And They're Off! The Democratic Candidates for 2020

[mc ukrneal]

Very well.

Now please let us know what such insane downsides of socialism it tries to avoid --- because you gave us an example of insane capitalism only.

Or are you trying to tell us that only capitalism is bad and need regulation while socialism is perfect and need only to be expanded worldwide?

Ah. You were doing so well. You are going to have to start going to meetings again!

[mc ukrneal]

I made some calculations about what the final delegate amounts could be for Biden and Sanders based on how the delegates have gone so far:

My estimate:

Biden 651 delegates
Sanders 662 delegates

Hard to say how this goes, but it's not impossible Bernie actually takes the delegate lead (thanks to California), but it's a close race nevertheless! 

Based on info as of 5:30PM today,
Biden: 566
Sanders: 501

Keep in mind that Sanders faces another hurdle in that some key states have closed primaries (meaning non-registered Democrats cannot vote). This likely affects Sanders more in states like NY or Florida, which have a lots of delegates up for grab.

[71 dB]

Warren seems to be dropping out soon...

Based on info as of 5:30PM today,
Biden: 566
Sanders: 501

Keep in mind that Sanders faces another hurdle in that some key states have closed primaries (meaning non-registered Democrats cannot vote). This likely affects Sanders more in states like NY or Florida, which have a lots of delegates up for grab.

93 % reporting. Lots of delegates not given and most of those goes to Bernie. Bernie has to work harder. Supporters have to work harder. Biden supporters don't understand what is in stake. Biden would be a lousy demented president, but he can't win Trump! That's why Bernie HAS TO WIN NO MATTER WHAT!!

[Mirror Image]

If Biden becomes the nominee instead of Bernie, I might go to Trump "four more years" avatar before going back to Elgar avatar.

Your money goes via taxes to military industry complex. So, corporates say "Your money is military industry complex's money". The US as it is is socialism for the rich. You don't like socialism, so why do you like status quo?

You really should stop obsessing about U.S. politics. I mean now it's gotten to the point where I'm going to ask you a serious question: do you sleep at all?

[JBS]

A Letter to My Children Regarding Bernie Sanders[

JBS, you're gonna love this! And so are all moderates here, methinks.

Pretty much expresses what I think, except for the .22 rifle.

[Herman]

Why such a large time gap between them? Usually such appointments are weekly.

71B's therapy appointments are NONE OF OUR BUSINESS, please lay off.

[Jo498]

The problem with "social democracy" is usually NOT that it devolves into "socialism". The US was more social democratic than now between the 1940s and late 1970s and there was no threat of Soviet style socialism whatsoever. The same is true for most of Western Europe (partly still today, but certainly between the 1950s and 1980s when even most conservative parties were in favor of relatively high taxes, public healthcare, public control of train and phone companies etc.). According to most data, these societies were hugely successful, innovative (like going to the moon and stuff), made rising through the social strata (that were not so strongly separated) possible for many, didn't have the less fortunate in abject poverty and had a fairly high proportion of content citizens.
The problem is rather that social democracy is not very stable towards the other direction, namely less regulated global capitalism. This process took place in the last 30-40 years.
This is not contradicted by the fact that some things are more highly regulated than in the 70s, that some people have their well-paid jobs from crony bureaucracy rather than crony capitalism etc.
I think we today often have worst of both worlds: Capitalism run amok with hugely grown wealth disparities, lobbyism controlling policies etc. and pseudo-socialist bureaucracy (like the EU but also more locally) also out of control.

[71 dB]

You really should stop obsessing about U.S. politics. I mean now it's gotten to the point where I'm going to ask you a serious question: do you sleep at all?

All people have obsessions. Your obsession seems to be telling me to stop obsessioning about US politics. I sleep well when Bernie is the president, because then I know the superpower is finally in good hands.

