And They're Off! The Democratic Candidates for 2020

[drogulus]

And you obviously haven't comprehended that a candidate whose entire platform consists of creating new government programs and expanding existing government programs is a candidate whose platform is based on taking power from the people over their own lives and handing it over to a army of government bureaucrats, and has a platform that is the opposite of populism. If it's bad for oligarchs to control our lives, it's also bad for bureaucrats to control our lives.  I don't want a politician who can't be bought. I want a system in which it doesn't matter if politicians are bought.

     All government programs were new once and run by "armies". The purpose is to give people powers the private sector won't or can't provide them. There are good reasons for this, which is why all the blather about returning Social Security and Medicare power to the citizens supposedly disempowered by them won't happen. The model is incoherent. We don't need to re-theorize why we chose government tools. The attempts to cast deconstruction of government as giving power to citizens founders immediately. It's like imagining how OCare destruction adds to "choice" because it multiplies the ways people can be made poorer.

    Of course if you don't care how much effective freedom people have and only the abstract "rich and poor can all sleep under the same bridge" kind, why not abandon concern fakery and say "promote the general welfare" has no practical meaning?

     Even the rich who buy this for its propaganda value have not been so money poisoned that they don't see what might result if the government didn't prevent banana republicanism from rendering the entirety of their customer base impoverished.

[71 dB]

Poju, you obviously have no idea of what Americans think about Hillary. You obviously have no idea of what the various candidates stand for, or what Americans think about them.

Please stop this nonsense of me not having idea. I believe my posts here are among the most insightful. You can disagree all you want, but you need to be a hack to say I don't have idea! There are a lot of Americans who think exactly what I think. In fact when I watch Status Coup livestream where Jenn Dize interviews people after a Bernie Sanders rally I feel strong connection with these people! I really connect with their feelings of the politics in the US and how these people fight for democracy and better tomorrow. So, please leave your comments about how I don't have idea of what Americans think! Four years ago I didn't have idea. Now I have.

And you obviously haven't comprehended that a candidate whose entire platform consists of creating new government programs and expanding existing government programs is a candidate whose platform is based on taking power from the people over their own lives and handing it over to a army of government bureaucrats, and has a platform that is the opposite of populism. If it's bad for oligarchs to control our lives, it's also bad for bureaucrats to control our lives.  I don't want a politician who can't be bought. I want a system in which it doesn't matter if politicians are bought.

People don't have power! That's the damn problem! What is your power if you can't afford healthcare? What is your power if you have healthcare from your employer? You can't choose the plan, it's chosen for you and the plan limits the doctor you can visit because of networks. Your employer can use healthcare as leverage preventing you to fight for better benefits. If you go on strike, you are in danger of loosing your helthcare. If you leave your job because you don't like it you are on your own. What exactly is your power here?? Bernie can't take power away, because people don't have power. He can only GIVE power. Medicare for all removes networks so you can visit any doctor. Employers can give you better benefits because they don't have to provide healthcare. You can leave a job without loosing your healthcare. That's freedom, power to control your own life! So even with government bureaucracy medicare for all means more power for the people.

[71 dB]

Whoopi Attacked Bernie, Defended Obama for Exact Same Cuba Comments

https://www.youtube.com/v/lbZueOOUd0U

[drogulus]

People don't have power! That's the damn problem! What is your power if you can't afford healthcare? What is your power if you have healthcare from your employer? You can't choose the plan, it's chosen for you and the plan limits the doctor you can visit because of networks. Your employer can use healthcare as leverage preventing you to fight for better benefits. If you go on strike, you are in danger of loosing your helthcare. If you leave your job because you don't like it you are on your own. What exactly is your power here?? Bernie can't take power away, because people don't have power. He can only GIVE power. Medicare for all removes networks so you can visit any doctor. Employers can give you better benefits because they don't have to provide healthcare. You can leave a job without loosing your healthcare. That's freedom, power to control your own life! So even with government bureaucracy medicare for all means more power for the people.

     That a bit too absolute for my tastes, though it does refer to how power dynamics in a deep (that is, accountable to law and public welfare) state work. The goal is to enhance the degree of practical freedom of the propertied and unpropertied alike by the exercise of government power to facilitate growth and invest in a better future. Growth is best realized by expensive projects to solve the largest problems. What better direction would there be? I find it odd to imagine that we can decay our way to greater prosperity better than investing in the solutions to our most urgent needs.

    When we recover our reason and a little optimism we'll undertake the next great projects. We'll bulldoze through the howyougonnas and build the means that pays for them, just like always.

[SimonNZ]

I believe my posts here are among the most insightful.

Good god.

Lets try a different approach...What are some of the things Sanders does that, much as you love him, you wish he'd stop? More importantly: what are the occasional policies of his, though you like many, you find you still have to disagree with?

