György Ligeti (1923-2006)

Started by bhodges, April 06, 2007, 06:55:57 AM

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mjwal

It's been fascinating reading this thread, which I have only just turned my attention to. I enthusiastically endorse most of the positive comments on Ligeti's music & performances thereof. I don't know about Le Grand Macabre, since my opera-going days are more or less over - I heard it on the radio once but couldn't make much of it without getting a real feeling for its theatrical qualities, though I do enjoy re-listening to the excerpt Ligeti authorised as an independent piece,  Mysteries of the Macabre. As a sidelight on this point, I remember when I first heard his music; it was back in late 1965 or early '66, at the North German Radio, where they did the 2 Aventures pieces, the Nouvelles Aventures being the world premiere, as I recall. It was hilariously enjoyable and had a "performance" aspect which helped all the innovations seem to make perfect sense in the live context. I do not listen much to these on record - some music is made to be listened to again and again, preferably alone, other music depends more on performance, IMHO. I particularly love the Chamber Concerto - ever since I got to know it on that DG Contemporary Classics CD I have been hooked on the variety and richness of musical invention on display. It was performed very correctly and adequately by Boulez on that recording, but my love for the work was increased and intensified by a later live recording conducted by Stefan Asbury on an interesting rag-bag 2 CD set called London Sinfonietta: Warp Works & Twentieth Century Masters. The sound is less airless, there is more sense of perspective and the potency of individual instrumental timbre; when listening I experience excitement coupled with joint disbelief/acceptance  that somebody could actually be going there, the "shock of recognition" Edmund Wilson regarded as essential for literary greatness. And it's so romantic in places e.g. the second movement's moody  meditation, suddenly broken up by shrieking brass and woodwind only to die out in an almost Ivesian way. The Boulez recording is also cooler, smoother, flatter and less manic (no coughs, either), which may be preferred by some.
The Violin's Obstinacy

It needs to return to this one note,
not a tune and not a key
but the sound of self it must depart from,
a journey lengthily to go
in a vein it knows will cripple it.
...
Peter Porter

bhodges

I generally don't post links here to every article I write, but I thought some might enjoy this review of Le Grand Macabre.

--Bruce


knight66

Quote from: bhodges on June 10, 2010, 07:23:56 AM
Sorry about the video!  I changed the link so it's not embedded with Flash, so it should work now.  (I have no idea why that "friend" message appeared; it wasn't there when I watched it!)

Anyway, here it is again:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f-p1utKFxCg

--Bruce

Amazing stuff. I was wondering how on earth the singers were keeping in touch with the conductor, then glimpsed an assistant conductor in front of them. I assume he was working from a monitor. It does seem like a piece to see as well as hear.

Mike
DavidW: Yeah Mike doesn't get angry, he gets even.
I wasted time: and time wasted me.

bhodges

IIRC, there were actually two assistant conductors!  I only saw one, down on the floor in front of the stage, but I believe there was one more lurking around there somewhere.

I hope, hope, hope they release this on DVD.  Truly, they could sell thousands of copies (if it's an economic worry).

--Bruce

knight66

Quote from: False_Dmitry on May 30, 2010, 01:15:53 PM
.....Ligeti wouldn't the last major C20th composer to have his subsequent artistic legacy compromised by the financial aspirations of crasping publishers, heirs, etc.

Guess why there's no DVD of Glass's AKHNATEN, for example? :(  Whatever your views of the piece, it's one of the most-often-staged of late-C20th operas.

The same thing has happened re Glass 'La Belle et la Bete', but this time the difficulties are caused by the copyright owners of the film. Otherwise, there would be a DVD version of the film with a new Glass conception for the soundtrack. Instead of that you watch the film, or you hear the discs, or you set them both going and keep trying to synchronise sound and vision.....life is toooo short.

Mike
DavidW: Yeah Mike doesn't get angry, he gets even.
I wasted time: and time wasted me.

MDL

Quote from: bhodges on June 29, 2010, 11:23:25 AM
IIRC, there were actually two assistant conductors!  I only saw one, down on the floor in front of the stage, but I believe there was one more lurking around there somewhere.

I hope, hope, hope they release this on DVD.  Truly, they could sell thousands of copies (if it's an economic worry).

--Bruce

Oh, yeah? I hope somebody can release the stunningly staged Grand Macabre from the ENO last year on DVD! I think we're heading for a Ligeti face-off here. Actually, it would be nice if either of us won...  :)

bhodges

Quote from: MDL on June 29, 2010, 02:21:36 PM
Oh, yeah? I hope somebody can release the stunningly staged Grand Macabre from the ENO last year on DVD! I think we're heading for a Ligeti face-off here. Actually, it would be nice if either of us won...  :)

[rooting for both, rooting for both]  No reason there can't be two DVDs of this piece--I mean, really!

;D

--Bruce

lescamil

Am I one of the few out there that seems to prefer Reinbert de Leeuw's performances of Ligeti to Boulez's? It seems that Boulez has constantly been touted as a Ligeti expert with infallible musical decisions among musical circles, and while his performances of them are certainly not bad for the most part, Reinbert de Leeuw's performances just seem to have more commitment, excitement, and confidence to them, as far as I can hear. That said, the Ligeti Project is probably my most cherished set of Ligeti, and I prefer it to the Clear or Cloudy set and the Ligeti Edition, despite the varying amounts of music and completeness on them, due largely in part to de Leeuw's conducting.
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just Jeff

Amazing recording (what would you expect from 70s Decca), I listened to this last weekend on a high end system from UK LP pressing.  Stunningly great!


