Dutch Composers

[Lilas Pastia]

You're the best, Johan  .

[Dundonnell]

I am listening to the Orthel Symphony No.2 'Piccola Sinfonia' again. Despite the fact that the recording is mono from 1959 the work does make a really fine impression of power and driving passion A moving work indeed!

What a very good conductor was Willem van Otterloo! Sad that he should have died as the result of a car accident in Australia in 1978.

What a golden period the 1950s must have been for Dutch music with van Beinum at the Concertgebouw, Flipse at the Rotterdam Philharmonic, van Otterloo in the Hague and van Kempen then Haitink at the Netherlands Radio Philharmonic.

With reference to an earlier remark in a post by me- do any of our Dutch friends know why the Germans insisted on the 20% Dutch music minimum in concerts during the war?

[Dundonnell]

Oh and btw...the Orthel Scherzo No.2 is a little masterpiece!! What a superbly orchestrated, ferociously grim piece!!

Marvellous

[Christo]

I am listening to the Orthel Symphony No.2 'Piccola Sinfonia' again. Despite the fact that the recording is mono from 1959 the work does make a really fine impression of power and driving passion A moving work indeed!

What a very good conductor was Willem van Otterloo! Sad that he should have died as the result of a car accident in Australia in 1978.

What a golden period the 1950s must have been for Dutch music with van Beinum at the Concertgebouw, Flipse at the Rotterdam Philharmonic, van Otterloo in the Hague and van Kempen then Haitink at the Netherlands Radio Philharmonic.

With reference to an earlier remark in a post by me- do any of our Dutch friends know why the Germans insisted on the 20% Dutch music minimum in concerts during the war?

Great to read your verdict on Léon Orthel! The sad thing being, that he never received much recognition. He's widely regarded a minor composer and never mentioned among the leading Dutch twentieth century composers. Hadn't the Etcetera label launched the double CD with his Third and Fourth Symphonies, I myself would perhaps never have "discovered" him. Only after that release did I look for Van Otterloo's perrformance of the Second (Piccola Sinfonia, a fine 1959 recording, but if I recall well it's in stereo, not mono).

The only reason I decided to order for his Etcetera release being my admiration for the Scherzo per orchestra No. 2, that I only "discovered" a year earlier, and a vague memory of really liking the Evocazione I once heard on the Radio in the early 1980s. So, the Third Symphony really came like a revelation and the Second even more. Let's hope one day someone will record all six Symphonies and his other orchestral workd. This (Dutch) site lists all of his compositions: http://www.leonorthel100.com

The German occupation (1940-45) not only brought with it the condition that 20-30 % of all performances had to be of music by Dutch composers, it even initially created an Amsterdam-based "Joodsch Symphonie-Orkest" (Jewish SO) with members who were banned from all ""Dutch"" orchestras. In both cases, the aim was to underline the Dutch "national" culture - as an expression of "Germanic" culture, of course.

There were many reasons. ONe being, that the "Reichskommissariat" for the Netherlands was led by an Austrian music-lover, Dr. Arthur Seyss-Inquart, who took a lively interest in the music culture of the country he was now a sort of dictator of. Another reason was the long-term German interest in Dutch culture as an exotic corner in the "Greater German" realm, stemming from the early days of German nationalism (e.g. Schiller and Goethe, and the 19th C. discovery of Rembrandt and 17th C. Dutch painters school, all regarded "German" in this wider sense). So, a stress on "Dutch national culture" was regarded an integral part of the policy that aimed at convincing the Dutch public of their "Germanic" roots, especially in the early years 1940 and 1941, before the war became grimmer. 

See e.g.: Pauline Micheels, Het Nederlandse muziekleven tijdens de Duitse bezetting (´The Dutch music scene during the Greman occupation´)

[Lilas Pastia]

Since Beethoven's ancestors were Dutch, it was probably important to at least express interest in the country's culture. Just a thought, of course.

[Dundonnell]

Thank you very much indeed, Johan, for that very interesting and informative post!

Yes I understand now the thinking of the German occupying authorities. It is largely as I had guessed-the idea of impressing upon the Dutch public the links between their culture and that of Germany.

