump/donald-trump-says-hillary-clinton-viciously-attack/

To counter your claim, here is a list of Billy's main mistresses and victims. I took some of the racy and explicit parts out, unlike CNN these days:

Below are the members of Bubba's 21+ Club.
Juanita Broaddrick who claims she was raped by Bill Clinton and Hillary tried to silence her.
Becky Brown was a nanny to Chelsea Clinton and the wife of L.D. Brown, an Arkansas state trooper. She claims he sexually harassed her in the mid-1980s.
Helen Dowdy, the wife of Hillary Clinton's cousin, claims she was groped by Bill Clinton at a wedding in 1986.
Gennifer Flowers  revealed in 1992 that she had a 12-year sexual relationship with former U.S. President Bill Clinton . Clinton denied the affair at the time. However, In January 1998, as part of Paula Jones' case, Bubba testified under oath that he had  sexual relations with Flowers. In 2016 Flowers stated that Hillary is an enabler of Bill Clinton's affairs." She told Esquire magazine in 1992 that if she had the chance to cross-examine Flowers, "I mean, I would crucify her."
Elizabeth Ward Gracen, the Miss Arkansas who won the Miss America crown in 1982, told friends she was forced by Clinton to have sex with him shortly after she won her state title.
Connie Hamzy, In 1991, Hamzy was briefly in the news due to her claim that, in 1984, she had been approached by an Arkansas state trooper on behalf of Bill Clinton. George Stephanopoulos wrote in his memoir that Hillary said of Connie Hamzy in 1991, "We have to destroy her story."
Regina Blakely Hopper was a Miss Arkansas pageant winner in 1983, L.D. Brown, a former Arkansas state trooper, testified under oath that Ms. Hopper used to go to Governor's Mansion to have sex with then governor Bill Clinton.
Sandra Allen James was pinned against a wall by the former president ...(Ms. James' loud scream caused the Arkansas State Trooper outside the door to knock spoiling Bubba's moment).
Paula Corbin Jones filed suit in 1994, alleging that Bill Clinton propositioned her ...when he was governor of Arkansas and she was a low-level state employee.
Dorothy Kyle knows the Clintons well, having met "Billy" when she was just 11 years old, and he was "12, going on 13. Kyle began sleeping with Bill Clinton after high school and their affair didn't end until he moved to the White House" He was married, I was married, during part of this," Kyle said. "I have repented. I discovered I was a sex addict. I got treatment. I told Billy about the problem. I warned him, I begged him, to get help for his sex addiction problem." Ms. Kyle claims that Hillary tried to destroy her.
Sally Miller had a raucous three-month affair with Bill Clinton years before he became the 42nd President of the United States, and that relationship has her fearing for her life today. Beginning in 1992 she started to be harassed, she claims, with a sinister invitation from a Clinton operative who offered Miller a lucrative federal job if she promised to be a 'good little girl' – an offer she declined. 'They said 'if you don't take the job, we know where you go running and we'll break your pretty little legs," Miller claims. 'They said life isn't going to be fun anymore – and they meant it.'
Carolyn Moffet  a legal secretary in Little Rock who was invited to Bill's hotel room after a fundraiser.
Eileen Wellstone, an English woman who said Mr. Clinton sexually assaulted her after she met him at a pub near Oxford University where Mr. Clinton was a student in 1969. A report filed at the time by a State Department official was ignored by superiors. Apparently, the State Department didn't want a Rhodes Scholar to have a rape charge.
Kathleen Willey told 60 Minutes that Bubba assaulted her in the White House.
Christy Zercher, an airline flight attendant on Mr. Clinton's 1992 campaign plane...Ms. Zercher said later in an interview that White House attorney Bruce Lindsey tried to pressure her into not going public about the assault.
In 1972, when he was attending Yale (and dating Hillary) a 22-year-old woman told campus police at Yale University that she was sexually assaulted by Clinton, a law student at the college. No charges were filed, but retired campus policemen contacted by Capitol Hill Blue confirmed the incident. The woman, tracked down by Capitol Hill Blue in 2007, confirmed the incident, but declined to discuss it further and would not give permission to use her name.
Also according to Capitol Hill Blue, "former Arkansas students confirmed that Clinton tried to force himself on them when he was a professor."
These next  three examples come from the Daily Wire:
Roger Morris wrote in "Partners In Power" that another unnamed victim accused Clinton of unwanted sexual advances: A young woman lawyer in Little Rock claimed that she was accosted by Clinton When the husband later saw Clinton at the 1980 Democratic Convention, he delivered a warning. "If you ever approach her," he told the governor, "I'll kill you." Not even seeing fit to deny the incident, Bill Clinton sheepishly apologized and duly promised never to bother her again.
Lt. Col. Robert "Buzz" Patterson wrote a book about Clinton called, Dereliction of Duty in which he accounted yet another victim of sexual abuse by the then-president. He wrote that a female stewardess on Air Force One complained that Clinton "sexually molested" and "cornered" her on the flight. Per Patterson, the woman only "wanted an apology."
Monica Lewinsky.  Technically this one was consensual,  but when a married President of the United States takes advantage of a 21-year-old woman...it's seems pretty close to statutory rape, and besides once things became public Hillary lead the effort to destroy her.

