Coronavirus thread

[JBS]

But sixty million stockpiled? Who signs off on that? With what oversight? I assume they haven't stockpiled every other problematic drug under trial, just the one the thugs either have a financial stake in or where they can't admit their all-in fingers-crossed don't-make-me-read-science advocacy of an early miracle-cure was perhaps a little hasty.

It's more likely, given the source, that the 60 million figure is an overstatement by an order of magnitude or so.

[SimonNZ]

You mean Navarro? Or the authors of the article or the WP?

Even if it were  6 million or 600,000 I wouldn't understand why they would stockpile something shown to be ineffective and/or dangerous after far more attention and scrutiny than any other drug, except to give a lucrative contract to a favored business.

[JBS]

You mean Navarro? Or the authors of the article or the WP?

Even if it were  6 million or 600,000 I wouldn't understand why they would stockpile something shown to be ineffective and/or dangerous after far more attention and scrutiny than any other drug, except to give a lucrative contract to a favored business.

Navarro.
I'm sure someone in Trumpworld will serve as broker.  Maybe Roger Stone, since he doesn't have to worry about prison any more.

[T. D.]

https://news.yahoo.com/dozens-us-marines-japans-okinawa-114553528.html

TOKYO (AP) — Dozens of U.S. Marines at two bases on the southern Japanese island of Okinawa have been infected with the coronavirus in what is feared to be a massive outbreak, Okinawa's governor said Saturday, demanding an adequate explanation from the U.S. military.

Gov. Denny Tamaki said he could say only that a "few dozen" cases had been found recently because the U.S. military asked that the exact figure not be released. The outbreaks occurred at Marine Corps Air Station Futenma, which is at the center of a relocation dispute, and Camp Hansen, Tamaki said.

Local media, citing unnamed sources, said about 60 people had been infected.

"Okinawans are shocked by what we were told (by the U.S. military)," Tamaki told a news conference. "We now have strong doubts that the U.S. military has taken adequate disease prevention measures."

[Emphasis added] No shit, Sherlock.
Just ask ex-Capt. Brett Crozier.
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/05/magazine/navy-captain-crozier-positive-coronavirus.html

[drogulus]

Having been my mother's caretaker for so many years, your belief in Medicare's efficiency can only make me laugh.

I can best put the reality of Medicare into the wish that you stay healthy for many more years. Because Medicare is very inefficient for any patient who is not in relative good health.

     It's efficient at producing the benefits it provides. Inefficiency is not the reason it doesn't work well for everyone who needs it.

     We need better public health. The best way to get it is to cover the whole population with a program that is designed to be good enough for everyone. That means me, you, and our families. It shouldn't be a crap shoot or a stroke of good luck. It shouldn't be denied to the "undeserving" class. There shouldn't be an undeserving class. It does no good for the rest of us to have one.

[T. D.]

A 37-year-old Ohio man died from coronavirus after slamming 'hype' over pandemic on Facebook

https://www.insider.com/ohio-man-veteran-died-coronavirus-mask-facebook-posts-2020-7

This lurid story has gotten a lot of attention. I was highly sceptical, but it seems true: there are many corroborating links including local newspaper stories and obituaries.

[JBS]

     It's efficient at producing the benefits it provides. Inefficiency is not the reason it doesn't work well for everyone who needs it.

     We need better public health. The best way to get it is to cover the whole population with a program that is designed to be good enough for everyone. That means me, you, and our families. It shouldn't be a crap shoot or a stroke of good luck. It shouldn't be denied to the "undeserving" class. There shouldn't be an undeserving class. It does no good for the rest of us to have one.

It's efficient at giving minimal care to those that need nothing more than minimal care.
It's inefficient at giving more than minimal care to anyone who needs more than minimal care. And the more care that is needed, the more inefficient it becomes.

And these inefficiencies are baked into its structure.

[arpeggio]

Another tragic story:

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/patient-dies-after-going-to-covid-party-thought-it-was-a-hoax-official/ar-BB16CCy8?ocid=msedgdhp

[Que]

Another tragic story:

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/patient-dies-after-going-to-covid-party-thought-it-was-a-hoax-official/ar-BB16CCy8?ocid=msedgdhp

By purposely contracting the virus, even if you don't get very ill yourself, you might sign someone else's death warrant....

Q

[MusicTurner]

There was a true story in the early stages of the virus about a hospital doctor and a local politician in Sweden, who went to Stockholm just to contract the virus. They wanted to be infected at the early stages to be able to work better later on. He decided to lick the metro's escalators there, she did something similar, but none were infected. The acts were condemned by their colleagues as irresponsible.

https://www.aftonbladet.se/nyheter/samhalle/a/Qob1Wq/lakare-akte-till-stockholm-for-att-smittas--utreds-av-sjukhuset

[71 dB]

Another tragic story:

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/patient-dies-after-going-to-covid-party-thought-it-was-a-hoax-official/ar-BB16CCy8?ocid=msedgdhp

And the Darwin prize goes to...