What I didn't know however was the fact that Seyss-Inquart was a music lover! Another tragic case of an intelligent and cultured man swept away by his prejudices and corrupted by his adherance to the evil doctrines of his time The ironic thing, of course, is that Seyss-Inquart was actually-at least on his father's side-a Czech!

I am very definitely now convinced of Orthel's great merit as a composer and join you in hoping that we one day get good modern recordings of all of the symphonies(CPO?)

(Btw, your notes on the Orthel Symphony No.2 do say that the performance was released on a mono LP-

http://www.good-music-guide.com/community/index.php/topic,2630.140.html )

[Christo]

What!! You mean...I....Oh Johan/Christo

I am deeply sorry indeed. Mea maxima culpa. 

(Btw, your notes on the Orthel Symphony No.2 do say that the performance was released on a mono LP-

I don't think so? Anyhow: the recording is in Stereo - and a fine one too. 

Oh and btw...the Orthel Scherzo No.2 is a little masterpiece!! What a superbly orchestrated, ferociously grim piece!!

Marvellous

Both you and Jezetha seem to hold that extraordinary opinion - and I don't dare to disagree. 

[J.Z. Herrenberg]

Both you and Jezetha seem to hold that extraordinary opinion - and I don't dare to disagree. 

You are wise as well as cautious.

[Christo]

Scrolling through the Gramophone archives - incredible, you can read all issues from 1923 on there! - I stumbled upon an LP I never encountered before. The Gramophone July 1966 reviews a performance of Léon Orthel's Second Scherzo for orchestra - the Royal Concertgebouw Orchestra under Bernard Haitink and Rein Jordans.

a. Louis Andriessen, Nocturnen
b. Marius Flothuis, Canti e Giuochi, op. 66
c. Léon Orthel, Scherzo No. 2, Op. 38.
Concertgebouw Orchestra conducted by Bernard Haitink (a and b), Rein Jordans (c) with Elisabeth Lugt (soprano). Donemus Audio-Visual Series iJ DAVS6504.

From the review:>> Marius Flothuis (born 1914) is obviously likely to write in a much more easily comprehensible style and so he does, even though his Songs and Games was composed five years later than Andriessen's Nocturnes. This is nicely scored and is pretty easily enjoyable at a first go. Even more so is the Scherzo of Leon Orthel (born 1905), a 3/8 scherzo with contrasting slower music that may date it (compare our own earlier romantic composers), but not, in my view, to its disadvantage. <<

[vandermolen]

A plug for Alphons Diepenbrock, whose 'Marysas Suite' is a very haunting and atmospheric work (thank you Christo  ), the opening of which reminds me of Meuleman's lovely 'Pliny's Fountain'.

I must investigate Orthel (but not at £105 for a single CD on amazon UK).

[Dundonnell]

A plug for Alphons Diepenbrock, whose 'Marysas Suite' is a very haunting and atmospheric work (thank you Christo  ), the opening of which reminds me of Meuleman's lovely 'Pliny's Fountain'.

I must investigate Orthel (but not at £105 for a single CD on amazon UK).

The Etcetera double CD of Orthel's 3rd and 4th Symphonies and instrumental music can be bought from Presto for £25.44(cheaper than on Amazon).
Well worth the money too

[vandermolen]

The Etcetera double CD of Orthel's 3rd and 4th Symphonies and instrumental music can be bought from Presto for £25.44(cheaper than on Amazon).
Well worth the money too

Thanks Colin.

[Lilas Pastia]

There's a Chandos collection of Diepenbrock's orchestral "Songs " - tone poems for orchestra or solo voice and orchestra. It failed to leave much of an impression on me, but that was before I was introduced to the music of Vermeulen, Orthel and a few others. I' pulled it out and will give them a spin this week. Thanks for the tip, Jeffrey !

