Sound The TRUMPets! A Thread for Presidential Pondering 2016-2020(?)

[ritter]

Good day, Andrei.

Intrigued by what Sra. Verdú has to do with this... 

[BasilValentine]

Dems should impeach then!

I'm surprised they didn't think of that!

[BasilValentine]

The Dem response was to call Trump's actions racist and xenophobic. So if they had been in power, even more would have died in order not to have offended anyone.

You are aware that Trump's travel ban was put in place only after 40,000 potentially infected travelers from China had already been admitted to the country, right? The ban was pointless and ineffective by that time, and whether it was motivated by Trump's racism and xenophobia or just his desire to appeal to a gullible base who are impressed by cheap political theater isn't really important.

[Herman]

The Dem response was to call Trump's actions racist and xenophobic. So if they had been in power, even more would have died in order not to have offended anyone.

Clutching at hypothetical straws.

[SimonNZ]

The Dem response was to call Trump's actions racist and xenophobic. So if they had been in power, even more would have died in order not to have offended anyone.

There's a lot of information available now about the Obama administration's preparation for both Ebola and Sars potentially becoming global pandemics. It was highly proactive, science-based and followed expert advice. So we don't need to ponder your "hypothetical".

[Karl Henning]

As with Trump, so with the Trumpkins: the noise IS the message.

[arpeggio]

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Our animas toward Trump is no different than the Trump movement's animas toward Obama or Clinton or Democrats in general.

[Herman]

it is in fact different, just like the GOP / McConnell said on day 1 of Obama's presidency that they were going to deny him any and every success.

The Dems' weakness (depending on one's pov) is that they always want to cooperate in order to keep the country running. The GOP doesn't give a shit about running the country if it doesn't make them rich (and other people poor).

The interesting thing of this crisis is that it makes fully transparent how negative the GOP's agenda is, with the Trump camp turning into a sort of death cult. They positively feel more people need to die, which of course has been clear from their closeness with the NRA all along, refusing to do a n y t h i n g about mass shootings.

[Florestan]

Good day, Andrei.

Intrigued by what Sra. Verdú has to do with this... 

Actually, I posted her in the wrong thread. 

[ritter]

Actually, I posted her in the wrong thread. 

I thought so. And I'm afraid Sra. Verdú, a noted member of the Spanish champagne left-wing sciccheria, would not be happy to appear in a thread devoted to Mr. Trump (unless it were to decry his policies and person).

[BasilValentine]

Right. So I'm sure letting another 40,000 or 400,000 in wouldn't have made it worse. Trump is damned if he does, damned if he doesn't with you folks here. 

Btw, Biden was against the ban before he was for the ban so you might want to rethink your condemnation of it.

By the time the ban went into effect, February 2, the great majority of infected people arriving on the east coast were coming from Europe.

Trump is damned because after three years of dismantling and reassigning elements of the CDC and NSA specifically devoted to pandemic response, reducing the presence of CDC personnel who could have kept him abreast of the situation on the ground in China from 47 to 14, ignoring the numerous warnings from the intelligence community, the military, health professionals, scientists and his own advisors, failing to follow a pandemic playbook developed by the previous administration, and sitting on his fat ass, golfing, and holding political rallies for nearly two months while failing to lead any unified response, the pandemic proceeded just as everyone but Trump knew it would.

I didn't condemn the ban. I said that put in effect at the late date it was, it was ineffective. Less than two weeks before the ban, while travelers were pouring in from China, Trump was tweeting: "China has been working very hard to contain Coronavirus. The US greatly appreciates their efforts and transparency. It will all work out well. ... on behalf of the American People I want to thank President Xi."

[drogulus]

it is in fact different, just like the GOP / McConnell said on day 1 of Obama's presidency that they were going to deny him any and every success.

The Dems' weakness (depending on one's pov) is that they always want to cooperate in order to keep the country running. The GOP doesn't give a shit about running the country if it doesn't make them rich (and other people poor).

The interesting thing of this crisis is that it makes fully transparent how negative the GOP's agenda is, with the Trump camp turning into a sort of death cult. They positively feel more people need to die, which of course has been clear from their closeness with the NRA all along, refusing to do a n y t h i n g about mass shootings.

