Six favourite unknown symphonies

Started by vandermolen, June 12, 2015, 10:32:22 PM

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vandermolen

June 12, 2015, 10:32:22 PM
Sauguet: Expiatoire, Symphony 1
Egge: Symphony 1
Kinsella: Symphony 7
Rootham: Symphony 1
Stanley Bate: Symphony 3
Hurum:Symphony

These are all 20th Century but you can select from any century as I am feeling generous today.   8)
"Courage is going from failure to failure without losing enthusiasm" (Churchill).

'The test of a work of art is, in the end, our affection for it, not our ability to explain why it is good' (Stanley Kubrick).

Jo498

#1
June 13, 2015, 12:41:19 AM
18th century

Joseph Martin Kraus c# minor
Joh. Chr. Bach g minor op.6,6
CPE Bach C major Wq 182,3 (Hamburg string symphonies)
Michael Haydn D major Perger 11
F.X. Richter e minor
Vanhal g minor
Tout le malheur des hommes vient d'une seule chose, qui est de ne savoir pas demeurer en repos, dans une chambre.
- Blaise Pascal

vandermolen

#2
June 13, 2015, 01:03:13 AM
Quote from: Jo498 on June 13, 2015, 12:41:19 AM
18th century

Joseph Martin Kraus c# minor
Joh. Chr. Bach g minor op.6,6
CPE Bach C major Wq 182,3 (Hamburg string symphonies)
Michael Haydn D major Perger 11
F.X. Richter e minor
Vanhal g minor

Don't know these at all so thank you very much for alerting me to them. Which would be your first choice?
"Courage is going from failure to failure without losing enthusiasm" (Churchill).

'The test of a work of art is, in the end, our affection for it, not our ability to explain why it is good' (Stanley Kubrick).

Jo498

#3
June 13, 2015, 01:35:55 AM Last Edit: June 13, 2015, 06:18:16 AM by Jo498
Most interesting for me are Kraus and especially CPE Bach

Kraus: There is a good series on Naxos (modern chamber orchestra) or Concerto Köln on capriccio. Kraus was called the Swedish Mozart (which is problematic because he was born in Germany and did not come to Sweden before his early 20s) as he shares Mozart's birth year (died about a year later in 1792). Stylistically he is not that close to Mozart; for me the closest description is that he wrote symphonies in a similar style to Gluck's operas.

CPE Bach: There are several complete recordings of those 6 string symphonies (e.g. Pinnock DG/Archiv), also a mixed recital with the Freiburger orchestra (3 symphonies and 2 concerti) on harmonia mundi. We have about 15 symphonies by CPE Bach but the most important ones are this set of 6 string symphonies and another set of 4 with strings and winds (Wq 183). They are all worth checking out. Written in an impulsive and "quirky" style with abrupt changes in mood he is rather different from almost everyone else ;)

Franz Xaver Richter is also interesting; there are two very good discs on Naxos with 6 symphonies each. He is counted with the "Mannheim school" but in fact he is rather conservative in many respects with quite a bit of fugal writing, often not all that "gallant", in any case a quite enticing "mix" between late baroque and (pre)classical.
(William Boyce would also have been a candidate from about the same historical period)

The youngest Bach son, Johann Christian, is closest in style to (early) Mozart (they were friends) and can seem often like rather shallow rococo, but the piece I mentioned is not at all typical, fairly taut and serious. It can be found on several recital discs (there is a good one on capriccio dedicated to Bach sons)

The younger Haydn and Vanhal are closest stylistically to well known pieces by Joseph Haydn and Mozart. So while (like Rosetti or Kozeluch and others) they are worth sampling if one likes that style to me they do not appear as original as e.g. Kraus or as interesting as the older Richter and CPE Bach.
Tout le malheur des hommes vient d'une seule chose, qui est de ne savoir pas demeurer en repos, dans une chambre.
- Blaise Pascal

EigenUser

#4
June 13, 2015, 02:07:57 AM
Can I count the Mendelssohn string symphonies?
Beethoven's Op. 133 -- A fugue so bad that even Beethoven himself called it "Grosse".

The new erato

#5
June 13, 2015, 02:39:54 AM
Quote from: EigenUser on June 13, 2015, 02:07:57 AM
Can I count the Mendelssohn string symphonies?
Not if you know them.

North Star

#6
June 13, 2015, 02:49:45 AM
Sibelius 8th
"Everything has beauty, but not everyone sees it." - Confucius

My photographs on Flickr

vandermolen

#7
June 13, 2015, 04:19:18 AM
Quote from: Jo498 on June 13, 2015, 01:35:55 AM
Most interesting for me are Kraus and especially CPE Bach

Kraus: There is a good series on Naxos (modern chamber orchestra) or Concerto Köln on capriccio. Kraus was called the Swedish Mozart (which is problematic because he was born in Germany and did not come to Sweden before his early 20s) as he shares Mozart's birth year (died about a year later in 1792). Stylistically he is not that close to Mozart; for me the closest description is that he wrote symphonies in a similar style to Gluck's operas.