[J.Z. Herrenberg]

Scrolling through the Gramophone archives - incredible, you can read all issues from 1923 on there! - I stumbled upon an LP I never encountered before. The Gramophone July 1966 reviews a performance of Léon Orthel's Second Scherzo for orchestra - the Royal Concertgebouw Orchestra under Bernard Haitink and Rein Jordans.

a. Louis Andriessen, Nocturnen
b. Marius Flothuis, Canti e Giuochi, op. 66
c. Léon Orthel, Scherzo No. 2, Op. 38.
Concertgebouw Orchestra conducted by Bernard Haitink (a and b), Rein Jordans (c) with Elisabeth Lugt (soprano). Donemus Audio-Visual Series iJ DAVS6504.

From the review:>> Marius Flothuis (born 1914) is obviously likely to write in a much more easily comprehensible style and so he does, even though his Songs and Games was composed five years later than Andriessen's Nocturnes. This is nicely scored and is pretty easily enjoyable at a first go. Even more so is the Scherzo of Leon Orthel (born 1905), a 3/8 scherzo with contrasting slower music that may date it (compare our own earlier romantic composers), but not, in my view, to its disadvantage. <<

Fascinating! I would dearly love to hear that performance!

[vandermolen]

At present, I'm much more concerned with everything I can find by Léon Orthel (1905-1985). I was extremely happy to find that the reissue of a series of radio recordings opens with his great Evocazione per orchestra that I heard in the Radio in the 1970s and really love to hear again: muscular, colourfull music, not unlike Tubin, Englund, or Barber.

The greatest discovery however being his Third Symphony from 1943 - a real war symphony, with even hidden references better not known to the occupier. Now that we are rediscovering Richard Arnell in the UK, and for very good reasons, we should do the same with Orthel.

           

I am listening to Leon Orthel's Third Symphony at the moment - a fine discovery. Johan is right to highlight this war-time work. Tubin and Barber do come to mind at times (as does Shostakovich) but it is a fine, gritty work in its own right. Darkly moving and searching but in no way sentimental. Great defiant march-like ending with eloquent coda. The short, compulsive 'Evocazione' is great fun, with a real sense of Tubin's music.

[Christo]

I am listening to Leon Orthel's Third Symphony at the moment - a fine discovery. Johan is right to highlight this war-time work. Tubin and Barber do come to mind at times (as does Shostakovich) but it is a fine, gritty work in its own right. Darkly moving and searching but in no way sentimental. Great defiant march-like ending with eloquent coda. The short, compulsive 'Evocazione' is great fun, with a real sense of Tubin's music.

Great to learn that you took the trouble to find a copy! (Hope it didn't cost you 25 GBP  ). Most of us agree here, that the Second Symphony, Piccola Sinfonia from 1940, is even better. But that one is only available in a box with Willem van Otterloo conducting the Residentie Orchestra (The Hague) in the 1950s. Could I send you a copy? 

[J.Z. Herrenberg]

Great to learn that you took the trouble to find a copy! (Hope it didn't cost you 25 GBP  ). Most of us agree here, that the Second Symphony, Piccola Sinfonia from 1940, is even better. But that one is only available in a box with Willem van Otterloo conducting the Residentie Orchestra (The Hague) in the 1950s. Could I send you a copy? 

André knows it already, thanks to an enthusiastic fellow member.    I remember him saying that it is a real symphony in spite of its short duration. But let the (great) man speak for himself! 

[vandermolen]

Great to learn that you took the trouble to find a copy! (Hope it didn't cost you 25 GBP  ). Most of us agree here, that the Second Symphony, Piccola Sinfonia from 1940, is even better. But that one is only available in a box with Willem van Otterloo conducting the Residentie Orchestra (The Hague) in the 1950s. Could I send you a copy? 

That would be very nice. Thank you Johan but, in return I shall insist on sending you 'The Krasnodonians' by Maraev. It will be nice to receive a legitimate package through the post rather than having to indulge in an elaborate smuggling ritual 

[J.Z. Herrenberg]

André knows it already, thanks to an enthusiastic fellow member.    I remember him saying that it is a real symphony in spite of its short duration. But let the (great) man speak for himself! 

I thought André (Lilas Pastia) was reacting to Christo's post... Stupid...

[Christo]

I thought André (Lilas Pastia) was reacting to Christo's post... Stupid...

I simply assumed you went mad