Karol Szymanowski (1882-1937)

[Maciek]

There are two that I'm aware of, there might be more. One is with Stefania Woytowicz and Warsaw Phil under Rowicki, the other is Izabela Kłosińska with Polish Radio SO under Kazimierz Kord (a complete symphonies twofer). Both of these are out of print, I'm afraid...

[vandermolen]

There are two that I'm aware of, there might be more. One is with Stefania Woytowicz and Warsaw Phil under Rowicki, the other is Izabela Kłosińska with Polish Radio SO under Kazimierz Kord (a complete symphonies twofer). Both of these are out of print, I'm afraid...

Thanks very much.

[Scarpia]

I brought DVD up on another thread and it got a positive comment.  Any thoughts from the Szymanowski fanatics.



I was considering the Boulez release, then I realized they are charging for a full-price 2CD set when only the first CD contains music.  No thank!

[Mirror Image]

I was considering the Boulez release, then I realized they are charging for a full-price 2CD set when only the first CD contains music.  No thanks!

Thankfully, I didn't pay full price for the Boulez Szymanowski recording. I paid around $16 for mine. The packaging is some of the best I've seen from Deutsche Grammophon in awhile. Beautiful pictures and the liner notes are excellent, but all this wouldn't mean much if the performances weren't any good, but they are. Some of the best Szymanowski I've heard. Clearly Boulez has a superior orchestra at his command and the results are stunning. As I mentioned earlier, Christian Tetzlaff does great service to the Violin Concerto No. 1. The sound quality is also top-notch. The second disc is a great 15-minute interview and given that Boulez is in his mid-80s now this special addition to the recording is a great bonus. Great to hear this brilliant mind reflect on this wrongly neglected composer. Hopefully, this new recording will signal a new interest in Szymanowski's music.

P. S. You don't have to pay full price for this recording. You can buy it from an Amazon Marketplace seller for cheaper. If you're at all interested in this composer and like his music, then this recording is essential in my opinion.

[Maciek]

MI, which recordings of the 3rd and VC are you comparing Boulez to?

[Mirror Image]

MI, which recordings of the 3rd and VC are you comparing Boulez to?

Antoni Wit's and Simon Rattle's recordings for Symphony No. 3. For the Violin Concerto No. 1, I'm actually comparing several: Mordkovitch/Sinaisky, Kaler/Wit, Zehetmair/Rattle, and Juillet/Dutoit. The Tetzlaff had me in awe the entire performance. I hope Hilary Hahn tackles the Szymanowski VCs at some point. I think they are right up her alley. I'm surprised that Kyung Wha Chung, Joshua Bell, Viktoria Mullova, Gil Shaham, among others haven't played them as well. I think they're major works and deserve to be the standard violin repertoire.

Do you own the new Boulez recording, Maciek?

[snyprrr]

There are two that I'm aware of, there might be more. One is with Stefania Woytowicz and Warsaw Phil under Rowicki, the other is Izabela Kłosińska with Polish Radio SO under Kazimierz Kord (a complete symphonies twofer). Both of these are out of print, I'm afraid...

What about the one I have on Koch? It's SW too, isn't it? That's Great!

[Mirror Image]

David Hurwitz has recently reviewed the new Boulez/Szymanowski disc and he doesn't think it's that great. He has clearly lost his mind. This recording is fantastic, but so are Wit and Rattle. All three get my vote for great interpreters of this music, but I think Szymanowski is still finding an audience amongst classical fans.

[Scarpia]

David Hurwitz has recently reviewed the new Boulez/Szymanowski disc and he doesn't think it's that great. He has clearly lost his mind. This recording is fantastic, but so are Wit and Rattle. All three get my vote for great interpreters of this music, but I think Szymanowski is still finding an audience amongst classical fans.

I have most of the recordings (other than Boulez) that you list on your previous post, and haven't really had time to listen to them properly yet, so there's no rush.   They are marketing that Boulez recording pretty hard.  I suspect soon used copies from people with buyers remorse will hit the used market and I'll be able to pick it up for less than five bucks.   

[snyprrr]

I'm going to register my little complaint here. Take the SQs, for instance. KS starts each off with a molto misterioso type first mvmt, but by the finale, we are back to pretty straightforward music. Perhaps it's the same as with Glazunov, how that Composer seemed only to excel in his scherzos (broadly speaking)?

