And They're Off! The Democratic Candidates for 2020

[Mirror Image]

If Bernie is elected by the Democrats, they might as well kiss that election goodbye. My problem with the Democrats is their platform for the past 2-3 years has been to nail Trump on something illegal and get him out of office and, while I'm not going to question the fact that I do believe Trump is guilty of many things (which I won't launch into), I think this sends a negative signal to voters. It tells me they're more interested in someone they hate (and can't deal with on any kind of level) and not focused on what issues Americans are facing at the present time. One thing I used to like about the Democrats was their party came across as being down-to-earth and, more importantly, it was about people. Whatever is happening in their party right now doesn't strike this particular citizen as nothing but adolescent, schoolyard behavior. They need to get their act together and focus on something other than 'getting Trump', because, as it stands right now, he's not going anywhere.

[Karl Henning]

We expected Bernie to do well in New Hampshire, after all, he did beat Hillary four years ago.

If one observes that the Islanders didn't play a particularly good game, even if they won, it isn't "spin."

[greg]

If Bernie is elected by the Democrats, they might as well kiss that election goodbye. My problem with the Democrats is their platform for the past 2-3 years has been to nail Trump on something illegal and get him out of office and, while I'm not going to question the fact that I do believe Trump is guilty of many things (which I won't launch into), I think this sends a negative signal to voters. It tells me they're more interested in someone they hate (and can't deal with on any kind of level) and not focused on what issues Americans are facing at the present time. One thing I used to like about the Democrats was their party came across as being down-to-earth and, more importantly, it was about people. Whatever is happening in their party right now doesn't strike this particular citizen as nothing but adolescent, schoolyard behavior. They need to get their act together and focus on something other than 'getting Trump', because, as it stands right now, he's not going anywhere.

100%

[JBS]

Bernie Sanders Won the New Hampshire Primary; Ignore the Mainstream Media Spin

https://www.youtube.com/v/vDbbuGIy1yg

Perspective:

Bernie's margin of "victory" was less than 4,000 votes. About the same as Hillary's margin of victory in New Hampshire over Trump in 2016. You'll notice she's not running for re-election this year.  In 2016, in the NH primary, Bernie beat Hillary by 22 percent, with 152,193 votes.  Which means 120,000+ people who voted for Bernie in 2016 did not vote for him in 2020. That's roughly 4 out of 5.

IOW, Bernie eked out a first place finish in a state where he scored an overwhelming victory four years before.

[JBS]

On one level the whole progressive vs not thing within the Democrats does my head in, but it does sometimes feel as if there are 2 separate races going on. First we have to figure out who the progressive Democrat candidate is (leaning Bernie) and who the more centrist Democrat candidate is (a bit less clear now), and then those 2 can face off to decide who challenges Trump.

It's all very Sibelius. Different tempi for different parts of the orchestra...

Nice metaphor.

[Karl Henning]

If Bernie is elected by the Democrats, they might as well kiss that election goodbye. My problem with the Democrats is their platform for the past 2-3 years has been to nail Trump on something illegal and get him out of office and, while I'm not going to question the fact that I do believe Trump is guilty of many things (which I won't launch into), I think this sends a negative signal to voters. It tells me they're more interested in someone they hate (and can't deal with on any kind of level) and not focused on what issues Americans are facing at the present time. One thing I used to like about the Democrats was their party came across as being down-to-earth and, more importantly, it was about people. Whatever is happening in their party right now doesn't strike this particular citizen as nothing but adolescent, schoolyard behavior. They need to get their act together and focus on something other than 'getting Trump', because, as it stands right now, he's not going anywhere.

I don't believe there is anything one can say which would prompt Poju even to consider the possibility that Bernie could lose to Trump. He's swirling in the spin of his bubble. His mind's made up: don't confuse him with the facts!

[Mirror Image]

I don't believe there is anything one can say which would prompt Poju even to consider the possibility that Bernie could lose to Trump. He's swirling in the spin of his bubble. His mind's made up: don't confuse him with the facts!

Yeah, that's true --- I mustn't shed any light on the subject.

[71 dB]

Buttigieg Staffers Are Harrasing Progressive Journalists Vilifying Dissent

Is JBS's point "media spin"?

It shares some points:

Perspective:

Bernie's margin of "victory" was less than 4,000 votes. About the same as Hillary's margin of victory in New Hampshire over Trump in 2016. You'll notice she's not running for re-election this year.  In 2016, in the NH primary, Bernie beat Hillary by 22 percent, with 152,193 votes.  Which means 120,000+ people who voted for Bernie in 2016 did not vote for him in 2020. That's roughly 4 out of 5.

IOW, Bernie eked out a first place finish in a state where he scored an overwhelming victory four years before.

In 2016 people had two choices: Hillary and Bernie. Now they had a dozen of choices.

A lot of this primary result is explained by Buttigieg and Klobuchar doing very well thanks to New Hampshire being very white as these candidates have not polled well among blacks, latinos and other minorities.

[Jo498]

I think the problems are mainly two: The democrats are internally divided and this is exacerbated by the fact that they know they are likely to lose (again) against a person they take for an orange buffoon (which is not entirely wrong but this proves how weak you are if you cannot even beat that incoherently rambling clown). I am pretty confident that Trump will be re-elected and if the US democrats are able to learn they should then do what they neglected in the last 4 years, i.e. use the time to unite and re-group to have a better chance in 2024.