     It's not entirely a Dem weakness, only partly so. With or without cooperation, Dems must fix problems. It's what they're for, the reason people vote for them.

     Dems sometimes fail to distinguish their hope for Repub cooperation from a realistic assessment of the chances for it. It took too long for Obama to grok that opposition to his Presidency was absolute and not a difference of opinion about how to proceed with the economic recovery or solve the health care crisis.

     

     

[JBS]

By the time the ban went into effect, February 2, the great majority of infected people arriving on the east coast were coming from Europe.

Trump is damned because after three years of dismantling and reassigning elements of the CDC and NSA specifically devoted to pandemic response, reducing the presence of CDC personnel who could have kept him abreast of the situation on the ground in China from 47 to 14, ignoring the numerous warnings from the intelligence community, the military, health professionals, scientists and his own advisors, failing to follow a pandemic playbook developed by the previous administration, and sitting on his fat ass, golfing, and holding political rallies for nearly two months while failing to lead any unified response, the pandemic proceeded just as everyone but Trump knew it would.

I didn't condemn the ban. I said that put in effect at the late date it was, it was ineffective. Less than two weeks before the ban, while travelers were pouring in from China, Trump was tweeting: "China has been working very hard to contain Coronavirus. The US greatly appreciates their efforts and transparency. It will all work out well. ... on behalf of the American People I want to thank President Xi."

You left out what I think are the two most important things: making sure the CDC was preparing for testing correctly (it didn't), and building up the stockpile of PPE instead of sending much of it to China.

[drogulus]

Face it, Obama wasn't an experienced, masterful politician like FDR, LBJ or Clinton. Barack got out maneuvered and had his presidency stymied. In many ways the same thing happened to Trump, probably more so as he couldn't successfully deal with the resistance within his own party.

     Obama did get the ACA passed and Repubs couldn't prevent economic recovery during his Presidency, though they certainly weakened it. I do blame Obama for rhetorically running out of dollars in feigned sympathy for Repubs who did it for real.

China was lying about their success containing it and covering it with help from the WHO.

     This delayed a proper response for days. Far worse was the delay in action in many countries after they received proper warnings from the WHO and government health experts.

     China didn't warn public of likely pandemic for 6 key days

The delay may support accusations by President Donald Trump that the Chinese government's secrecy held back the world's response to the virus. However, even the public announcement on Jan. 20 left the U.S. nearly two months to prepare for the pandemic.

During those months, Trump ignored the warnings of his own staff and dismissed the disease as nothing to worry about, while the government failed to bolster medical supplies and deployed flawed testing kits. Leaders across the world turned a blind eye to the outbreak, with British Prime Minister Boris Johnson calling for a strategy of "herd immunity" — before falling ill himself. Brazilian President Jair Bolsonaro sneered at what he called "a little cold."

   

[drogulus]

    Trump's decision to award China control over the WHO as a parting gift of friendship, all the while complaining about Chynaahh!, will count towards his eternal infamy.

     

[Karl Henning]

'When asked about mask-wearing, Pelosi cautioned that it matters how we return to our interaction with others. (She joked against "double-dipping into the guacamole" at family get-togethers. "By the way, it's never a good idea," she maternally advised the reporters in attendance.) She said to people who don't wear masks: "The mask is not to protect you. The mask is to protect other people. So when you don't wear the mask, [you say], 'I don't care about you, but I hope you're wearing a mask and care about me.'" Leaving no doubt about the object of her concern, she continued, "It does matter [how you interact]. And that's why I would hope that the president and the vice president would wear a mask. They don't wear a mask. Why not? ... They should set an example." She went on: "They have doctors around them all the time to administer to their various needs. But everybody else does not have that."'

[Karl Henning]

Coronavirus casualties in Republicans' culture war
By Jennifer Rubin
Opinion writer
May 24, 2020 at 10:00 a.m. EDT

Had social distancing measures begun a week earlier, 36,000 lives could have been saved, according to Columbia University researchers. Instituting measures two weeks earlier would have spared more than 80 percent of the cases and deaths, their research suggests. The Trump administration's delinquency in recognizing the severity of the virus and the extent of community spread already underway by February resulted in the unnecessary death of tens of thousands of Americans.