These are sad stories, but for all the negative aspects Covid-19 might have the positive effect of being a wake-up call to the culture of ignorance and stupidity. Covid-19 seems to attack idiocracy effectively while smarter societies deal with it better.

[71 dB]

It's efficient at giving minimal care to those that need nothing more than minimal care.

Sounds logical.

It's inefficient at giving more than minimal care to anyone who needs more than minimal care.

This doesn't sound logical. If someone needs more than minimal care, obviously more than minimal care is needed by definition. 

And the more care that is needed, the more inefficient it becomes.

Yeah, but preventative care reduces need for more intense care later and is efficient. Cuba's healthcare system is a prime example of this and how they can provide surpringly good healthcare to their people with little resources being a relatively poor country.

[Karl Henning]

But golly gee whiz,  aren't there any elected Floridian Republicans with principles or ethics, who believe that the public deserves to know the truth about a life-threatening public health crisis? Isn't that what "public servants" are for?

   

OK, forget it.

In the Trump era?

[T. D.]

And the Darwin prize goes to...

These are sad stories, but for all the negative aspects Covid-19 might have the positive effect of being a wake-up call to the culture of ignorance and stupidity. Covid-19 seems to attack idiocracy effectively while smarter societies deal with it better.

Nice thought, but as a resident of the nation that is the veritable Mecca    of idiocracy and the culture you describe, I fear it's a pipe dream.

[drogulus]

It's efficient at giving minimal care to those that need nothing more than minimal care.
It's inefficient at giving more than minimal care to anyone who needs more than minimal care. And the more care that is needed, the more inefficient it becomes.

And these inefficiencies are baked into its structure.

     That is not an efficiency problem. It's a decision not to provide certain kinds of care. We decide what's baked in or not when we vote for politicians who support public health measures, or those who want to "reform" them down to a minimum. If you want more coverage, fight for it. You probably won't get everything you want, but you will get more than you have.

     Or, you can hope your private sector choice still exists next year or the year after. Maybe you'll be lucky and it will. Maybe it will be too expensive, or cover less than it does now. OCare could die, or be murdered to be more precise. I think we need a more bullet proof option.

[JBS]

     That is not an efficiency problem. It's a decision not to provide certain kinds of care. We decide what's baked in or not when we vote for politicians who support public health measures, or those who want to "reform" them down to a minimum. If you want more coverage, fight for it. You probably won't get everything you want, but you will get more than you have.

     Or, you can hope your private sector choice still exists next year or the year after. Maybe you'll be lucky and it will. Maybe it will be too expensive, or cover less than it does now. OCare could die, or be murdered to be more precise. I think we need a more bullet proof option.

You're not talking about what I am talking about.

Medicare is a bureaucratic mess. The more an individual needs services provided through Medicare, the messier and more inefficient it becomes.  You are relatively healthy, so you haven't directly experienced that mess yet.

[drogulus]

     If you like private plans, you can support including them in the SomethingCare package. I'd go for that. You could have a tiered system going from a zero additional premium like some of the Medicare Advantage plans (mine is like that) up to no network plans with various options included.

     I stay in network to take advantage of the zero premium. If I wanted more I'd pay for it. I might want that later.

     The pandemic has revealed how stupid it was to be the last wealthy country to neglect the health of its citizens through cost rationing and the private insurance lottery.

You're not talking about what I am talking about.

Medicare is a bureaucratic mess. The more an individual needs services provided through Medicare, the messier and more inefficient it becomes.  You are relatively healthy, so you haven't directly experienced that mess yet.

     That's all the more reason then to support improvements. You have no other direction to go but up. I'm not doubting that Medicare has the deficiencies you say it has, I'm pointing out that they are there because pro healthcare politicians are kept on the defensive trying to keep the sociopaths from destroying what we have.

     The IRS is an example of an organization that is rendered artificially "inefficient" by enemy action. Repubs don't care that tax rates might actually be higher because of how they crippled the tax service. It's the same everywhere, you govern badly then claim government is bad.

     Medicare will only function better if you make it a goal. Being a passive witness to how bad it is won't help anyone. What better option is there? What's the plan, Stan?

[JBS]

     If you like private plans, you can support including them in the SomethingCare package. I'd go for that. You could have a tiered system going from a zero additional premium like some of the Medicare Advantage plans (mine is like that) up to no network plans with various options included.

     I stay in network to take advantage of the zero premium. If I wanted more I'd pay for it. I might want that later.

     The pandemic has revealed how stupid it was to be the last wealthy country to neglect the health of its citizens through cost rationing and the private insurance lottery.

The last paragraph has no contact to reality.  The entire post has no relevance to the point I was making.

[drogulus]

The last paragraph has no contact to reality.  The entire post has no relevance to the point I was making.

     You were discussing how hard it is to get more than basic services through Medicare. I have no doubt this is true. So, what are you going to do about it?

[T. D.]

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/07/12/white-house-seeks-to-discredit-dr-anthony-fauci-as-coronavirus-surges.html

I shudder to think what kind of knuckle-dragger will replace him.