[Mirror Image]

I have most of the recordings (other than Boulez) that you list on your previous post, and haven't really had time to listen to them properly yet, so there's no rush.   They are marketing that Boulez recording pretty hard.  I suspect soon used copies from people with buyers remorse will hit the used market and I'll be able to pick it up for less than five bucks.   

I never bought into the whole marketing side of music and don't really care how DG promotes this recording. It's either a recording I want or I don't want. It's just that simple. One of Hurwitz's complaints, besides his remarks about Boulez, which seem rather one-sided and bizarre, are, interestingly enough, with DG marketing Szymanowski as some kind of new musical discovery. Whether this is true or not, holds no barring on the quality of the performances, which in my assessment are extremely good. I mean it is Boulez and the Vienna Philharmonic. Not much could have went wrong here.

Yes, I would wait around on this one Scarpia. You'll come across a used copy at some point.

[Maciek]

Antoni Wit's and Simon Rattle's recordings for Symphony No. 3. For the Violin Concerto No. 1, I'm actually comparing several: Mordkovitch/Sinaisky, Kaler/Wit, Zehetmair/Rattle, and Juillet/Dutoit.

Thanks.

Do you own the new Boulez recording, Maciek?

Nope.

[Mirror Image]

Thanks.

Hurwitz, the dean of Classical weirdness, gave the Boulez recording an 8/8, which is one of the most unjust ratings I've seen. Reading his opinions on this recording also were quite hysterical as he doesn't even have the slightest idea of what he's talking about:

http://www.classicstoday.com/review.asp?ReviewNum=13048

One of my favorite parts of this ignorant review is he wrote is this:

"Consider the Violin Concerto No. 1. It opens with an orchestral violin ostinato, sul ponticello, with flecks of color from the winds and percussion. All of this is crystal clear under Wit (Naxos or Sony), far less present under Boulez. Partly this is a function of the engineering, partly the less precise playing of the Vienna Philharmonic, partly the slightly too-quick initial tempo. If you don't know one of the more than a dozen recorded alternatives, you might not notice or care, but the reality is that listeners have better options."

He really shows his ignorance when he says that Wit's conducting is much more clearer than Boulez's. What the hell? Boulez is known for his clarity and bringing out the structure of the score. It's as if Hurwitz is forgetting who is actually conducting. Perhaps he was drunk when he wrote this review?

He also states that the Vienna Philharmonic, one of the most prestigious orchestras in the world, aren't precise because of a too quick tempo? What an idiot.

Another part of this quote that I would like to point out is when he said the reality is that listeners have better options in regards to Szymanowski recordings. Last time I checked, there haven't been that many Szymanowski recordings at all, especially of his orchestral music. He's not a household name like Debussy or Stravinsky, so any new recording that comes our way regarding this still very underrated composer is a good thing, right? Not according to Hurwitz, who runs his mouth like a moron and doesn't show the slightest insight into this composer's idiom at all.

Bottomline: the Boulez recording is essential listening and is a very welcome addition to the Szymanowski recording catalog.

[Sergeant Rock]

He really shows his ignorance when he says that Wit's conducting is much more clearer than Boulez's. What the hell? Boulez is known for his clarity and bringing out the structure of the score. It's as if Hurwitz is forgetting who is actually conducting. Perhaps he was drunk when he wrote this review?

Or perhaps he simply listened to both recordings and heard a clearer presentation in the Wit? Why not? Is Boulez god? Is Wit a hack? Why can't Wit be better...or more precisely, why can't Hurwitz prefer Wit to Boulez based on what he heard?

Another part of this quote that I would like to point out is when he said the reality is that listeners have better options in regards to Szymanowski recordings. Last time I checked, there haven't been that many Szymanowski recordings at all...

Last time I checked there were these versions of the Violin Concerto in print: Zimmermann/Wit, Steinbacher/Janowski, Zehetmair/Rattle, Plawner/Grabowski, Koh/Kalmar, Kaler/Wit, Edinger/Penderecki, Kulka/Maksymiuk, and Oistrakh. Surely there is an off chance that at least one of these might be a better option? 

Sarge

[DavidW]

I do tend to notice that whenever there is a pompous interview disc Hurwitz just flips out and it colors the rest of his review.  Check out the reviews of Zander in which Zander gives a disagreeable lecture disc and the rating there, and then check out the ones where either Hurwitz agrees with the lecture disc or there is none by the same conductor.  Hurwitz has a problem with any one presenting himself as an authority figure.  The same happens with simply liner notes of some unusual vibrato-free Mahler recordings which caused him to angrily write long tirades that he called essays.