If nothing else the guy has a sickness, called sexual addiction. However, with addicts, there is in psychological parlance, the enabler, who serves as a protection for the addiction either by supplying the drugs of choice or failing to try to stop it or as in this case, harassing the victims instead. An enabler frequently is just as sick as the addict. Draw you own conclusions.

http://lidblog.com/21-rapes-gropes-and-affairs-bubba-clintons-sexual-dalliances/

[BasilValentine]

To counter your claim, here is a list of Billy's main mistresses and victims. I took some of the racy and explicit parts out, unlike CNN these days:

Nothing in your lengthy post counters my statement. You have not supplied a single instance of Hillary Clinton viciously attacking any of these women. So, then, my point stands: As politifact opined: This claim is mostly false.

The rest of your post supports the fact that Bill Clinton was a pig. Good catch there! We would never have known that.

[zamyrabyrd]

Nothing in your lengthy post counters my statement. You have not supplied a single instance of Hillary Clinton viciously attacking any of these women. So, then, my point stands: As politifact opined: This claim is mostly false.
The rest of your post supports the fact that Bill Clinton was a pig. Good catch there! We would never have know that.

Juanita Broadderick was the first on the list so maybe you didn't read it at all.
The dynamic is sick on BOTH sides.
Of course, if she dropped him like a hot potato anytime along the way, she could not be running for president now. They have to keep up the myth of family unity. Sickos, the TWO of them!

[BasilValentine]

To answer you and Valentine, this was uncalled for:
"As part of her handling of the case, Clinton filed an affidavit July 28, 1975, requesting that the girl go through a psychiatric examination. "I have been informed that the complainant is emotionally unstable with a tendency to seek out older men and to engage in fantasizing," Clinton said. 'I have also been informed that she has in the past made false accusations about persons, claiming they had attacked her body. Also that she exhibits an unusual stubbornness and temper when she does not get her way. Clinton offered no source for the claims."

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/fact-checker/wp/2016/10/11/the-facts-about-hillary-clinton-and-the-kathy-shelton-rape-case/

In other reports, she was lured into a car with two older men inside, not went with them willingly.
Justice was not done if a rapist got off with a 2 month sentence. She was made unable to bear children because of that crime. 
Be pissed off all you want. So what!

The statement by Hillary is in an affidavit requesting the administration of a psyche test. It doesn't matter where she heard those things — the obvious answer is that she heard them from her client! And she would be obliged to use the claims in supporting her request for a psyche exam. There is nothing wrong with what she did and she would have been negligent in her defense had she done otherwise.

[BasilValentine]

Juanita Broadderick was the first on the list so maybe you didn't read it at all.
The dynamic is sick on BOTH sides.
Of course, if she dropped him like a hot potato anytime along the way, she could not be running for president now. They have to keep up the myth of family unity. Sickos, the TWO of them!

Broadderick's claim was taken into account in Politifact's analysis. No one missed it. What she claimed was that Hillary thanked her for service to her husband's campaign. She read something sinister into the way it was delivered which cannot be corroborated. It is absurd to characterize an expression of gratitude as a vicious attack.

[zamyrabyrd]

Broadderick's claim was taken into account in Politifact's analysis. No one missed it. What she claimed was that Hillary thanked her for service to her husband's campaign. She read something sinister into the way it was delivered which cannot be corroborated. It is absurd to characterize an expression of gratitude as a vicious attack.

