Bruno Walter - The Complete Columbia Recordings - and previous masterings

[vmartell]

Hello,


So, finally got around to getting the recent Sony big box of Bruno Walter's Complete Columbia Recordings. It does seem definitive - as per the included book, they all are new remasters.  One of the first things I listened was actually compare the early Beethoven with the NY Phil (or whatever name it had then, including Columbia Symphony) with the later Stereo Beethoven.

That did remind me. I have  the impression that the early recordings were not officially available, given the number of alternative sources for them. Of those the one I remember the most was M&A's

https://www.musicandarts.com/bruno-walter-s-beethoven.html


However, never got around to getting them  - having to order from outside the USA, the price, and well, the fact that the stereo cycle is great,  ended up not being a priority...

But, got curious. For those of you that have both, how do the new official remasters  from the big box compare to the M&A (and possible others)?  Better ? Worse? Different? For those of us that have the big box - do we have now the definitive versions of those recordings?

Thnx!

v

[Todd]

For those of you that have both, how do the new official remasters  from the big box compare to the M&A (and possible others)?

I have the United Archives mono LvB cycle.  The Sony Complete box sounds better - cleaner at all frequencies, less blubby bass.  I prefer the sound in some of the mono recordings to some of the stereo ones.  The improvement in some of the stereo recordings is minimal or non-existent.

[Daverz]

I was really impressed with some of the mono transfers, e.g Mahler 5 and Dvorak 8.

[Jo498]

Is Mahler 5 a different transfer from the cheapo white Sony Walter/Mahler box of a few years ago?

[Holden]

I have the M&A LvB symphonies and am reasonably happy with the sound for a mono recording. Am relistening to it now and while Can't compare it to the set you refer to it's good quality given its provenance.

[vmartell]

Is Mahler 5 a different transfer from the cheapo white Sony Walter/Mahler box of a few years ago?

All transfers are *SUPPOSED* to be new - at least that is the blanket statement in the nice book the set comes with - from my understanding, the cheapie box has the same transfers as the Bruno Walter Edition, that is, the SBM (or whatever it is called - you know, one of those things that they tell us make CDs better, like XRCD, etc) master from the... well... I won't get into dates but it has been around a bit and do not wanna google... the only thing is that that mostly they favoured the stereo versions, so mostly the SBM masters will be of the stereo stuff, unless, of course, they did not have an equivalent stereo, hence the SBM Mahler 4th, 5th and other stuff I do not remember - have  my Bruno Walter Edition in storage, so hard to get to...

Anyone know what are the sources for the Beethoven Symphonies M&A are? Are all from 78s?  I am not an expert - mostly ignorant, actually - on early recording technology, so not sure what those pieces were originally recorded on - suspect some of the later ones were recorded on tape, so, well, that would be advantage to the new set. Other  things like Beethoven 1st sound very early... maybe those are from... what are they called? matrices? (not sure what those are...)

v

[Daverz]

Anyone know what are the sources for the Beethoven Symphonies M&A are? Are all from 78s?  I am not an expert - mostly ignorant, actually - on early recording technology, so not sure what those pieces were originally recorded on - suspect some of the later ones were recorded on tape, so, well, that would be advantage to the new set. Other  things like Beethoven 1st sound very early... maybe those are from... what are they called? matrices? (not sure what those are...)

The symphony recordings from the 40s would have been "waxed".  Sony may have had metal parts for these.  The later New York recordings would have been on tape.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_sound_recording#The_Electrical_Era_(1925_to_1945)_(including_sound_on_film)

The M&A set would have been from 78s or early LPs. 

[staxomega]

All transfers are *SUPPOSED* to be new - at least that is the blanket statement in the nice book the set comes with - from my understanding, the cheapie box has the same transfers as the Bruno Walter Edition, that is, the SBM (or whatever it is called - you know, one of those things that they tell us make CDs better, like XRCD, etc) master from the... well... I won't get into dates but it has been around a bit and do not wanna google... the only thing is that that mostly they favoured the stereo versions, so mostly the SBM masters will be of the stereo stuff, unless, of course, they did not have an equivalent stereo, hence the SBM Mahler 4th, 5th and other stuff I do not remember - have  my Bruno Walter Edition in storage, so hard to get to...

Anyone know what are the sources for the Beethoven Symphonies M&A are? Are all from 78s?  I am not an expert - mostly ignorant, actually - on early recording technology, so not sure what those pieces were originally recorded on - suspect some of the later ones were recorded on tape, so, well, that would be advantage to the new set. Other  things like Beethoven 1st sound very early... maybe those are from... what are they called? matrices? (not sure what those are...)

v

I don't think any of the transfers are shared with the Bruno Walter Edition box set. I thought the sound on the Bruno Walter Edition box was quite poor with how much they killed the high end to remove tape hiss, and I haven't heard anything like that in The Complete Columbia Recordings box, this box sounds damn fine.