[JBS]

Buttigieg Staffers Are Harrasing Progressive Journalists Vilifying Dissent

It shares some points:

In 2016 people had two choices: Hillary and Bernie. Now they had a dozen of choices.

A lot of this primary result is explained by Buttigieg and Klobuchar doing very well thanks to New Hampshire being very white as these candidates have not polled well among blacks, latinos and other minorities.

That's the point. Now that they have other options voters are choosing someone who is not Bernie.

Your last paragraph contradicts one of your talking points. You say Bernie can appeal to disaffected white voters, but now you are saying Pete and Amy have more appeal to disaffected white voters.

[JBS]

I think the problems are mainly two: The democrats are internally divided and this is exacerbated by the fact that they know they are likely to lose (again) against a person they take for an orange buffoon (which is not entirely wrong but this proves how weak you are if you cannot even beat that incoherently rambling clown). I am pretty confident that Trump will be re-elected and if the US democrats are able to learn they should then do what they neglected in the last 4 years, i.e. use the time to unite and re-group to have a better chance in 2024.

Quite true.

[Karl Henning]

I think the problems are mainly two: The democrats are internally divided and this is exacerbated by the fact that they know they are likely to lose (again) against a person they take for an orange buffoon (which is not entirely wrong but this proves how weak you are if you cannot even beat that incoherently rambling clown).

We know from 2016 that "I'm not the toxic jerk" ain't enough.

[71 dB]

That's the point. Now that they have other options voters are choosing someone who is not Bernie.

Your last paragraph contradicts one of your talking points. You say Bernie can appeal to disaffected white voters, but now you are saying Pete and Amy have more appeal to disaffected white voters.

Yes and corporate media has done so much to smear Bernie, but despite of that Bernie is the second and third choice for many.

I did not say more appeal among whites. I said less appeal among minorities. That will hurt Buttigieg and Klobuchar in less white states.

[SimonNZ]

If Bernie is elected by the Democrats, they might as well kiss that election goodbye. My problem with the Democrats is their platform for the past 2-3 years has been to nail Trump on something illegal and get him out of office and, while I'm not going to question the fact that I do believe Trump is guilty of many things (which I won't launch into), I think this sends a negative signal to voters. It tells me they're more interested in someone they hate (and can't deal with on any kind of level) and not focused on what issues Americans are facing at the present time. One thing I used to like about the Democrats was their party came across as being down-to-earth and, more importantly, it was about people. Whatever is happening in their party right now doesn't strike this particular citizen as nothing but adolescent, schoolyard behavior. They need to get their act together and focus on something other than 'getting Trump', because, as it stands right now, he's not going anywhere.

How should they react to his abuses of power? By ignoring them and not pushing back at all for fear of looking "negative"?

[SimonNZ]

At some point before November someone needs to revisit Trump's 2016 right out loud statement that he wouldn't accept the result of the election if he lost.

[71 dB]

OMG, this is FUN!        

Excellent stand-up recap of the Iowa Circus fiasco.

The Jimmy Dore Show: Media Caught Repeatedly Lying To Boost Buttigieg

https://www.youtube.com/v/QHl9SdbOThE

[Madiel]

If Bernie is elected by the Democrats, they might as well kiss that election goodbye. My problem with the Democrats is their platform for the past 2-3 years has been to nail Trump on something illegal and get him out of office and, while I'm not going to question the fact that I do believe Trump is guilty of many things (which I won't launch into), I think this sends a negative signal to voters. It tells me they're more interested in someone they hate (and can't deal with on any kind of level) and not focused on what issues Americans are facing at the present time. One thing I used to like about the Democrats was their party came across as being down-to-earth and, more importantly, it was about people. Whatever is happening in their party right now doesn't strike this particular citizen as nothing but adolescent, schoolyard behavior. They need to get their act together and focus on something other than 'getting Trump', because, as it stands right now, he's not going anywhere.

While I completely understand this, it's also worth bearing in mind that there's good historical evidence that the great majority of presidential elections are treated by the voters as referendums on the incumbent. Even when the individual incumbent can't stand again after a 2nd term, it's a referendum on their administration.

I forget exactly where I heard about this but it was probably one of the podcasts I listen to. I think it was one of the people who predicted Trump's victory and had a very strong track record over the years.

I'm not sure that's any better for the Democrats, because I'm not sure that Trump's awful personal character is what voters will focus on in judging his administration. If things like economic indicators are in his favour, many voters will shrug at the accompanying circus and focus on how their own lives have been going.

[amw]

I suspect if the nominees come down to Bernie vs. Trump the results will end up not particularly different from if the candidates were "Generic Democrat" and "Generic Republican".

That said I am definitely surprised by how well Mayor Pete has been doing. I'd fully expected Kamala Harris or Klobuchar to be the one dominating his lane but I guess in the modern Democratic party troops beat cops.

[Karl Henning]

Mayor Pete's surge is indeed a surprise. And Amy Klobuchar's performance in the Granite State is the big news.

[Florestan]

I'm not sure that Trump's awful personal character is what voters will focus on in judging his administration. If things like economic indicators are in his favour, many voters will shrug at the accompanying circus and focus on how their own lives have been going.

Show me one single country in the world where people vote principles and ideas as opposed to how their own lives have been going.