Tragically, Trump's anti-science, anti-expert stance has not ended; it continues to take lives. Trump's aversion to wearing a mask and the right-wing media universe's insistence on making this a visible expression of the culture wars are likely to cost lives. (And then there is the president's irresponsible hawking of hydroxychloroquine.)

North Dakota's Republican governor, Doug Burgum, is frantic to depoliticize what Trump has politicized. The Post reports on his comments Friday:

"I would really love to see in North Dakota that we could just skip this thing that other parts of the nation are going through where they're creating a divide — either it's ideological or political or something — around masks versus no mask," Burgum said. "This is a, I would say, senseless dividing line, and I would ask people to try to dial up your empathy and your understanding." . . .
Burgum then went on, getting emotional.
"If someone is wearing a mask, they're not doing it to represent what political party they're in or what candidates they support," Burgum said, before his voice began breaking. "They might be doing it because they've got a 5-year-old child who's been going through cancer treatments. They might have vulnerable adults in their life who currently have covid, and they're fighting."

It is striking that, as New York cautiously opens its state region by region, Democratic Gov. Andrew M. Cuomo likewise pleads with New Yorkers to wear a mask. "We are going to have to do it for a long time," Cuomo warned Saturday, suggesting masks will be essential in the fall and beyond. Cuomo calls mask-wearing and other social distancing actions indicative of "New York tough" — which he said Friday means "smart, united, disciplined and loving." (New York has a statewide contest to come up with the best public-service ad to promote mask-wearing.)

In his plea for people to wear masks, Burgum said, "I would just love to see our state, as part of being North Dakota Smart, also be North Dakota Kind, North Dakota Empathetic."

New York and North Dakota are not that different after all.

As we move into the next phase of the pandemic, the issue is no longer whether to reopen businesses and venues. All 50 states are in some phase of relaxing the most stringent lockdown orders. There is, however, a world of difference between governors who move responsibly (helping to instill a culture of mask-wearing) and governors who align themselves with Trump in the culture wars, moving prematurely and needlessly promoting risky conduct.

In that regard, "The coronavirus may still be spreading at epidemic rates in 24 states, particularly in the South and Midwest, according to new research that highlights the risk of a second wave of infections in places that reopen too quickly or without sufficient precautions," The Post reports, citing new modeling from Imperial College London. In California, where some rural counties rushed to reopen before the governor acted, and in Florida, where Republican Gov. Ron DeSantis has been among the most resistant to social distancing measures, "the death rate could spike to roughly 1,000 a day by July without efforts to mitigate the spread, according to the report."

The Imperial College model and other studies show infection rates spiking in Texas, Arizona and Alabama. Cases have been rising dramatically as Texas continues to relax restrictions on everything from tanning salons to movie theaters [...]

In sum, had Trump — followed by his cult of right-wing governors — exhibited actual leadership, thousands of Americans might still be alive. He could have listened to scientists, given up the notion that closing public spaces would just spook the markets (and endanger his reelection), decisively supported lockdown measures, discouraged large gatherings (instead of egging on states to allow religious services, which have often been the site for mass infections) and modeled responsible mask-wearing. If he had, fewer Americans would have become seriously ill. We might not now be staring at the mind-boggling figure of 100,000 deaths.

[Karl Henning]

"President Trump's contempt for masks, determination to blame others for his poor performance and insistence on hawking dangerous drug treatments may please his core group of fans, but it is not sitting well with the rest of America. The latest ABC News/Ipsos poll finds only 39 percent of Americans (35 percent of independents) approve of his handling of the pandemic; 60 percent disapprove. That's a new low for him since the coronavirus crisis began.

