Topic: John Cage (1912-92)

[T. D.]

https://www.woodstockart.org/events/johncage-433-magnusson-benevento-larson/

Marco Benevento, Kay Larson, and Norm Magnusson
John Cage’s 4’33”
Virtual event
Sat. August 29, time TBA | FREE
Announcing the WAAM 10th Annual anniversary performance of John Cage’s 4’33”
When: Saturday, August 29, 2020, 6:00pm
Where: Streaming live from the Towbin Wing Gallery of the Woodstock Artists Association,
viewable online through zoom link

Featuring: the musical talents of Marco Benevento and the insights of Cage biographer Kay Larson.
Produced by: Norm Magnussen

The event will include a performance of 4’33, followed by a talk by Kay Larson. Marco Benevento will then pay [sic] some pieces of his own choosing.

Cage’s piece had its world debut on August 29, 1952, in Woodstock, during a concert program produced by The Woodstock Artists Association.

I live about an hour's drive from the venue, would likely attend if not for the pandemic.

[Mandryka]

What is Music for Eight? I can’t find it listed here

https://johncage.org/pp/John-Cage-Works.cfm

[T. D.]

What is Music for Eight? I can’t find it listed here

https://johncage.org/pp/John-Cage-Works.cfm

It's Music for ...

I have this recording, and also a Music for Seventeen version on the old Mosko/SF Contemporary/Newport Classics release.
Quoting notes (by Alan Rich) from the latter,

"Music for ... can be performed by an indeterminate number of players (17 in this case). There is no written-down score, only a set of parts for flute, clarinet, trombone, three percussion, piano, violin and cello...(discussion of time brackets)..."

Notes to the Ensemble Avantgarde recording say that it's OK to omit some of the parts, which is good since otherwise Music for Eight would be impossible (9 parts listed above). 

It's included at your link: https://johncage.org/pp/John-Cage-Work-Detail.cfm?work_ID=133

which lists 17 available parts  . Presumably revised since the date of the Mosko liner notes.

[Mandryka]

It's Music for ...

I have this recording, and also a Music for Seventeen version on the old Mosko/SF Contemporary/Newport Classics release.
Quoting notes (by Alan Rich) from the latter,

"Music for ... can be performed by an indeterminate number of players (17 in this case). There is no written-down score, only a set of parts for flute, clarinet, trombone, three percussion, piano, violin and cello...(discussion of time brackets)..."

Notes to the Ensemble Avantgarde recording say that it's OK to omit some of the parts, which is good since otherwise Music for Eight would be impossible (9 parts listed above). 

It's included at your link: https://johncage.org/pp/John-Cage-Work-Detail.cfm?work_ID=133

which lists 17 available parts  . Presumably revised since the date of the Mosko liner notes.

Ah! 

[Mandryka]

Very good video recording here of Ryoanji

https://vimeo.com/353639460

[arpeggio]

I subscribe to the Digital Concert Hall.

On November20, 2020 the Berlin Philharmonic perform 4'33" with Kirill Petrenko actually conducting the work while the orchestra members just sat there. 

When they finished the audience applauded and nobody booed.

[Mandryka]

“Suzuki taught that the ego, through its process of embracing things that pleased it and rejecting the rest, closed itself off from the experiences of the world in toto. Therefore, one had to eliminate a bondage to judgements in order to apprehend the totality of existence.”

“He then spoke of two qualities: unimpededness and interpenetration. Unimpededness is seeing that in all of space each thing and each human being is at the center and furthermore that each one being at the center is the most honored one of all. Interpenetration means that each one of the most honored ones of all is moving out in all directions penetrating and being penetrated by every other one no matter what the time or what the space. So that when one says that there is no cause and effect, what is meant is that there are an incalculable infinity of causes and effects, that in fact each and every thing in all of time and space is related to each and every other thing in all of time and space. This being so there is no need to cautiously proceed in dualistic terms of success and failure or the beautiful and the ugly or good and evil, but rather simply to walk on ‘not wondering’, to quote Meister Eckhart, ‘Am I right or doing something wrong.’”

— John Cage (Critical Lives) by Rob Haskins

I think this recording, which is live, by Tania Chen, is extremely good. She comes from a performance tradition in experimental music, she is an experienced improviser and she makes sense of text and graphic scores, I wonder if all of that helps make something interesting to hear out of Music of Changes.
.

[Mandryka]

I want to ask the assembled Cageans a question.

Do you think that when you hear John Cage’s music it sounds like John Cage’s music? Is there a distinctive Cagean character and aesthetic sensibility which manifests itself in a faithful performance of his scores?

[milk]

This article might be of interest. Incidentally, I have been enjoying the numbered pieces a lot lately.

https://www.theguardian.com/music/2021/aug/25/how-john-cage-the-great-disrupter-had-the-last-laugh-by-writing-beautiful-music

A quote:

In the summer of 1990 John Cage gave a lecture at the International New Music gathering in Darmstadt, Germany, and effectively admitted defeat. The then 76-year-old US composer announced that his philosophical ideas of freedom and collaboration, concepts built into his avant garde musical compositions since the 1950s, had failed to influence reality. The world had got worse, not better. It was “a life spent … beating my head against a wall”, he announced. There was, however, one consolation. “I no longer consider it necessary to find alternatives to harmony,” he said. “After all these years I am finally writing beautiful music.” Cage was referring to his Number Pieces...

[T. D.]

Still thinking about the Apartment House box, trending more positive after listening to Youtube clips.

Starting to get more comfortable with the idea of overdubbed recordings, I was pondering the question  "What would Cage think about overdubbing?"
Didn't find an answer, but stumbled upon a fascinating (IMO) paper:

https://mtosmt.org/issues/mto.17.23.4/mto.17.23.4.andersen.html

This explores automated performances and Monte Carlo simulations of number pieces! Really cool (again IMO) ideas, haven't summoned up the courage to download the ZIP files but am strongly considering it.

[hvbias]

I've been listening to more Cage, for me it was easier to transition to his music after lots of Feldman over the last few years. Two and Winter Music are the ones that have been in my most heavy rotation. I ordered the latter from Another Timbre, my current one is the four piano recording on Hat Hut. Incredibly high dynamic range recording that is hard to listen to on headphones which is how I like a lot of these kind of compositions.