The Snyprrr Appreciation Thread.

[Karl Henning]

Me too. But I could also see that others might have a hard time ignoring some of that stuff. There were always hateful comments hidden amongst the stream-of-consciousness bits of amusement.

There are mighty few turd-in-the-punch-bowl artistes to vie with ol' snypsss.

[Gurn Blanston]

I am one of the very few GMG members who have actually lived in a regime where freely speaking one's own mind was a risky business that not unfrequently could have landed one in jail, or worse, so I am particularly sensitive to the issue of free speech. Therefore, allowing for many of his posts being sheer incoherent rants, I find the decision to moderate each and every future post of his greatly exaggerated; I know the moderators will not agree and will protest to the contrary, but I can't help saying that it smells like censorship to me.

By writing this I don't want to get into a polemic: just wanted to say that for someone who has experienced censorship first hand seeing it (or the appearance of it) even on an innocuous and inconsequential internet forum* is disturbing.

* seriously now, does anyone really believe that snyprrr's posts, read at most by a handful of people and taken seriously by even less, are so dangerous and socially disruptive as to warrant the moderators taking the trouble to expurgate them ad usum GMGi? Obnoxious to some people they certainly are, but if this is a criterion for "censoring" or banning them, then we should all cease posting altogether because pretty much everything we say could be potentially obnoxious to someone, somewhere.

Furthermore, as Jens said, Snyprrrr's posts could have been easily ignored altogether, but it seems to me that at least one person took a guilty pleasure in reading and replying to almost each and every one of them.

My two cents and I'm not going to pursue the matter any further. (Note to moderators: I mean no offense to you, gentlemen, and I hope you won't take any.)

The whole reason I came here was to escape from Boards that allowed 'anything goes'. I was tired of the put downs, insults, rudeness, cruelty, bullying, general offensiveness, etc. that could be found on some other forums (specifically, one other forum). The moderation of the site is something we all agreed to when we signed up.

I look at everything with a bit of a different light though. Are there posts on the site that would dissuade anyone from joining the site? And while I can confidently say that most music threads do not have posts that would turn anyone away or off, I cannot say the same about many non-music threads. I think we lose members (or potential members) in this way.

Well, I do take a little bit, actually. As Neal says,  anything goes is not an answer. There are places for that. We allow far more than many places, but far less than others. I think that's a good balance. We allow 'fuck Shostakovich', but we don't allow 'fuck Florestan'. I'm sure you can appreciate the difference.

And once again, as I do every 5 years or so, I remind all members that 'free speech' and censorship are not a legitimate issue, they are straw men. This is a privately owned and operated forum, not affiliated with any governmental agency, and you are here by mutual consent.

Any member that we get dozens (literally dozens, not figuratively) of complaints about needs to be dealt with in some way. The current situation is the best compromise we could come up with, with the extremes being 'do nothing' and 'banish permanently'. The other middling choices were already exhausted years ago.

How can anyone be reassured that you've made the right decision?

What do you want me to say? I always make the right decision? Well, actually I usually do, to be honest. Sometimes not. And what's right for some is wrong for others, so how can you even know? I can tell you this; you still see 90-95% of all his posts, just like looking back through you still see 80-85% of all his posts. The ones you don't see, I would say you will still sleep well tonight without them.

Let's put this issue to bed. There could very well come a day when Snipper's double-secret probation comes to an end.  Meanwhile, at least he hasn't committed seppuku yet...

[San Antone]

Gurn, I just want you to know that I (and I am sure many others) appreciate the often thankless job you and the other moderators do, on a daily basis.  The rest of us just come here and read and post.  But y'all can't just do that, but have to involve yourselves with overseeing our behavior.

Thanks.

[Gurn Blanston]

Gurn, I just want you to know that I (and I am sure many others) appreciate the often thankless job you and the other moderators do, on a daily basis.  The rest of us just come here and read and post.  But y'all can't just do that, but have to involve yourselves with overseeing our behavior.

Thanks.

Thank you. I wonder sometimes, when people complain about the level of moderation in other venues, whether they actually realize how free they are here. Nothing can be seamless, but we do have a go at that.

[bhodges]

Just wanted to add that yes, the mods do discuss these issues, and no, none of us wants extra time spent on them, or extra work in moderating someone. Like most people here, I am interested in talking about music.

If someone is repeatedly called into question -- and by different members (yes, we note and discuss constant complainers, too) -- then we take action. Often that action is behind the scenes, especially if someone is basically a good egg, but for some reason has had a temporary outage. We want to resolve the problem, not have it fester.

It's a balancing act, which doesn't always work out neatly. But I would like to think that, as people go, the four of us have common sense -- which to be sure, can also fail now and then.