That is not what Broadderick was saying. There is a whole youtube interview with her. The point is however, hers is not an isolated instance. We're talking about at least 20 women who say more or less the same thing. Shut them up would be a logical, but not pleasant response. How to put out all those little fires must be daunting.

[The new erato]

OK; so they're about even in the groping contest. When there comes to suitability for the politics of the office however, there's still no contest.

[Gurn Blanston]

To answer you and Valentine, this was uncalled for:
"As part of her handling of the case, Clinton filed an affidavit July 28, 1975, requesting that the girl go through a psychiatric examination. "I have been informed that the complainant is emotionally unstable with a tendency to seek out older men and to engage in fantasizing," Clinton said. 'I have also been informed that she has in the past made false accusations about persons, claiming they had attacked her body. Also that she exhibits an unusual stubbornness and temper when she does not get her way. Clinton offered no source for the claims."

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/fact-checker/wp/2016/10/11/the-facts-about-hillary-clinton-and-the-kathy-shelton-rape-case/

In other reports, she was lured into a car with two older men inside, not went with them willingly.
Justice was not done if a rapist got off with a 2 month sentence. She was made unable to bear children because of that crime. 
Be pissed off all you want. So what!

It's her freaking job! That's so what. She offered no source. Clearly she didn't need to. Maybe the source was the girl's mother. It doesn't matter. It is NOT her job to decide her client is guilty and then conspire with the prosecutor to put him away for years. You sit there and pontificate about how awful she was, when clearly you don't understand the US justice system. I hope for your sake you are never in a position to have to discover the realities of it.

[BasilValentine]

That is not what Broadderick was saying. There is a whole youtube interview with her. The point is however, hers is not an isolated instance. We're talking about at least 20 women who say more or less the same thing. Shut them up would be a logical, but not pleasant response. How to put out all those little fires must be daunting.

Twenty who say that Hillary viciously attacked them? Document it. You have nothing.

And Bill isn't running for president.

[drogulus]

    The most credible part of the Broaddrick story is that Bill Clinton raped her. The least credible part is that Hillary was trying to intimidate her into silence.

     At one point while discussing this incident with a reporter Broaddrick said:

    " "When you look back over almost 38 years, some of the anger fades, the fear fades, and you think, I hope she didn't know," Broaddrick said."

     When Bill Clinton was President he couldn't bring himself to admit to Hillary what he was up to with women. He would not have told Hillary anything about a rape back when he was attorney general of Arkansas, he'd play the odds that it wouldn't come out before he said anything. Broaddrick's interpretation is understandable but likely wrong, and her statement to the reporter recently would support that interpretation.

[Madiel]

Anyone who maintains that Hillary Clinton enjoyed the case involving a 12 year old girl is divorced from reality.

[PerfectWagnerite]

Twenty who say that Hillary viciously attacked them? Document it. You have nothing.

That's all I hear on conservative talk radio: Hillary helped Bill silence all the rape victims by threathening/bullying/bribing them. There is not one iota of evidence to any of this. If there ever was it would have surfaced a long long long time ago.

As far as Bill is concerned, many have already mentioned he is not running for President. I think Trump is making a big mistake by dragging Bill into this. There is nothing to gain.

[drogulus]

     Former U.S. intelligence officer: Russia has turned Trump into 'unwitting asset'

     His campaign staff is witting, though. Can you imagine what conversations among the Trump team must be like when Agent Orange isn't in the room? Do they avoid each others eyes? Or is it a big joke? Frankly I have no clue, none at all.

[SimonNZ]

      Agent Orange

Heh. Did you just make that up? I'm now surprised I haven't seen it before.

[Karl Henning]

'Unwitting' is one of the best adjectives yet for El Tupé.

[Karl Henning]

Front page of the online Washington Post today, for those who are fond to think that "mainstream media" are "burying" news which is unfavorable to Clinton.

[San Antone]

Front page of the online Washington Post today, for those who are fond to think that "mainstream media" are "burying" news which is unfavorable to Clinton.

