György Ligeti (1923-2006)

[Mirror Image]

Somehow I drifted away from exploring/listening to Ligeti for months. I'm trying to get back into it now. Ligeti is very vague to grasp as an artist. I also feel I never understood how important composer Ligeti is. So, I have been confused. Ligeti's music intimidates and fascinates me in a way I don't think I have ever experienced but there is also something hindering the experiment. Maybe Ligeti lived 100 years too early and should have born in 2023 to create a sophisticated style of computer music? I find Ligeti's art very "computer-like".

Nothing difficult for me to grasp about Ligeti's artistry. He's actually one of the more accessible composers of the second-half of the 20th Century.

[EigenUser]

Nothing difficult for me to grasp about Ligeti's artistry. He's actually one of the more accessible composers of the second-half of the 20th Century.

Agreed, but I think 71dB meant that he is harder to categorize (though I might be wrong). He did have a tendency to write whatever the hell he felt like, leaving behind an enormous variety of music. He can't be pinned down quite like Boulez, Stockhausen, Reich, Riley, etc.

[Mirror Image]

Agreed, but I think 71dB meant that he is harder to categorize (though I might be wrong). He did have a tendency to write whatever the hell he felt like, leaving behind an enormous variety of music. He can't be pinned down quite like Boulez, Stockhausen, Reich, Riley, etc.

The best composers are actually the ones that are the hardest to pigeonhole or at least in my own listening experience.

[AdamFromWashington]

The best composers are actually the ones that are the hardest to pigeonhole or at least in my own listening experience.

The best artists, even. Genius is as slippery as a fish. Whereas simpler folk are all covered in chalk.

[milk]

The best artists, even. Genius is as slippery as a fish. Whereas simpler folk are all covered in chalk.

Some artists have a very singular vision. One of my favorite filmmakers is Yasujiro Ozu. For me, he is a greater artist than someone like Kurosawa who made a much wider variety of films in terms of genre and setting.   

[ritter]

Some artists have a very singular vision. One of my favorite filmmakers is Yasujiro Ozu. For me, he is a greater artist than someone like Kurosawa who made a much wider variety of films in terms of genre and setting.   

Even if I'm not familiar with Ozu's work, I venture to post a +1 to this remark.

Proteanism does not necssarily make an artist superior or inferior. One could argue that single-mindedness is as much a virtue as multifacetdness, and it all depends on the artist's output.

[North Star]

Even if I'm not familiar with Ozu's work, I venture to post a +1 to this remark.
Proteanism does not necssarily make an artist superior or inferior. One could argue that single-mindedness is as much a virtue as multifacetdness, and it all depends on the artist's output.

Agreed. I'd certainly rather take a Sibelius over a Martinů - but luckily I can listen to both.

[71 dB]

Agreed, but I think 71dB meant that he is harder to categorize (though I might be wrong). He did have a tendency to write whatever the hell he felt like, leaving behind an enormous variety of music. He can't be pinned down quite like Boulez, Stockhausen, Reich, Riley, etc.

Yes, it's not the difficulty of the music. Ligeti is simply much "larger" artists than my clueless expectations. I suppose it's just a matter of having enough time absorbing the music. The 5 CD Ligeti set on Teldec is much to swallow for Ligeti newbies. 

[AdamFromWashington]

Some artists have a very singular vision. One of my favorite filmmakers is Yasujiro Ozu. For me, he is a greater artist than someone like Kurosawa who made a much wider variety of films in terms of genre and setting.   

I should stop using similis... I didn't mean geniuses have to work in lots of different styles. I just meant their work is usually more three-dimensional and difficult to categorize when it comes to opinion. It seems more real (usually), so it can be taken more ways. The Old Man and the Sea was as simple as can be (as far as real literature goes), Hemingway disavowed all symbolism, and people are still trying to interpret it.

[Brian]

BIS CEO Robert von Bahr is proud of his Ligeti recordings, according to today's eClassical "Daily Deal" description:

"When Ligeti was in Stockholm to get a major award, Fredrik was his "demonstration pianist" when Ligeti held a lecture about his Piano Études. I sat right behind him, and after a while he turned to me and said "Robert, who is this guy? I have never heard my Études played better". I told him, also informing him that Fredrik pursued a career also as a Professor of Neurology in the Karolinska Institutet, and asked György's permission to record the Études (up to then unrecorded) and he said: Go right ahead. I don't even have to be there. This is just masterful and precisely as I want them. For anyone who knew Ligeti (we were friends since the '60:s) this statement was unique - he always wanted to supervise recordings. Fredrik's playing is totally according to Ligeti's intentions."



Click the image to download the album - today only, less than $4!

[Cato]

Just found this today: others may know of it, but if you do not, here is a fun "interactive" site:

http://www.explorethescore.org/gy%C3%B6rgy-ligeti-klavierwerke-die-musik-entdecken-%C3%A9tude-13.html

Follow Pierre Laurent Aimard and the score of The Devil's Staircase.

[Uhor]

In Ligeti there is as much intuition as there is exploration, he is though best when most rigorous.

Kyrie from Requiem, is a good example on how to expand on new territory over traditional forms, the consecuence of Andante tranquillo from Bartók's Music for Strings, Percussion and Celesta. So is Lontano of Renaissance choral practice.