[André]

The problem with "social democracy" is usually NOT that it devolves into "socialism". The US was more social democratic than now between the 1940s and late 1970s and there was no threat of Soviet style socialism whatsoever. The same is true for most of Western Europe (partly still today, but certainly between the 1950s and 1980s when even most conservative parties were in favor of relatively high taxes, public healthcare, public control of train and phone companies etc.). According to most data, these societies were hugely successful, innovative (like going to the moon and stuff), made rising through the social strata (that were not so strongly separated) possible for many, didn't have the less fortunate in abject poverty and had a fairly high proportion of content citizens.
The problem is rather that social democracy is not very stable towards the other direction, namely less regulated global capitalism. This process took place in the last 30-40 years.
This is not contradicted by the fact that some things are more highly regulated than in the 70s, that some people have their well-paid jobs from crony bureaucracy rather than crony capitalism etc.
I think we today often have worst of both worlds: Capitalism run amok with hugely grown wealth disparities, lobbyism controlling policies etc. and pseudo-socialist bureaucracy (like the EU but also more locally) also out of control.

Well said !

[Florestan]

Well said !

Indeed.

[drogulus]

     

The problem with "social democracy" is usually NOT that it devolves into "socialism".

     Social democracy inoculates a political/economic system against socialism of the old textbook kind. Devolution, while possible "in principle", ought to be rare. When was the last time you saw an egg unscramble?

     Something to keep in mind (or put there) is that these discussions center on political and economic arrangements in the advanced countries that have passed though particular evolutionary stages. In my terminology evolutionary success is the result of an "open architecture" in thought and practice, in which government power is used to create environments with the necessaries for practical freedom. Keeping faith with tradition and to give maximum lift to new ideas and forms we "put a god on it", blaming nature for our cultural innovations.

     We don't waste time comparing the features of one lousy system with another one to see which is better. Most discussion is about what arrangements are best among the best on earth. We don't study the Nordic model to find out what went terribly wrong. We want to understand why they are so happily suicidal. How they do that? Maybe, just maybe the "closed architecture" concepts of the dogmatists suck mightily, preventing us from learning what we need to know.

[Mirror Image]

All people have obsessions. Your obsession seems to be telling me to stop obsessioning about US politics. I sleep well when Bernie is the president, because then I know the superpower is finally in good hands.

Bernie never will be president, so it looks like you won't be getting any sleep. Biden will be the Democratic candidate.

[André]

Most likely. Warren is bowing out. I wonder if she'll back one of the remainers and, if so, if she still has any influence over her supporters.

[drogulus]

Most likely. Warren is bowing out. I wonder if she'll back one of the remainers and, if so, if she still has any influence over her supporters.

     It's harder for her because unlike recent dropouts she has a progressive set of programs to advance, but backing Sanders may not be the best way to get where she wants to go. Her goal almost certainly will be to have great influence on the next Dem administration, whether she has a formal role or not.

[Karl Henning]

Polls show Biden and Sanders are probably going to split Warren's voters

That's arguably a win for Biden after his strong Super Tuesday performance.

[71 dB]

Bernie never will be president

The top 1 % certainly do everything to stop Bernie. The US is a shithole oligarchy pretending to be a beacon of democracy.

[greg]

The top 1 % certainly do everything to stopping Bernie. The US is a shithole oligarchy pretending to be a beacon of democracy.

So according to this standard, actual third world countries are black holes filled with shit from several different alien species over millions of years?

I mean I don't disagree, everything is shit pretty much. Even tasty food. Just future shit.

[drogulus]

So according to this standard, actual third world countries are black holes filled with shit from several different alien species over millions of years?

I mean I don't disagree, everything is shit pretty much. Even tasty food. Just future shit.

     You know what I can't stand about this galaxy, really? It's the way the fat part at the center rotates in sync with the outside. Shouldn't it go faster like a bathtub drain? It gives me the creeps.

     

[Karl Henning]

     You know what I can't stand about this galaxy, really? It's the way the fat part at the center rotates in sync with the outside. Shouldn't it go faster like a bathtub drain? It gives me the creeps.

     

Possibly your best post to date.

[Karl Henning]

yada yada

Voters and not "the 1%" spoke on Tuesday  Get over your self-pitying self!