Suggestion reguarding Giulio Cesare.

[Anne]

I know Anne, that is why I decided on remaining in my obscurity.

Mike

LOL! 

[Josquin des Prez]

I know you are ref. to Handel, but since you are interested in a DVD of this certain opera your quote could be applied to the stage director, who also didn't mind submitting to the tastes of his day: The present! No castrati and Cesare in a contemporary street suit. Would you buy this DVD?

No bloody way.

[Josquin des Prez]

Of course he had an eye to the business side of things, that does not mean he was prepared to take on practices that he did not think he could make work artistically.

Then why are many of his works so... inconsistent? His music is simply too variable to accept the idea he always tried to keep his
artistic integrity. It seems to me he never really cared much either way, when genius flowed it was in spite of himself and he had no real control over his inspiration.

it does not seem to be a problem to most of the rest of us.

That's what troubles me. I mean, we have people here who would have us believe Mozart's early symphonies are great as his late ones, or that Telemann was a genius. I don't trust them anymore.

[knight66]

I mean, we have people here who would have us to believe Mozart's early symphonies are great as his late ones, or that Telemann was a genius. I don't trust them anymore.

Wise.....don't go into any dark lanes with these people either.

Mike

[T-C]

Then why are many of his works so... inconsistent? His music is simply too variable to accept the idea he always tried to keep his
artistic integrity. It seems to me he never really cared much either way, when genius flowed it was in spite of himself and he had no real control over his inspiration.

I couldn't disagree more.

Many of his works are inconsistent? I have in my collection 25 of Handel's operas, about 15 of his oratorios and many other works. I got totally another impression of his abilities. While I cannot say that all of these works are masterpieces (but IMO not all of Bach's 200 cantatas are masterpieces...), many of them are: Giulio Cesare, Rodelinda, Tamerlano, Alcina, Aroidante, Serse, Semele, Saul, Hercules, Theodora, to name just a few. And these great works are enough to secure his position as the greatest opera composer of the late baroque. I have no doubts about his genius. And his dramatic senses are unique.

I was never bothered at all with the fact that women are singing in male roles. I concentrate in the music. Handel did not invented Opera Seria or the operatic conventions of his period. Many of the Dacapo arias are highly decorated and they are sung more effectively and brilliantly by high voices than by baritones and basses. Other composers were using these conventions before Handel or during his lifetime (Vivaldi), but with less brilliance and imagination. Handel brought the opera seria idiom to its apex. By the use of his great genius and dramatic sense he was able to enrich the old and rigid patterns with brilliant music that has a very wide spectrum of expression for human feelings.

Lis, I will definitely purchase the new Giulio Cesare DVD with Scholl... 

[Harry Collier]

Other composers were using these conventions before Handel or during his lifetime (Vivaldi), but with less brilliance and imagination. Handel brought the opera seria idiom to its apex.

Probably much truth in this. However, I have just been given Philippe Jaroussky's CD of 15 arias of "Vivalidi's Heroes" from the operas and have been quite bowled over by the music (as well as the incredible singing). I have long loved Handel's operas, but never really connected opera with "the four seasons man".

[T-C]

I have long loved Handel's operas, but never really connected opera with "the four seasons man".

These days, there is a huge renaissance and interest in Vivaldi operatic output and new recordings of Vivaldi operas are released quite frequently. I have a few. Vivaldi operas have usually very long secco recitatives and most of the arias are fast and extremely brilliant technically with very difficult coloratura passages, but sometimes lack (IMO) in depth of expression.

In Handel's operas the recitatives are relatively short and the arias convey a larger scope of expression and moods. Around half of the arias and duets in Handel dramatic works are slow with the 'heavenly' quality, which make Handel's music so irresistible for me. But of course, Vivaldi's operas are loaded with wonderful musical pieces too. Fabio Biondi's recording of Bajazet (Virgin Classics) is a very good example. A beautiful opera in a stunning performance. 

[uffeviking]

Lis, I will definitely purchase the new Giulio Cesare DVD with Scholl... 

One of my reasons for buying this performance is the fact, everyone of the usually deleted 'repeats' are there. If Handel thought it necessary to repeat certain sections, who are the director or conductor to decide it's 'surplus'. After all, we are dealing with a Handel opera not an issue of Reader's Digest! 

[knight66]

Is there a Reader's Digest version of Siegfried please?

Mike

[Tsaraslondon]

One of my reasons for buying this performance is the fact, everyone of the usually deleted 'repeats' are there. If Handel thought it necessary to repeat certain sections, who are the director or conductor to decide it's 'surplus'. After all, we are dealing with a Handel opera not an issue of Reader's Digest! 

True, but remember that conditions in Handel's day were very different. Audiences did not sit reverentially and quietly throughout the whole opera. Going to the opera was as much a social event as a cultural one, and many audience members would come in and out during the course of the opera. One the reasons why Handel, and the composers of his day, thought it necessary to repeat certain sections was to make sure people didn't miss too much.

[Harry Collier]

One of my reasons for buying this performance is the fact, everyone of the usually deleted 'repeats' are there. If Handel thought it necessary to repeat certain sections, who are the director or conductor to decide it's 'surplus'. After all, we are dealing with a Handel opera not an issue of Reader's Digest!

Don't forget that in Handel's time he would assume that his audience -- there to talk, be entertained and to socialise, for the most part -- would only hear the work once in their entire lives. Repeating good bits would therefore be a way of driving home a given melody. Repeats in Handel are often there for practical rather than structural reasons. (I am certainly not overlooking the fact that repeats can also frequently be there for structural reasons, in much music).

Fast-forward to 2007 and to a world of CDs and DVDs, some of the urgency is taken out of the practical need to repeat material. So I think that repeats in Handel should only be made where they are necessary and make sense.

[Marc]

I think you are giving Handel too much credit. He may have been a genius, but he had no scruples sacrificing his artistry for profit, and didn't mind submitting to the questionable tastes of his day (from what i gathered it seems the use of castrati supplanted traditional male voices starting from 1680, so it's not like it's always been there). There's no wonder Bach gave the entire genre a miss (despise his relentless determination in mastering every form known to him, including secular ones), he was probably appalled by it.

Bach?
O yes, that fellow who composed church music only for boys and men? You mean, that fellow who wrote the alto aria (with choir) "Ach, nun ist mein Jesus hin?" for a boy or male alto and lets the choir ask (according to the bible word): "wo ist denn dein Freund hingegangen, o du schönste unter den Weibern?" And was the part of Mary Magdalene in the Oster Oratorio sung by a woman? Think not, the Lutherian church would never have allowed that, and Bach would have lost his job. Yes, Bach may have been a genius, but he had no scruples sacrificing his artistry for profit, and didn't mind submitting to the questionable church-related tastes of his day.