Mini-Blind Comparison: Chopin's Ballade No. 2

Started by amw, February 04, 2017, 06:01:52 AM

Previous topic - Next topic

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

aukhawk

 :)

Well - the perils of listening 'blind' - initially, pianist 8 was ranked 5th twice, and then amw offered this comment:

Quote from: amw on February 05, 2017, 01:03:06 AM
... it is one of three recordings in this selection that in my opinion stand well above the rest, but I'm obviously non-blind as I've heard the rest of the performance as well...

and since then, pianist 8 has ranked first or second 7 times.  ;)

I'll join others in thanking amw for this very well-presented game - fitted in to a rather busy schedule by the sounds of it!

amw

Quote from: aukhawk on February 11, 2017, 01:06:55 AM
Well - the perils of listening 'blind' - initially, pianist 8 was ranked 5th twice, and then amw offered this comment:

and since then, pianist 8 has ranked first or second 7 times.  ;)
To be fair, (a) it's not just me—pianist #8 offers one of the most critically acclaimed recordings of the Ballades; (b) another of the three recordings that stand out for me is pianist #4, who has also been ranked first 4 times. The third one, on the other hand, is pianist #1 who obviously hasn't been doing nearly as well. >_>

(My personal ranking would be 4 8 1 >>> 3 7 2 >>> 5 6 9 if anyone's curious. I think I'm safe to say that without risking any spoilers.)

Pat B

Quote from: aukhawk on February 11, 2017, 01:06:55 AM
:)

Well - the perils of listening 'blind' - initially, pianist 8 was ranked 5th twice, and then amw offered this comment:

and since then, pianist 8 has ranked first or second 7 times.  ;)

I'll join others in thanking amw for this very well-presented game - fitted in to a rather busy schedule by the sounds of it!

FWIW I did not read any of the replies before posting.

Cato

Quote from: Pat B on February 11, 2017, 06:13:15 AM
FWIW I did not read any of the replies before posting.

Amen! 0:)

#8 had my vote as a top choice, along with #5 and #6.

Again, all 9 had their moments and their arguments as to why playing it this way is the right way.
"Meet Miss Ruth Sherwood, from Columbus, Ohio, the Middle of the Universe!"

- Brian Aherne introducing Rosalind Russell in  My Sister Eileen (1942)

ComposerOfAvantGarde

I think one of amw's top 3 is Zimerman and maybe it's the 8th or 1st......perhaps 8th?

amw

The identities of the participants will be revealed in about 24 hours so if you wanna vote and haven't yet, now's the time!

ComposerOfAvantGarde

$20 on Cortot for number 3 and I'm just gonna guess that no. 8 is Zimerman.

zamyrabyrd

"Men, it has been well said, think in herds; it will be seen that they go mad in herds, while they only recover their senses slowly, one by one."

― Charles MacKay, Extraordinary Popular Delusions and the Madness of Crowds

ComposerOfAvantGarde

It's monday the 13th! Come on amw! Out with it! Who are the pianists! ;D

Syek88

Number 4 was the stand-out for me.  The slightly faster pace is initially a surprise, but it serves the purpose of relaxing the music a little, consistent with what in my view is its pastoral nature.  Once Number 4 has been heard, the slower tempi in other recordings make the long phrases too long, and the music less natural – mannered, even.  Also in Number 4, the dynamics are truly 'sotto voce' and the subsequent pianissimo properly discernible.  This all of course allows the pianist to break into the presto with the full contrast required.

amw

sorry! Things are a bit busy today, I'm writing up the results now though

amw

About the results

Pretty much what I expected.

About the method

I averaged the relative positions of the excerpts across all the voters. High scores reflect relative positions averaging closer to 1st place, lower scores reflect relative positions averaging closer to the bottom. So the lower the score of an excerpt, the better.

The actual results

In joint 8th place (tied): Pianists #2 and 9 with 7.00

Pianist #9 was


https://www.amazon.com/Chopin-Ballades-Funebre-Funeral-Trauermarsch/dp/B00000E53C

In Four Ballades and Sonata No. 2, Andrei Gavrilov stars as Frédéric Chopin, a struggling high school chemistry teacher from Albuquerque, New Mexico, diagnosed with inoperable lung cancer. He turns to a life of crime, producing and selling crystallised methamphetamine to secure his family's financial future before he dies, while navigating the dangers of the criminal world. Although this album has been widely praised, some question the historical accuracy of Gavrilov's portrayal, noting, for example, that Chopin was Polish.