I'm saying that because this Boulez disc has an interview and it clearly made him mad, and I read that anger as coloring the rest of his review.  

[Mirror Image]

Or perhaps he simply listened to both recordings and heard a clearer presentation in the Wit? Why not? Is Boulez god? Is Wit a hack? Why can't Wit be better...or more precisely, why can't Hurwitz prefer Wit to Boulez based on what he heard?

I never claimed that Wit was a hack nor do I think Boulez is a god. I just thought Hurwitz's review was incredibly tainted with his dislike for all things Boulez and Deutsche Grammophon and very little thought or commentary went into Boulez's recording. Why are you defending this guy? Did he bring you cookies and milk or something to sweeten you up?

Last time I checked there were these versions of the Violin Concerto in print: Zimmermann/Wit, Steinbacher/Janowski, Zehetmair/Rattle, Plawner/Grabowski, Koh/Kalmar, Kaler/Wit, Edinger/Penderecki, Kulka/Maksymiuk, and Oistrakh. Surely there is an off chance that at least one of these might be a better option?

I'm not sure where you're going with this comment. There are plenty of great performances of his first VC, but Tetzlaff is a VERY capable violinist who completely nailed this concerto and Hurwitz being the total freak he is didn't listen hard enough to the performances. The performance of Symphony No. 3 was especially fine.

P.S. You forgot to mention Mordkovitch/Sinaisky, which is a fine recording as well.

[Mirror Image]

I do tend to notice that whenever there is a pompous interview disc Hurwitz just flips out and it colors the rest of his review.  Check out the reviews of Zander in which Zander gives a disagreeable lecture disc and the rating there, and then check out the ones where either Hurwitz agrees with the lecture disc or there is none by the same conductor.  Hurwitz has a problem with any one presenting himself as an authority figure.  The same happens with simply liner notes of some unusual vibrato-free Mahler recordings which caused him to angrily write long tirades that he called essays.

I'm saying that because this Boulez disc has an interview and it clearly made him mad, and I read that anger as coloring the rest of his review.

I think Boulez is a brilliant musician and clearly understands Szymanowski's music, which is more than I can say for Hurwitz.

[abidoful]

Last time I checked there were these versions of the Violin Concerto in print: Zimmermann/Wit, Steinbacher/Janowski, Zehetmair/Rattle, Plawner/Grabowski, Koh/Kalmar, Kaler/Wit, Edinger/Penderecki, Kulka/Maksymiuk, and Oistrakh. Surely there is an off chance that at least one of these might be a better option? 

Sarge

I really like the Zehetmair/Rattle version!

[Maciek]

This new Tetzlaff recording is making me curious. I have heard (they're still somewhere on my computer) 2 live performances with Tetzlaff in the VC (Segerstam and Boulez), and felt that, at least in those specific cases, he was a bit off the mark (as I've commented earlier in this thread, his playing seemed too emotionally detached and cold for this sort of music). I wonder if his approach has changed in any way.

Besides the versions Sarge mentioned, there are also some interesting oop options. For instance, there are actually at least two different Oistrakh versions (I have Warsaw Philharmonic with Stryja and SSO USSR with Sanderling). Or Kulka with Stryja (don't know it, I have the one on EMI with Maksymiuk). Or Kaja Danczowska with the Warsaw Philharmonic under Kord (has its fervent champions). And last but not least, the version many Szymanowski aficionados swear by: Wanda Wiłkomirska with the Warsaw Philharmonic under Rowicki (an intense, almost dizzying performance - I love it).

Oh, wait, there's also Baeva and Benedetti. And probably a few more that I'm forgetting at the moment...

[Archaic Torso of Apollo]

I'm going to register my little complaint here. Take the SQs, for instance. KS starts each off with a molto misterioso type first mvmt, but by the finale, we are back to pretty straightforward music.

I had the same problem. I thought "wow, this is great, we're in fantasyland" when the music started, but by the end my enthusiasm was dissipating. Eventually I got rid of the disc (it was the Carmina 4tet - highly regarded I think). I've given Szymanowski several shots, but I just don't think he's for me.

He also states that the Vienna Philharmonic, one of the most prestigious orchestras in the world, aren't precise because of a too quick tempo? What an idiot.

I don't want to get involved in this debate, but I've noticed that Hurwitz likes to trash the VPO. It's just one of his endearing habits, along with never forgetting to mention the tam-tam