CPE Bach: There are several of those 6 string symphonies (e.g. Pinnock DG/Archiv), also a mixed recital with the Freiburger (3 symphonies and 2 concerti) on harmonia mundi. We have about 15 symphonies by CPE Bach but the most important ones are this set of 6 string symphonies and another set of 4 with strings and winds (Wq 183). They are all worth checking out. Written in an impulsive and "quirky" style with abrupt changes in mood he is rather different from almost everyone else ;)

Franz Xaver Richter is also interesting; there are two very good discs on Naxos with 6 symphonies each. He is counted with the "Mannheim school" but in fact he is rather conservative in many respects with quite a bit of fugal writing, often not all that "gallant", in any case a quite enticing "mix" between late baroque and (pre)classical.
(William Boyce would also have been a candidate from about the same historical period)

The youngest Bach son, Johann Christian, is closest in style to (early) Mozart (they were friends) and can seem often like rather shallow rococo, but the piece I mentioned is not at all typical, fairly taut and serious. It can be found on several recital discs (there is a good one on capriccio dedicated to Bach sons)

The younger Haydn and Vanhal are closest stylistically to well known pieces by Joseph Haydn and Mozart. So while (like Rosetti or Kozeluch and others) they are worth sampling if one likes that style to me they do not appear as original as e.g. Kraus or as interesting as the older Richter and CPE Bach.
Many thanks.  :)
"Courage is going from failure to failure without losing enthusiasm" (Churchill).

'The test of a work of art is, in the end, our affection for it, not our ability to explain why it is good' (Stanley Kubrick).

Jo498

#8
June 13, 2015, 04:34:31 AM
Quote from: EigenUser on June 13, 2015, 02:07:57 AM
Can I count the Mendelssohn string symphonies?
As there are only 12 or 13 of them, I'd guess that as an engineering student you'd manage to count that far... ;)
I think they qualify as comparably "unknown" although may be not quite as obscure as vandermolen's list (most names of which I have never seen before).
Tout le malheur des hommes vient d'une seule chose, qui est de ne savoir pas demeurer en repos, dans une chambre.
- Blaise Pascal

Abuelo Igor

#9
June 13, 2015, 04:39:20 AM
How can unknown symphonies be favourite? I mean, I have to know them first to know whether I like them or not...  >:D
L'enfant, c'est moi.

Dax

#10
June 13, 2015, 05:54:48 AM
The 6 chamber symphonies of Milhaud. Nobody knows them except me, right?

Sergeant Rock

#11
June 13, 2015, 06:11:34 AM
Havergal Brian Symphony No.4 "Das Siegeslied" (...not unknown but almost no one, including many Brianites, listens to it.)
Wetz Symphony No.1 C minor
Wetz Symphony No.2
Wetz Symphony No.3 B flat
Antheil Symphony No.1 "Zingareska"


Sarge

the phone rings and somebody says,
"hey, they made a movie about
Mahler, you ought to go see it.
he was as f*cked-up as you are."
                               --Charles Bukowski, "Mahler"

vandermolen

#12
June 13, 2015, 06:41:05 AM
"Courage is going from failure to failure without losing enthusiasm" (Churchill).

'The test of a work of art is, in the end, our affection for it, not our ability to explain why it is good' (Stanley Kubrick).

vandermolen

#13
June 13, 2015, 06:42:45 AM
Quote from: Sergeant Rock on June 13, 2015, 06:11:34 AM
Havergal Brian Symphony No.4 "Das Siegeslied" (...not unknown but almost no one, including many Brianites, listens to it.)
Wetz Symphony No.1 C minor
Wetz Symphony No.2
Wetz Symphony No.3 B flat
Antheil Symphony No.1 "Zingareska"


Sarge

Thanks Sarge. I'm sure I have some Wetz in my collection so must listen again, also to Antheil; I know 3 and 4 which I like very much.
"Courage is going from failure to failure without losing enthusiasm" (Churchill).

'The test of a work of art is, in the end, our affection for it, not our ability to explain why it is good' (Stanley Kubrick).

Ken B

#14
June 13, 2015, 06:53:22 AM
Quote from: EigenUser on June 13, 2015, 02:07:57 AM
Can I count the Mendelssohn string symphonies?
You're an engineer!
Well, if you must, use your toes.

Jo498

#15
June 13, 2015, 07:17:46 AM
A computer scientist might manage 1023 only with fingers.
Tout le malheur des hommes vient d'une seule chose, qui est de ne savoir pas demeurer en repos, dans une chambre.
- Blaise Pascal

Christo

#16
June 13, 2015, 09:00:15 AM
Considering that Havergal Brian, Stanley Bate, Arnold Cooke, Matthijs Vermeulen or even the indominatable Alf Hurum are rather well-known in these pages,  :) I opt for:

Charles Tournemire, Symphony no. 6 'Bible' (1918)
Kaljo Raid, Symphony No. 1 (1944)
Herman D. Koppel, Symphony No. 3 (1945)
Ruth Gipps, Symphony No. 2 (1945)
Ulvi Cemâl Erkin, Symphony No. 2 (1958)
John Kinsella, Symphony No. 7 (1999)

      
... music is not only an 'entertainment', nor a mere luxury, but a necessity of the spiritual if not of the physical life, an opening of those magic casements through which we can catch a glimpse of that country where ultimate reality will be found.    RVW, 1948

Christo

#18
June 13, 2015, 11:36:15 AM
Quote from: The new erato on June 13, 2015, 11:34:48 AMI know four of those.....
Which four? And what are your choices?
... music is not only an 'entertainment', nor a mere luxury, but a necessity of the spiritual if not of the physical life, an opening of those magic casements through which we can catch a glimpse of that country where ultimate reality will be found.    RVW, 1948

The new erato

#19
June 13, 2015, 11:46:49 AM
 Erkin and Tournemire is unknown. My two faves are the two Ks.
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