Pianist #2 was


https://www.amazon.com/Chopin-Ballades-Impromptus-Stanislav-Bunin/dp/B00ZDGPSXK/

Onetime adult movie star, Saturday Night Live alumnus, independent presidential candidate in Russia's 1991 elections and heir to the vast Neuhaus fortune, Stanislav Bunin was a well-known figure in the West for some years and expected to become a pianist of some import. However, charges of tax evasion—widely believed to be trumped-up by his supporters—forced him to flee to exile in Japan, where he now avoids the limelight for the most part apart from occasional photos and videos of him at the piano posted to his Instagram account.



In 7th place: Pianist #7 with 5.44


http://www.deccaclassics.com/fr/cat/4632932
(only existing photo pre-transformation)

The Castle Károlyi on the surface appears to be merely a gloomy, ancient dungeon falling into long disrepair. However, when night falls, Julian von Károlyi rises from his crypt to stalk the Transylvanian countryside and drink the blood of the living, striking fear into the hearts of local villagers. An ancient, terrifying vampire, Károlyi can only be defeated by a stake to the heart, a silver bullet blessed by a priest of Orthodox faith, or a negative review from ClassicsToday. His preference for playing the piano instead of the organ is seen as somewhat of an eccentricity by local neighbours such as Count Dracula and Count von Count.



In 6th place: Pianist #1 with 5.30


https://www.amazon.com/Chopin-Four-Ballades-Scherzos/dp/B0001B0A8A/

An American homicide detective from Dallas, Texas, Stephen Hough was escorting John F. Kennedy's killer Lee Harvey Oswald to a county prison when Oswald was himself fatally shot by Jack Ruby. According to Hough, he leaned over Oswald and said, "Son, you're hurt real bad. Do you wanna say anything?" Oswald looked at Hough for a second, like he was thinking. Then he said, "Your Chopin ballades are too mannered. I greatly prefer Julian von Károlyi's", before shutting his eyes for the final time.



In 5th place: Pianist #6 with 5.00


https://www.amazon.com/VIRTUOSO-Ballades-Scherzi-Claudio-Arrau/dp/B00D2PB36U/r

Although it's somewhat uncertain as to which of the 6 cats in a trench coat operated the hands of the now definitively fraudulent pianist "Claudio Arrau", musicologists now believe it was this one, rather than the one depicted on the cover of Arrau's collected Liszt recordings ("Arrau 1"). Tentatively dubbed "Arrau 3", this 8-year-old female tabby was capable of reproducing the majority of Arrau's repertoire when outfitted with a pair of prosthetic hands. A search is still ongoing for "Arrau 6", the cat believed to have operated the pedals.



In 4th place: Pianist #5 with 4.90


https://www.amazon.com/Chopin-Piano-Concerto-No-Ballades/dp/B01LXRAQZQ/

Seong-Jin Cho got a somewhat late start on piano playing due to being forced to live in a closet under the stairs by his adoptive parents. However, after dozens of owls began to flood their residence and Michel Béroff informed him "Yer a pianist, Seong-Jin", he found himself waiting on Platform 9 3/4 to the Paris Conservatoire, befriending a redheaded boy named Jan Lisiecki and gradually learning more about the strange new world he had been thrust into, and the origins of the mysterious scar on his forehead that is conveniently not visible in the above photograph. The rest is, of course, history.



In 3rd place: Pianist #3 with 3.70


https://www.amazon.com/Cortot-Vol-5/dp/B000M2DNTQ/

There was a common myth during his lifetime that Cortot was a vampire, presumably due to the hungry, haunted, empty-eyed photographs that have circulated for decades. Although he never totally dispelled these rumours himself, careful examination of this photo should be enough to suggest an alternative hypothesis. Notice the unnatural length of the head, the size and shape of the overcoat—evidently concealing a quite significant amount of mass—and the angles of the head and limbs. It should be all too clear that Cortot's human form was merely a clever disguise, and he was in fact a xenomorph. His death thus should be attributed not to a David Hurwitz skewering, but rather Sigourney Weaver with a flamethrower. Please also see my more extensive paper in Analecta Musicologica, vol. 47 examining the existing biographical evidence and photographs in more detail and offering side-by-side comparisons of Cortot photographs and various shots of the creature from Alien, Aliens and Alien vs. Predator. I am sure you will be as convinced as I was.