Keep telling yourself that.  I have noticed that most people of the Liberal persuasion prefer living in an echo chamber (not that I am accusing you, Karl, of that).      More of these folks than I can count have proudly announced to me "I never watch (or read) anything from Fox News!"  or "Anyone voting for Trump (you can substitute any right-wing belief) please un-friend me now!"    

Most of my northeastern relatives fit this description, and can say with a straight face that anyone who thinks like Repuiblicans do is actually not just wrong, but an "evil person".   

By denying themselves access to the alternative, Conservative media, most Democrats are unable to appreciate the extent the NYT and WPost and other liberal organs skew the balance of their reportage (I freely admit that Fox editors are Conservative).  But I have grown tired of this particular fight; I have learned it is futile trying to open the eyes of those who cannot be happy unless they ignore what doesn't jibe with their world view.  For the record, I purposely read the opposing media partly as a gut check and to see how they present the news and to counter-balance what I am getting from Fox, WSJ and other Conservative media.  Also, the NYT has a great Arts section.

What really galls me is when a Democrat tells me, "The NYT is not biased, after all they publish David Brooks."  Yes, true.  I imagine that is as convincing as if I told them, "Fox News is not biased, after all they feature Juan Williams and Mara Liasson."



Speaking of the WPost ... They just published one the most cynical, hubris-infected pieces of non-journalism I have ever read:

Why we trust Donald Trump's accusers but didn't believe Bill Clinton's

[Madiel]

Keep telling yourself that.  I have noticed that most people of the Liberal persuasion prefer living in an echo chamber (not that I am accusing you, Karl, of that).      More of these folks than I can count have proudly announced to me "I never watch (or read) anything from Fox News!"  or "Anyone voting for Trump (you can substitute any right-wing belief) please un-friend me now!"    

Most of my northeastern relatives fit this description, and can say with a straight face that anyone who thinks like Repuiblicans do is actually not just wrong, but an "evil person".   

By denying themselves access to the alternative, Conservative media, most Democrats are unable to appreciate the extent the NYT and WPost and other liberal organs skew the balance of their reportage (I freely admit that Fox editors are Conservative).  But I have grown tired of this particular fight; I have learned it is futile trying to open the eyes of those who cannot be happy unless they ignore what doesn't jibe with their world view.  For the record, I purposely read the opposing media partly as a gut check and to see how they present the news and to counter-balance what I am getting from Fox, WSJ and other Conservative media.  Also, the NYT has a great Arts section.

What really galls me is when a Democrat tells me, "The NYT is not biased, after all they publish David Brooks."  Yes, true.  I imagine that is as convincing as if I told them, "Fox News is not biased, after all they feature Juan Williams and Mara Liasson."



Speaking of the WPost ... They just published one the most cynical, hubris-infected pieces of non-journalism I have ever read:

Why we trust Donald Trump's accusers but didn't believe Bill Clinton's

You can't even keep this straight.

Your basic claim was "they're not criticising Clinton!". Karl has accordingly provided you with multiple front page stories. To which your response is "they're not criticising Clinton enough! Not as much as Fox News does!"

Well, duh.

You want to talk about echo chambers? Just think back to what happened in 2012. Which party's supporters were living in a "we're going to win" echo chamber, hmm? One of my strongest memories of 2012 was the sheer OUTRAGE on display over on Fox as the numbers started coming showing that no, Romney was not going to win comfortably as Fox had been telling everybody.

That, my friend, is an echo chamber.

And it seems that this time, the numbers are so bad that Trump is abandoning the "I'm going to win" echo chamber for the "I'm going to lose because it's rigged" echo chamber. Which is actually more frightening.

[BasilValentine]

Speaking of the WPost ... They just published one the most cynical, hubris-infected pieces of non-journalism I have ever read:

The article is an opinion piece. The main point is that what Trump is doing with respect to his accusers is not materially different from what Clinton and his minions did. The difference, the author claims, is that the times have changed and unsupported charges of sexual abuse are not as readily dismissed today as they were in the 90s. Do you disagree with this position? What is your objection to it exactly?

[Rinaldo]

By denying themselves access to the alternative, Conservative media, most Democrats are unable to appreciate the extent the NYT and WPost and other liberal organs skew the balance of their reportage (I freely admit that Fox editors are Conservative).

The problem is.. there's conservative media and THEN there's Fox News. Remember death panels? The liberal 'skewage' is nowhere near the Fox sewage.