[Karl Henning]

PI believe my posts here are among the most insightful.

As Shakespeare is rumored to have said: No shit, Sherlock!

[Florestan]

I believe

Credo in unum Bernium.

[71 dB]

I think I have no choice but to simply ignore others here. If you keep thinking I am clueless I don't know what else I can do because apparently people here don't take anything I write seriously. If you behave like hacks I tread you as hacks. Just know that your opinions do not represent well the will of americans and this election will prove it to you. Then we see who is clueless and who isn't. It's pretty alarming what people here think about lefty political commentators like Kyle Kulinski. Belittle him all you want. It only demonsrates what kind of people you are. Frankly I wonder what is wrong with you. How in the World you expect me to respect you?

[Florestan]

I think I have no choice but to simply ignore others here. If you keep thinking I am clueless I don't know what else I can do because apparently people here don't take anything I write seriously. If you behave like hacks I tread you as hacks. Just know that your opinions do not represent well the will of americans and this election will prove it to you. Then we see who is clueless and who isn't. It's pretty alarming what people here think about lefty political commentators like Kyle Kulinski. Belittle him all you want. It only demonsrates what kind of people you are. Frankly I wonder what is wrong with you. How in the World you expect me to respect you?

Nice color.

[Karl Henning]

Few things funnier on this thread than a self-important Finn averring that my opinion "does not represent the will of Americans" (And he says he wonders how he can respect US.

[Karl Henning]

Interesting take by one vox.com contributor ( Dylan Matthews):

Pete Buttigieg is more electable than Bernie Sanders — and more progressive than you think

[Karl Henning]

sarahf (Sarah Frostenson, politics editor): With just one day before the South Carolina primary on Saturday, former Vice President Joe Biden has a 14 in 15 shot at winning the most votes in South Carolina, according to our forecast. He is a heavy favorite and is expected to win 39 percent of the vote, on average.

But a lot of Biden's gains in South Carolina, both in our forecast and our polling average, have come in the last several days as polls following Nevada and Tuesday night's debate have started to trickle in. Prior to this week, things had looked pretty close in South Carolina, and the model even had Sanders in the lead there prior to the Nevada caucuses.

For now, it looks like Biden has managed to reverse the trends of the past couple weeks of Sen. Bernie Sanders and billionaire Tom Steyer gaining support — in particular black support — here in South Carolina. A Monmouth poll just came out today showing Biden up by 20 points and winning black voters by almost 30 points.

But to give you some on-the-ground color for what it's like: I spent yesterday morning at the National Action Network's Ministers' Breakfast at Mount Moriah Missionary Baptist Church, a large black church in North Charleston, and what I observed in both speaking with attendees and observing the crowd's reaction was that Biden was far and away the favorite of the candidates that spoke.

In the afternoon, I went to a Sanders rally in North Charleston that — while more diverse than his New Hampshire rallies — was still very white for a state where 60 percent of the Democratic electorate is black.

[71 dB]

Few things funnier on this thread than a self-important Finn averring that my opinion "does not represent the will of Americans" (And he says he wonders how he can respect US.

How many pledged delegates does your candidate have Karl? Bernie has 45 (and after super Tuesday A LOT more). The other candidates don't even try to get the plurality of delegates at this point. They try to take enough delegates away from Bernie so that Bernie can only get plurality but not majority and there is brokered convention where they can steal the nomination from him with superdelegates. For Bernie this is a fight to get the majority of delegates so that the nomination can't be taken away. How can you say your candidate represents the will of Americans if undemocratic brokered convention is needed for nomination? Yes, some Americans do share your opinions, but you are in a minority. The amount of Americans sharing my opinions is larger and that's why my favorite candidate senator Bernand Sanders is winning and collecting at least the plurality of delegates if not the majority. Tell me Americans are not for "socialism" when Bernie stops doing well in the polls, primaries and caucuses. The corporate media has fearmongered Bernie's "socialism" for years. It hasn't worked, has it?

[JBS]

How many pledged delegates does your candidate have Karl? Bernie has 45 (and after super Tuesday A LOT more). The other candidates don't even try to get the plurality of delegates at this point. They try to take enough delegates away from Bernie so that Bernie can only get plurality but not majority and there is brokered convention where they can steal the nomination from him with superdelegates. For Bernie this is a fight to get the majority of delegates so that the nomination can't be taken away. How can you say your candidate represents the will of Americans if undemocratic brokered convention is needed for nomination? Yes, some Americans do share your opinions, but you are in a minority. The amount of Americans sharing my opinions is larger and that's why my favorite candidate senator Bernand Sanders is winning and collecting at least the plurality of delegates if not the majority. Tell me Americans are not for "socialism" when Bernie stops doing well in the polls, primaries and caucuses. The corporate media has fearmongered Bernie's "socialism" for years. It hasn't worked, has it?