Our Australian mad scientist/creator Rob Lang has created something perhaps more successful than he dreamed (and has poured more money into it than many here may realize). It is a rather well-functioning community, considering the hundreds of people here, and their diverse approaches to listening. (And believe me, apropos the "fuck Shostakovich" example, as a Bruckner fan, I am used to abuse.  )

In any case, carry on. Now more than ever, given the rotten state of the world, it's important to affirm the things that are important in life. And snyprrrr will survive (he's still here, after all).

--Bruce

[bhodges]

Gurn, I just want you to know that I (and I am sure many others) appreciate the often thankless job you and the other moderators do, on a daily basis.  The rest of us just come here and read and post.  But y'all can't just do that, but have to involve yourselves with overseeing our behavior.

Thanks.

Thank you. As volunteer jobs go, this isn't exactly feeding the hungry but it's a worthy activity anyway. And most people here (98%) go for years -- YEARS -- without any intervention of any type.

--Bruce

[Karl Henning]

[...] And most people here (98%) go for years -- YEARS -- without any intervention of any type.

--Bruce

How is that medically possibly? 

[prémont]

How is that medically possibly? 

[bhodges]

How is that medically possibly? 

 

Ah, the miracles of modern medicine...

--Bruce

[Florestan]

We allow 'fuck Shostakovich', but we don't allow 'fuck Florestan'. I'm sure you can appreciate the difference.

I certainly do, but as far as I can remember snyprrr did not "fuck" any member, on the contrary, it's he who's been a constant target of derision and abuse. I might be wrong, though.

[Gurn Blanston]

I certainly do, but as far as I can remember snyprrr did not "fuck" any member, on the contrary, it's he who's been a constant target of derision and abuse. I might be wrong, though.

That's true, you might be wrong.

[Mandryka]

I certainly do, but as far as I can remember snyprrr did not "fuck" any member, on the contrary, it's he who's been a constant target of derision and abuse. I might be wrong, though.

Yes. This sounds right. But maybe I'm wrong.

[Mandryka]

Ah it looks as though many people are saying similar things at the same time!

Anyway, let's hope that the knife hasn't been stuck in unfairly.

[Mandryka]

It's a balancing act, which doesn't always work out neatly. But I would like to think that, as people go, the four of us have common sense -- which to be sure, can also fail now and then.

Who are the four, by the way? You, Gurn Blanston, Que and who?

[amw]

http://www.good-music-guide.com/community/index.php?action=groups;sa=members;group=2

[bhodges]

Who are the four, by the way? You, Gurn Blanston, Que and who?

(Ah, I see amw beat me to the punch.)

That would be (the other!) Mike (a.k.a., knight66). We are in communication with each other regularly. The fifth mod listed, Maciek, has been too busy to really participate here much.

(PS, I just happened to see this -- we don't see every post on the board, by a long shot. For me, the percentage is probably 2-3%, a fraction of what is posted. So a better way of calling something to our attention is by private message. Just a friendly reminder... )

--Bruce

[André]

Thank you. I wonder sometimes, when people complain about the level of moderation in other venues, whether they actually realize how free they are here. Nothing can be seamless, but we do have a go at that.

Freedom of opinion is not quite the same as freedom of speech. There is a way to say things - especially negative or contentious ones - that allows every member to feel safe expressing his/herself. I firmly believe all members have a personal responsibility in maintaining that balance. Nobody here is special, but collectively we all are.

[Que]

Freedom of opinion is not quite the same as freedom of speech. There is a way to say things - especially negative or contentious ones - that allows every member to feel safe expressing his/herself. I firmly believe all members have a personal responsibility in maintaining that balance. Nobody here is special, but collectively we all are.

Hear, hear, André!    And actually the reason there is so little need for any moderating is that the members of this forum take that responsibility seriously, resulting in a friendly atmosphere. Something we should be proud of.

Q

[Zeus]

The problem with heavily moderated and/or edited fora is that the process itself creates an expectation that slights will be quickly addressed and fairness will be constantly maintained. Of course, this is impossible, both in terms of responding to running commentary and in terms of editing the historical record.  Instead, the forum becomes an excruciating exercise in he-said-she-said navel-gazing, where perceived slights tend to get amplified rather than assuaged (cough-TC-cough).

I think the very-light-touch style of moderation exercised by Gurn et al. is terrific and keeps the focus mainly on-topic.  Even the perpetual ability to edit and/or delete one's own prior posts is helpful.  I trust them to continue to do their reasonable best, and to continue to make reasonably good decisions going forward.

So thank you guys!  I wish I could buy you a beer.

Back to the music....

[Karl Henning]

We've certainly been indulgent of snypsss to a degree which the present outcry about his supposed victimization fails to own