Sibelius Symphony Showdown: the 4th vs. the 5th

[Elgarian]

Or, perhaps, like the prior minute or so was too perfect? I think what the explanations in this thread are missing is the context - the shining radiance of that final return of the E flat key and the swan theme's outline. It's already so uplifting, so radiant, so awe-inspiring - how do you follow it? Almost like he offers you a slice of cake and takes it away before you can indulge in that heavenly last bite.

But was the prior minute or so perfect? Wonderful, heart-rending, yes. But there's a process going on, all the time there's an implication of resolution, so it can't be perfect as it stands, purely on its own: it needs the resolution. We need to be able to say yes, I see now, this is where it was going. Then we get the perfection. The perfect mortice and tenon joint needs both a mortice and a tenon to be perfect. (Where do these laughable metaphors come from???)

It's like having a story end like this:

And so the beautiful princess,
And the handsome prince,
Went to live in the magnificent palace,
And they lived to a happy old age,
And they did wonderful things ...
And they boiled milk in non-stick saucepans.

Now I can see that the descent from the 5 lines of high-minded romance to the crassly practical final line does have a certain bathetic humour to it, but surely that can't really be what he was trying on?

[Mirror Image]

Hmm, the gap is narrowing.  Pretty close vote, closer than I would have expected. 

It seems the 4th is getting a lot more respect than it probably has in the past and it's about time! Absolutely incredible symphony (not to say that the 5th isn't as well), but I have really taken quite the shine to the 4th.

[Mirror Image]

Looks like these two masterpieces are even in the votes. Who will break the tie? The world will never know...

[Brahmsian]

#4 takes the lead.  Definitely a bit surprising. 

[Mirror Image]

#4 takes the lead.  Definitely a bit surprising. 

Not to me! I'm proud to see it. Perhaps all my jabberwocky about this symphony has finally paid off?

[Chronochromie]

The 4th without a doubt, it's my favorite symphony from one of my favorite symphonists. The 5th is great but is behind the 4th, 7th and 6th for me.

[madaboutmahler]

Not to me! I'm proud to see it. Perhaps all my jabberwocky about this symphony has finally paid off?

Sorry to knock it back to even, John!!

I love no.4. I think the first movement is one of my favourite symphonic movements, and I certainly consider it one of the most intense pieces of music I know, and one of the most powerful. There is certainly a sense of struggle throughout it, and a redemption that comes with that. As it's so incredibly moving, I find it quite hard to listen to - but I can take that as a good thing as it's so special to me and I have to be in the right frame of mind....

But no.5 does it for me overall. The climax before the attacca transition into the scherzo is one of my favourite moments in all music. And it's all so perfect and yep, the 5th symphony is there in my top 10 pieces of all time by anyone.

[North Star]

Sorry to knock it back to even, John!!

I love no.4. I think the first movement is one of my favourite symphonic movements, and I certainly consider it one of the most intense pieces of music I know, and one of the most powerful. There is certainly a sense of struggle throughout it, and a redemption that comes with that. As it's so incredibly moving, I find it quite hard to listen to - but I can take that as a good thing as it's so special to me and I have to be in the right frame of mind....

But no.5 does it for me overall. The climax before the attacca transition into the scherzo is one of my favourite moments in all music. And it's all so perfect and yep, the 5th symphony is there in my top 10 pieces of all time by anyone.

Voted for no. 5 myself (no. 4 was winning then, too...). I don't think I could manage a top 10 list, but otherwise I agree with your post. Hint: No. 4 is easier to listen to if you listen to No. 5 after that for catharsis. 

[Mirror Image]

Sorry to knock it back to even, John!!

I love no.4. I think the first movement is one of my favourite symphonic movements, and I certainly consider it one of the most intense pieces of music I know, and one of the most powerful. There is certainly a sense of struggle throughout it, and a redemption that comes with that. As it's so incredibly moving, I find it quite hard to listen to - but I can take that as a good thing as it's so special to me and I have to be in the right frame of mind....

But no.5 does it for me overall. The climax before the attacca transition into the scherzo is one of my favourite moments in all music. And it's all so perfect and yep, the 5th symphony is there in my top 10 pieces of all time by anyone.

Actually, the 4th is one point ahead of the 5th (according to the current poll status). Not that it matters really. Both are incredible works and deserve all the accolades a person can heap on them.

[Johnnie Burgess]

My choice would have been Symphony No. 5 in E-flat major, Op. 82.

[Heck148]

My choice would have been Symphony No. 5 in E-flat major, Op. 82.

same here...both great symphonies, but #5 is my favorite Sibelius, followed by #1.

[vandermolen]

I like all the symphonies but consider Nos 4 and 7 to be the greatest.