There will be 4750 delegates at the Convention. Which means Bernie currently has just under 1% of the delegates. Not exactly a commanding lead.  Nineteen ahead of my own preferred candidate, btw.
If Bernie doesn't get a majority, that means a majority of Democratic voters chose someone else over him.
Trump's supporters are about 40% of the American voting public. Bernie's supporters are about 30% of Democrats. So Trump has many more supporters than Bernie. If pluralities count, Trump is the clear winner.

[71 dB]

Interesting take by one vox.com contributor ( Dylan Matthews):

Pete Buttigieg is more electable than Bernie Sanders — and more progressive than you think

Pete Buttigieg is more electable than Bernie Sanders? Based on what? Polls? Nope. These writers keep saying what they feel, but they don't provide facts for their claims. You can make a case for Buttigieg (Smart, speaks Norwegian, young etc.), but you can't say he is more electable than Bernie Sanders because the facts (polls) don't support that claim. Also, Buttigieg isn't a progressive. He collects millionaire money in wine caves. That kills progressive thinking and makes you a moderate.

[71 dB]

There will be 4750 delegates at the Convention. Which means Bernie currently has just under 1% of the delegates. Not exactly a commanding lead.

What? Should Bernie have 500 delegates at this point? Bernie has more than Biden and Buttigieg combined and almost as much as Klobuchar, Biden and Buttigieg combined.

Nineteen ahead of my own preferred candidate, btw.
If Bernie doesn't get a majority, that means a majority of Democratic voters chose someone else over him.
Trump's supporters are about 40% of the American voting public. Bernie's supporters are about 30% of Democrats. So Trump has many more supporters than Bernie. If pluralities count, Trump is the clear winner.

Looks like they have given the 14th delegate to Buttigieg in Iowa. Bernie won the popular vote there, but got 2 delegates less. It was rigged for Buttigieg and Buttigieg paid $42k for it. Coin flips and rounding errors that benefitted Buttigieg. Do you feel good about your candidate? That cheating rodent!

If none of the candidates get a majority, that means a majority of Democratic voters chose someone else. If Bernie gets more delegates than other candidates he wins others. You can't "combine" moderates (or progressives), because elections don't work that way. The second choice for many Biden, Buttigieg and Warren voters is Bernie so if moderates drop out of the race, a lot of support goes to Bernie. You can't compare 40% of the American voting public to  30% of Democrats. That's different. Those 40 % did not vote for Trump in the Republican primary and if it's Bernie vs Trump Biden/Buttigieg/Warren/... voters don't go Trump. Your math sucks. Look at the polls. Bernie beats Trump.

[André]

Poju, you describe one of the candidates as a rat (now a rodent), another one as a snake. What's next? Cockroaches? Bats ? You make us wish Bernie has another heart attack - the sooner the better - just so you stop polluting this thread. 

GET A LIFE !!!

[JBS]

What? Should Bernie have 500 delegates at this point? Bernie has more than Biden and Buttigieg combined and almost as much as Klobuchar, Biden and Buttigieg combined.

Looks like they have given the 14th delegate to Buttigieg in Iowa. Bernie won the popular vote there, but got 2 delegates less. It was rigged for Buttigieg and Buttigieg paid $42k for it. Coin flips and rounding errors that benefitted Buttigieg. Do you feel good about your candidate? That cheating rodent!

If none of the candidates get a majority, that means a majority of Democratic voters chose someone else. If Bernie gets more delegates than other candidates he wins others. You can't "combine" moderates (or progressives), because elections don't work that way. The second choice for many Biden, Buttigieg and Warren voters is Bernie so if moderates drop out of the race, a lot of support goes to Bernie. You can't compare 40% of the American voting public to  30% of Democrats. That's different. Those 40 % did not vote for Trump in the Republican primary and if it's Bernie vs Trump Biden/Buttigieg/Warren/... voters don't go Trump. Your math sucks. Look at the polls. Bernie beats Trump.

A man who has the backing of 30 percent of one party is not a man who has the backing of the majority of American  voters. He merely has the backing of 30 percent of one party.  That's math.  And therefore he has no right to claim to be entitled to the nomination. It's not his, so it can't be stolen from him.  And at the moment about 98 percent of the delegates are yet to be chosen. You are not merely counting your chickens before thet have been hatched. You sre counting them before the eggs have been laid.

[Karl Henning]

Poju, you describe one of the candidates as a rat (now a rodent), another one as a snake. What's next? Cockroaches? Bats ? You make us wish Bernie has another heart attack - the sooner the better - just so you stop polluting this thread. 

GET A LIFE !!!

He's demonstrating just how little respect he merits.

[Karl Henning]

"It was rigged!" What delusional rubbish.