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snyprrr

Quote from: James on July 20, 2010, 05:35:47 AM
PIANO & VIOLIN CONCERTOS


I was just listening to the Cello Concerto from that set, a very enigmatic piece in my estimation, which ends with a blazing flash of virtuosity. Very, very '60s.

The Double Concerto (Abbado/DG), also very groovy, has a sparkling brilliance I found almost an optimistic BAZimmermann.

I think his wildest piece has to be San Francisco Polyphony. I only heard it once on the Sony, but, wow, that seems to be the Ligeti thing's logical conclusion.

MDL

Quote from: just Jeff on August 26, 2010, 02:30:22 PM
Amazing recording (what would you expect from 70s Decca), I listened to this last weekend on a high end system from UK LP pressing.  Stunningly great!




Ah, memories! That LP was in my school library (which wasn't that extensive, but managed to include Stockhausen's Trans, Kontakte and Penderecki's EMI Threnody/Awakening of Jacob etc) and I still have a copy of it on cassette. The recordings were released on mid-priced CD well over a decade ago and very stupidly, I didn't buy it. The recording of Melodien was recently included on a DG compilation, but the other performances have been lost to the deletions axe as far as I can tell. Shame. Perhaps they'll pop up on the Explore label which has done so much to resurrect recordings from Decca's stunning Headline series.

just Jeff

Quote from: MDL on August 26, 2010, 11:48:49 PM
Ah, memories! That LP was in my school library (which wasn't that extensive. (edit), The recordings were released on mid-priced CD well over a decade ago and very stupidly, I didn't buy it. The recording of Melodien was recently included on a DG compilation, but the other performances have been lost to the deletions axe as far as I can tell. Shame. Perhaps they'll pop up on the Explore label which has done so much to resurrect recordings from Decca's stunning Headline series.

Yes, might be Out of Print, but here is used copies on CD, not too high priiced:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00000E44C/ref=cm_cr_asin_lnk
20th Century Music - Ecrater Storefront:
http://20thcenturymusic.ecrater.com/

MDL

Quote from: just Jeff on August 27, 2010, 02:40:43 PM
Yes, might be Out of Print, but here is used copies on CD, not too high priiced:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00000E44C/ref=cm_cr_asin_lnk


Oooooh, thanks! I'm really crap when it comes to seeking out elusive items on Amazon or eBay. I tend to think if it isn't in HMV, I'll never been able to find it. What an eejit.

I'll have to snap that up. Ta!

Scarpia

Listened to my first substantial Ligeti, the string quartet #1.  I found much to interest me.  Not knowing anything about the music a priori, I don't get the sense that it is "tonal" but more or less freely chromatic.  But the intense counterpoint in the vigorous passages and the odd atmosphere of the more contemplative passages are attractive.

Aside from this one disc from the Sony Ligeti edition, I have the Teldec "Ligeti Project" set.  But I think I need more Ligeti chamber music and might pick up an additional volume of two from the Sony set.

Archaic Torso of Apollo

Quote from: Scarpia on September 12, 2010, 07:27:52 AM
But I think I need more Ligeti chamber music and might pick up an additional volume of two from the Sony set.

Definitely get the Piano Etudes with Aimard. A near-desert island disc for me (and not only me). The vol. with the Horn Trio is also highly recommended.
formerly VELIMIR (before that, Spitvalve)

"Who knows not strict counterpoint, lives and dies an ignoramus" - CPE Bach

The new erato

The box is now so cheap that it makes little sense to buy two single volumes.

Scarpia

Quote from: erato on September 12, 2010, 09:26:54 AM
The box is now so cheap that it makes little sense to buy two single volumes.

The single volumes are also cheap now.  Out of 9 discs in the edition, there are 3 volumes I could imagine listening to,I already have one and the other two I've just ordered for about 4 bucks each.

The new erato

I see, the resellers cut their losses after the box was issued!

AndyD.

Quote from: Scarpia on September 12, 2010, 07:27:52 AM
Listened to my first substantial Ligeti, the string quartet #1.  I found much to interest me.  Not knowing anything about the music a priori, I don't get the sense that it is "tonal" but more or less freely chromatic.  But the intense counterpoint in the vigorous passages and the odd atmosphere of the more contemplative passages are attractive.

Aside from this one disc from the Sony Ligeti edition, I have the Teldec "Ligeti Project" set.  But I think I need more Ligeti chamber music and might pick up an additional volume of two from the Sony set.


George turned me onto this SQ today, having never heard anything by Ligeti. I was floored by the music, alternatingly despairing and lashing. Absolutley riveting. George has since told me tha the Arditti set is great, and I hope to grab that one soon (cheap too).
http://andydigelsomina.blogspot.com/

My rockin' Metal wife:


Scarpia

Quote from: AndyD. on September 12, 2010, 10:08:25 AM

George turned me onto this SQ today, having never heard anything by Ligeti. I was floored by the music, alternatingly despairing and lashing. Absolutley riveting. George has since told me tha the Arditti set is great, and I hope to grab that one soon (cheap too).

That's the one I have.  It is fantastic.