In Atmosphères take notice of the interactions between distinct macroscopic textures built from microscopic lines, a new dimension to study.

Ramifications, Double Concerto for example shows an organic inclusion of microtonal deviations as opposed of other trends on the same topic. 

[(poco) Sforzando]

BIS CEO Robert von Bahr is proud of his Ligeti recordings, according to today's eClassical "Daily Deal" description:

"When Ligeti was in Stockholm to get a major award, Fredrik was his "demonstration pianist" when Ligeti held a lecture about his Piano Études. I sat right behind him, and after a while he turned to me and said "Robert, who is this guy? I have never heard my Études played better". I told him, also informing him that Fredrik pursued a career also as a Professor of Neurology in the Karolinska Institutet, and asked György's permission to record the Études (up to then unrecorded) and he said: Go right ahead. I don't even have to be there. This is just masterful and precisely as I want them. For anyone who knew Ligeti (we were friends since the '60:s) this statement was unique - he always wanted to supervise recordings. Fredrik's playing is totally according to Ligeti's intentions."



Click the image to download the album - today only, less than $4!

Ah, yes. I posted the following some time ago to the General Tchaikovsky thread, where we were talking about especially demanding piano works. It belongs on this thread as well, Ligeti's rank in the army notwithstanding:

With Ligeti on the other hand, I don't even know where to begin. One is often expected to play with one hand solely on the black keys, the other solely on the white, sometimes with one hand practically on top of the other, and such with a degree of rhythmic independence that irregular accents are required in each hand without regard for the other. I can imagine reading a few measures of a Ligeti etude very slowly, but it would be very hard to achieve the required independence of the hands, and in some of the etudes a degree of stamina is required that approaches brutality. Ligeti loves to write dynamics like ffff, followed by ffffff, then piu forte! I heard the Swedish pianist Fredrik Ullén play the etudes complete (and brilliantly) in New York once; by the end the poor man practically collapsed on stage.

[bhodges]

This past weekend, as part of the New York Philharmonic Biennial, alumni from the Lucerne Academy played three concerts at the Metropolitan Museum of Art titled "Ligeti Forward," curated by the cellist Jay Campbell (who also did the Ligeti Cello Concerto). Each night one of the Ligeti concertos was programmed with other contemporary works. (Piano Concerto on concert 1, Violin Concerto on concert 3.)

Though I couldn't make the last one, the first two were excellent, and now the livestreams are available here. (I have no idea how long they will be up.)

http://www.metmuseum.org/events/programs/met-live-arts/ligeti

Edit: at the moment, only the first two concerts are up, but the third one (from Sunday afternoon) will follow soon.

--Bruce

[SurprisedByBeauty]

Classical CD Of The Week: A Timeless Combination Of Ligeti And Haydn


Joseph Haydn / György Ligeti, Concertos , Shai Wosner (piano), Danish National Symphony Orchestra, Nicholas Collon (conductor), Onyx

[snyprrr]

I finally cracked open the Arditti/SONY disc and went straight for SQ2. Errrrr... my first impression, though this was fine Arditti, was the "dark" SONY recording. It's not bad, ... anyhow, the other version I have is the LaSalle, which I haven't yet compared (but I believe their recording is quite close and up-front).

There's:

LaSalle
Arditti/WERGO
Arditti/SONY
Artemis (Erato)
Keller (ECM)
(Naxos)

is there another?? (Hagen in SQ1/DG.....more interested in SQ2)


What do you know here?



Second time through the Arditti?SONY and one must really cherish their playing. I'm just curious if anyone's even mo' betta... but, I mean... I could see a silkier recording with really plush micing.

[aleazk]

Pierre-Laurent Aimard's latest entry in his series of lectures and interactive scores about Ligeti's Piano Etudes!

This one is about Entrelacs:

http://www.explorethescore.org/gy%C3%B6rgy-ligeti-piano-works-inside-the-score-%C3%A9tude-12.html

If u r a Ligeti fan, then u gotta check dis! 

[pjme]

https://www.youtube.com/v/w0Tvj83xqDw

Never a dull moment with Ligeti!

P.

[snyprrr]

Violin Concerto
Piano Concerto


Broke out the Boulez "Concertos" disc. Yea, wow, I remember bits here and there, but both of these works are BIG, Hollywood (in the best sense of the term) AvantGarde High Modernism of the first order,... I'd say. Both works share a lot of similar features, including prominent roles for the ocarina, and with steel drums in the VC.

Just check out the middle movement of the VC, so many sounds competing, And the "devil's escalator" schtick in the PC is quite beautiful, sounding a little like what I wish more late Xenakis would've sounded like.

I found both works at the top of their game,... are they the "final word" in 'Concertos'? What has happened since then?

[bwv 1080]

The PC is great, dont care much for the VC - the folkish tune kind of grates on me.

The Hamburg Concerto is worthy of mention, from about the same late period in his life.  But its hard to surpass the Double Concerto and Cello Concerto.

As far as 'final word' in concertos, Ferneyhough's cycle of chamber concertos - Terrain, La Chute d'Icare, Les Froissements d'Ailes de Gabriel, Algebrah are up there

Carter's late works as well - Dialogs for Piano & Orch.. the Violin Concerto, Cello Concerto, Horn Concerto and Flute Concerto are all great pieces