Richard Wagner: The Greatest Influence on Western Music?

[karlhenning]

Since he only could have influenced composers from the last 150 years, and not all the great ones before that, I hardly think he could be, either.

That is certainly one of the well-considered objections to the current exercise in wagnerolatry under advisement.

[Josquin des Prez]

Well, thank God that Wagner was unfailingly lucid in all his pamphleteering!

I think i'll take Wagner's ramblings over the guy who worshiped aliens any time of the week, thank you very much.

[karlhenning]

I think i'll take Wagner's ramblings over the guy who worshiped aliens any time of the week, thank you very much.

Taking the side of the narcissist, eh?

[(poco) Sforzando]

I think i'll take Wagner's ramblings over the guy who worshiped aliens any time of the week, thank you very much.

Yeah, but the work that preceded Stockhausen's navel-gazing, mystical phase is among the best writing in post-WW2 European music. I highly recommend Punkte, Refrain, Carré, Momente, and above all Gruppen, which I've never been fortunate enough to hear live but makes thrilling use of spatial effects distributed among its three orchestras.

[DavidRoss]

Why is it that Wagner idolaters so often seem obsessed with "proving" that their hero was #1 and convincing others to worship him likewise?  I swear, youse guys are like Mormon missionaries, Jehovah's Witnesses, and Scientologists all rolled into one!

[mn dave]

Why is it that Wagner idolaters so often seem obsessed with "proving" that their hero was #1 and convincing others to worship him likewise?

Just like me, they long to be, close to you.

[(poco) Sforzando]

Why is it that Wagner idolaters so often seem obsessed with "proving" that their hero was #1 and convincing others to worship him likewise?  I swear, youse guys are like Mormon missionaries, Jehovah's Witnesses, and Scientologists all rolled into one!

Surely, Mr. Ross, you are aware there can only be one #1.

[marvinbrown]

Why is it that Wagner idolaters so often seem obsessed with "proving" that their hero was #1 and convincing others to worship him likewise?  I swear, youse guys are like Mormon missionaries, Jehovah's Witnesses, and Scientologists all rolled into one!

  Wagner idolatry, worship of Wagner, obssessions with Wagner and his music dramas,.......I'm afraid I know nothing of it  ......  !

 
  marvin
 

[Don]

Why is it that Wagner idolaters so often seem obsessed with "proving" that their hero was #1 and convincing others to worship him likewise? 

One word - insecurity.

[PSmith08]

Why is it that Wagner idolaters so often seem obsessed with "proving" that their hero was #1 and convincing others to worship him likewise?  I swear, youse guys are like Mormon missionaries, Jehovah's Witnesses, and Scientologists all rolled into one!

I don't know. Why are you worked up about what people are saying on a classical music message board on the interweb? It's not like we're the Trilateral Commission or the Bilderberg Group.

[mn dave]

I don't know. Why are you worked up about what people are saying on a classical music message board on the interweb? It's not like we're the Trilateral Commission or the Bilderberg Group.

Oh, blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah Trilateral Commission or the Bilderberg Group.

[karlhenning]

Just like me, they long to be, close to you.

Neil Innes, "Lie Down and Be Counted"

("What are we standing for?")

[(poco) Sforzando]

I don't know. Why are you worked up about what people are saying on a classical music message board on the interweb?

Because the stakes are so low.

[(poco) Sforzando]

No it's you that is empty I'm afraid. Stockhausen on the otherhand was an extraordinary figure & a genius. His groundbreaking achievements in the area of electronic music alone secures his significance & importance in the history of music, setting the stage for much of the sampling techniques central to much of today's pop, rock, hip-hop & electronica, but he did & influenced lots else too. i.e. Klavierstucke, Gruppen, Zeitmasse, Momente, Mantra etc. etc....and listen to good recordings of things like Out of the 7 Days and tell me if the art of improvisation in classical music is dead? His stature is huge and I can't think of too many 20th century composers who impacted so many different artists, areas & genres and still always seemed to have major pull & attraction with younger generations on top of this.

I forgot the electronic music. For my money, the Gesang der Jünglinde of 1956 is one of the few completely successful pieces of electronic music ever written.

As for the "younger generation," Stockhausen clearly influenced the Beatles, who include him in the group shot on the cover of the Sgt. Pepper album.

[Lethevich]

As for the "younger generation," Stockhausen clearly influenced the Beatles, who include him in the group shot on the cover of the Sgt. Pepper album.

I am just aching in anticipation for Josquin's comment on that 0:)

[greg]

As for the "younger generation," Stockhausen clearly influenced the Beatles, who include him in the group shot on the cover of the Sgt. Pepper album.

Not to mention how much Varese clearly influenced Frank Zappa, who influenced....... well, lots and lots of musicians.
But of course, nobody knows about this stuff.

[PSmith08]

Because the stakes are so low.

Among other things.

[DavidRoss]

I don't know. Why are you worked up about what people are saying on a classical music message board on the interweb? It's not like we're the Trilateral Commission or the Bilderberg Group.

Worked up?

[PSmith08]

Worked up?

Why is it that Wagner idolaters so often seem obsessed with "proving" that their hero was #1 and convincing others to worship him likewise?  I swear, youse guys are like Mormon missionaries, Jehovah's Witnesses, and Scientologists all rolled into one!

I'm sorry. I didn't realize "Mormon missionaries, Jehovah's Witnesses, and Scientologists all rolled into one" was a compliment.

I have much to learn.

[greg]

I'll have to listen to Stockhausen some more, since every time I've listened, I just get bored to death.