In 2nd place: Pianist #8 with 3.00


https://www.amazon.com/Chopin-Ballades-Barcarolle-Sharp-Fantasy/dp/B000001G8Q/

Some absolutely true facts about Krystian Zimerman:
- Krystian Zimerman once played La Campanella with his toes.
- Krystian Zimerman has 3 facial expressions, and they all mean "better than you".
- Krystian Zimerman has wrestled a bear to a draw. The bear is now his page-turner.
- Krystian Zimerman single-handedly ended the US-Iraq war with a performance of a Szymanowski etude. This also caused the re-election of Barack Obama.
- When Krystian Zimerman was three, he destroyed his first piano with an overly energetic performance of Beethoven's Hammerklavier Sonata. He has destroyed or ruined another 76 pianos since then. The current piano he travels everywhere with is in fact made of diamonds, that being the only substance tough enough to withstand his performances.
- There are rumours that Krystian Zimerman once played a wrong note, but immediately stopped the performance, and ordered the entire audience to be executed so that word would not spread.



In 1st place: Pianist #4 with 2.82


https://www.amazon.com/Mozart-Sonata-Beethoven-Chopin-Ballades/dp/B00004VSDK/

Nicknamed the "Neapolitan Horowitz" for her resemblance to Winona Horowitz (now known as Winona Ryder), Maria Tipo has maintained a relatively low profile after winning a Golden Globe Award and several Academy Award nominations in the 1990s—she has been open about her difficult relationship with Giovanni Depo and struggles with mental health—but recently reappeared in the Netflix original series Cose più strane as Gioia Bieria, the troubled mother of 11-year-old Guillermo who disappears into a parallel dimension after a strange creature escapes from a nearby lab.


Ok! That's it!

Hope you guys had fun! And no Jessop I'm not paying up, gambling is a sin. Go to church.

ComposerOfAvantGarde

WELL! That was fun! Thank you very very much amw for all your effort and reading the results after all the reactions and speculation from the GMG crowd certainly has been entertaining. 8)

mc ukrneal

Thanks for all that. I think I shall be acquiring some Zimerman!
Be kind to your fellow posters!!

Brian

Quote from: amw on February 12, 2017, 06:43:04 PM
About the results

Pretty much what I expected.

About the method

I averaged the relative positions of the excerpts across all the voters. High scores reflect relative positions averaging closer to 1st place, lower scores reflect relative positions averaging closer to the bottom. So the lower the score of an excerpt, the better.

The actual results
...

Post of the Year.

I laughed out loud so much it's embarrassing.

P.S. Knee-jerk reaction thought: Stephen Hough's recording sounds at least 20 years older than it is. I really strongly dislike the cold, bloodless way Hyperion records pianos, as do certain pianist vampires in our midst.

ComposerOfAvantGarde

Quote from: Brian on February 12, 2017, 07:02:19 PM
Post of the Year.

I laughed out loud so much it's embarrassing.

P.S. Knee-jerk reaction thought: Stephen Hough's recording sounds at least 20 years older than it is. I really strongly dislike the cold, bloodless way Hyperion records pianos, as do certain pianist vampires in our midst.

I agree with everything here............yet another problem I have with Hyperion.

ComposerOfAvantGarde

Quote from: mc ukrneal on February 12, 2017, 06:58:26 PM
Thanks for all that. I think I shall be acquiring some Zimerman!

Yeah, especially since looking at the current price tag in the link of the Maria Tipo recording! :o

kishnevi

Quote from: jessop on February 12, 2017, 07:18:42 PM
Yeah, especially since looking at the current price tag in the link of the Maria Tipo recording! :o

Just ordered a different (I presume) but much cheaper Tipo performance of the Ballades.
[asin]B00ISH1ZCO[/asin]

amw

I have no idea why the Tipo set is out of print seeing as it's now been proven to be objectively the best. It can, obviously, be obtained extralegally, but I would never encourage that kind of behaviour.

There is indeed another set of Tipo Ballades out there (studio rather than live I think) which I don't know, and have been considering outlaying a quantity of cash for.

Quote from: Brian on February 12, 2017, 07:02:19 PM
P.S. Knee-jerk reaction thought: Stephen Hough's recording sounds at least 20 years older than it is. I really strongly dislike the cold, bloodless way Hyperion records pianos, as do certain pianist vampires in our midst.
It does happen to be one of my favourites—I enjoy the tough-talking Texan cop's mannerisms quite a bit—but yeah, the sound really doesn't make much of a case for it. Hyperion's recording process consists of using a single microphone located approximately 25,000 light-years away from the performer, which evidently doesn't always yield great results.

kishnevi

Quote from: amw on February 12, 2017, 07:34:43 PM


There is indeed another set of Tipo Ballades out there (studio rather than live I think) which I don't know, and have been considering outlaying a quantity of cash for.


If it's the one I ordered, you may pay more for the shipping charge than the CD. Amazon MP price started at about $4 plus s/h