In Michigan, a key swing state, Trump attacks popular Gov. Gretchen Whitmer (D) and cheers on mobs that protest stay-at-home rules. The Detroit Free Press poll released early this week found that Michiganders by a 69 percent to 22 percent margin say "protests at the state Capitol against Whitmer's stay-at-home orders sent a wrong message." While there were partisan differences, the gap between Democrats and Republicans was not as wide as you might expect ("more than 90% of Democrats, 70% of Independents and 55% of Republican leaners agreeing the protests were wrong — only one group, strongly Republican men, had a majority that felt they sent the right message, by a margin of 58%-30%.") Although not polled, I bet threatening to cut aid to the state if it doesn't stop sending ballot applications is not going to win Trump plaudits either.

Trump's numbers were equally dismal in the most recent Fox News poll. Voters think former vice president Joe Biden will "do a better job than Trump on health care by 17 points, coronavirus by 9, and relations with China by 6. Trump is trusted more on the economy by a slim 3-point margin." Overall, Trump trails Biden by eight points, Biden's net favorable is +2, while Trump's is -12. Men favor Trump by seven points; women favor Biden by 20. In what should be red flags for Trump, he trails Biden among white women (whom Trump won narrowly in 2016), whites with college degrees and white women with college degrees (by 21 points).

Levels of unemployment not experienced since the Great Depression seem to be in the cards for the foreseeable future: "Bank of America expects the unemployment rate to peak 'close to 19%' by the end of the second quarter, according to the note." No wonder Trump is overriding Senate Republicans and now pushing to put more money in the hands of Americans with another stimulus bill. But while Trump and his economic advisers seem to be following Federal Reserve Chair Jerome H. Powell's admonition to "think big," Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell (R-Ky.) is still trying to do stimulus on the cheap, keeping the next bill under $1 trillion. Perhaps poll numbers for both Trump and Senate Republicans will move him to help sustain the tens of millions of Americans who have lost jobs (or suffered a reduction in wages).

Kaiser Family Foundation polling shows Democrats cite health care and the coronavirus as their top concerns this election year, while Republicans name the economy. Either way, Trump's record is a disaster. As much as he will attempt to create distractions, Americans will remain laser-focused on these two increasingly intertwined issues. Do they really want four more years of this?"

[JBS]

Maybe if he had kept the public option in there he wouldn't have lost the HOR in 2010? I heard Obama wanted another stimulus type infrastructure bill, too, but was obviously thwarted by the House GOP. Oh well. Barack just couldn't get it done with the other side. Clinton did after the RR in '94.

It progressed fairly slowly at first then exploded. Trump's tweets/comments will be used against him in November for sure but as of now Covid-19 has hit the north and eastern seaboard states the hardest, elsewhere not so much—perhaps because of a better state/city lead government response or smaller population density.

I'm not saying the Trump initial response was perfect or ideal so don't hammer me too much. Quite frankly, if he wins re-election I'd be fine with a Warren G Harding type death. Pence at this point would be better but he wouldn't rouse the popular interest—let's face it, in this era that matters most.

Pence's chief ability turns out to be simply that he's an expert brownoser. Cheerleader, if you want a kinder term. But his praise of Trump sometimes rises to that of a fearful apparatchik proving his loyalty to Comrade Iosif Vissarionovich.

I think the difference  you note between red and blue in virus infections  is reflective of a difference in rural vs urban, especially at the county level. 

[SimonNZ]

Trump administration suspends travel from Brazil to limit spread of COVID-19

" President Donald Trump issued a proclamation on Sunday banning individuals who have been in Brazil within 14 days prior to attempting to enter the United States in the latest travel restrictions aimed at containing the rapid spread of the coronavirus.

The president, citing the Centers for Disease Control and Prevent and the Department of Homeland Security, said Brazil was the latest country to face travel restrictions as the country continues to face a surge in cases of COVID-19, according to the order. The order will take effect May 28 at 11:59 p.m. ET.

Brazil is among the hardest hit countries in the coronavirus pandemic, with more than 347,000 cases and at least 22,000 deaths, according to Johns Hopkins University data. The country is only second to the U.S. in terms of total positive cases.Brazil recently surpassed Russia, which has more than 344,000 cases of the coronavirus.

"Today, the President has taken decisive action to protect our country by suspending the entry of aliens who have been in Brazil during the 14-day period before seeking admittance to the United States," White House Press Secretary Kayleigh McEnany said in a statement. "[...]