Recordings of Hindemith's Ludus Tonalis

[prémont]

Straight arrow is an artistically legitimate approach.

Artistic legitimacy does not guarantee artistic quality.

[Karl Henning]

Artistic legitimacy does not guarantee artistic quality.

This too is true. The proof of the pudding, and all that. 

[Mandryka]

Straight arrow is an artistically legitimate approach.

There's a fine line between artistically legitimate straight and, let's say, Claudio Columbo's Beethoven.

[JBS]

On my item of this CD, the cover of which is similar to your picture, the prelude is missing. I have not been able to find out who the pianist is. It may be a recording which hasn't been published elsewhere. The ghost pianist Dieter Goldmann turns up on a recording of some LvB cello/piano music together with Jörg Metzger, who is very real. Puzzling at least.

Just confusing. This is the CD on Discogs


The piano sonatas are attributed to Goldmann, but the pianist on the cello sonata is named Hugo Steuer.
Discogs has almost nothing about him
https://www.discogs.com/artist/7743702-Hugo-Steuer

[prémont]

Just confusing. This is the CD on Discogs


The piano sonatas are attributed to Goldmann, but the pianist on the cello sonata is named Hugo Steuer.
Discogs has almost nothing about him
https://www.discogs.com/artist/7743702-Hugo-Steuer

Hugo Steurer (it's probably him which is meant - mis-spelled) was an existing pianist:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hugo_Steurer

The Jörg Metzger / Dieter Goldmann LvB cello sonatas CD is this (or rather another release of it):
https://www.prestomusic.com/classical/products/8634866--beethoven-works-for-cello-and-piano

Certainly confusing.

[Florestan]

Dieter Goldmann was a fictitious pianist according to Discogs, so we don't know who's playing his Ludus Tonalis. It's very good!

Joyce Hatto, maybe? 

[JBS]

Hugo Steurer (it's probably him which is meant - mis-spelled) was an existing pianist:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hugo_Steurer

The Jörg Metzger / Dieter Goldmann LvB cello sonatas CD is this (or rather another release of it):
https://www.prestomusic.com/classical/products/8634866--beethoven-works-for-cello-and-piano

Certainly confusing.

Even more confusing: the cellist in WoO 46 on that CD is listed as Alfred Sommer. Which name leads to this Denon CD


Note it's spelled Goldman with one n on that cover.

Maybe @Todd knows of a pianist who recorded both Beethoven and Hindemith?

[Todd]

Maybe @Todd knows of a pianist who recorded both Beethoven and Hindemith?

Eric Heidsieck has recorded the sonatas of both.  His Hindemith is the best of the admittedly few recordings I've heard.

Bernard Roberts has recorded the sonatas of Beethoven twice, and the complete one and two piano music of Hindemith.

[JBS]

Eric Heidsieck has recorded the sonatas of both.  His Hindemith is the best of the admittedly few recordings I've heard.

Bernard Roberts has recorded the sonatas of Beethoven twice, and the complete one and two piano music of Hindemith.

Come think of it, Glenn Gould recorded the Hindemith sonatas. It's the one Gould recording I dislike for musical reasons.
(I dislike some of Gould's Beethoven sonata recordings because of the very unmusical vocalizing Gould committed.)

[prémont]

Note it's spelled Goldman with one n on that cover.

That's English spelling and probably incorrect for a German - if he exists at all.

We know that Jörg Metzger exists, so it's probably him on the cello in the LvB pieces ascribed to a certain Alfred Sommer. And listening to Goldmann in these pieces doesn't give me associations to Roberts or Heidsieck.

As to Ludus Tonalis I am going to make an A/B test between Goldmann and Bernard Roberts, even if my memory thinks it's about two different recordings.

 

[prémont]

We know that Jörg Metzger exists, so it's probably him on the cello in the LvB pieces ascribed to a certain Alfred Sommer

The timings of the LvB cello sonatas by Alfred Sommer / Dieter Goldmann and by Jörg Metzger / Dieter Goldmann are close to identical, so it is obviously the same recordings.

[JBS]

That's English spelling and probably incorrect for a German - if he exists at all.

We know that Jörg Metzger exists, so it's probably him on the cello in the LvB pieces ascribed to a certain Alfred Sommer. And listening to Goldmann in these pieces doesn't give me associations to Roberts or Heidsieck.

As to Ludus Tonalis I am going to make an A/B test between Goldmann and Bernard Roberts, even if my memory thinks it's about two different recordings.

 

Point Classics slapped the Goldmann name on a few recordings, and probably they were all by different pianists. Here's a partial listing
https://musicbrainz.org/artist/e71ec8e5-7799-4484-8acf-fe59dfbdcc36

Note it doesn't include the ones we've been talking about.

But the Sommer/Goldmann attribution was from Denon. I thought they were reputable?

[Mandryka]

On my item of this CD, the cover of which is similar to your picture, the prelude is missing. I have not been able to find out who the pianist is. It may be a recording which hasn't been published elsewhere. The ghost pianist Dieter Goldmann turns up on a recording of some LvB cello/piano music together with Jörg Metzger, who is very real. Puzzling at least.

Yes the transfer on spotify doesn't have the prelude. At first I thought it may be Bernard Roberts, but it isn't.

[prémont]

Point Classics slapped the Goldmann name on a few recordings, and probably they were all by different pianists. Here's a partial listing
https://musicbrainz.org/artist/e71ec8e5-7799-4484-8acf-fe59dfbdcc36

Quite a long list of fake names.

But the Sommer/Goldmann attribution was from Denon. I thought they were reputable?

If you look at Presto's selection of Denon Essentials, you will find many Alfred Scholz related names among the performers.
https://www.prestomusic.com/classical/labels/4673/browse

[prémont]

Yes the transfer on spotify doesn't have the prelude. At first I thought it may be Bernard Roberts, but it isn't.

So you did an A/B test?

[hopefullytrusting]

My favorite is Katsnelson recording - not only does it have the best sound quality, in my opinion, it also has the most clarity and precision. For me, many of the recordings become muddy - even with the best pianists because the music is asking their fingers to operate, seemingly, against each other, but Katsnelson, at least from my recollection, never has such a slip - making it my favorite.

[Mandryka]

So you did an A/B test?

No, but I think Roberts is more monumental, less lively.

[prémont]

My favorite is Katsnelson recording - not only does it have the best sound quality, in my opinion, it also has the most clarity and precision. For me, many of the recordings become muddy - even with the best pianists because the music is asking their fingers to operate, seemingly, against each other, but Katsnelson, at least from my recollection, never has such a slip - making it my favorite.

I have not (yet) heard Katsnelson's version. But my completistic mind dictates me to purchase it. As you describe his version I would expect some kind of registration rather than an interpretation.

However I don't think one can accuse Petermandl of muddiness.