Author Topic: Coronavirus thread  (Read 229784 times)

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Offline JBS

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Re: Coronavirus thread
« Reply #5280 on: September 21, 2021, 11:06:56 AM »
Maybe you didn't see him on Joe Rogan. He went on and on about how he was wrong and changed his mind on that.

Being sued will often do that.
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-texas-lawsuit-alex-jones-idUSKBN1YZ1BB

Hollywood Beach Broadwalk

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Re: Coronavirus thread
« Reply #5281 on: September 21, 2021, 11:13:34 AM »
Maybe you didn't see him on Joe Rogan. He went on and on about how he was wrong and changed his mind on that.

And you think that has nothing to do with the ongoing lawsuits and the impending imposition of compensatory and punitive damages for his lies about the Sandy Hook incident?

Online Pohjolas Daughter

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Re: Coronavirus thread
« Reply #5282 on: September 21, 2021, 11:35:49 AM »
Yes, God help us understand why just a single incident like this becomes news. It's simply a single incident and not necessarily indicative of any proveable trend but would the media have us think otherwise?
Pardon, but did you read the article?  And, yes, they were shocked as they had never been told this before in Texas (so hopefully, no more places are doing this or maybe just not in their area?  Or perhaps people just avoid places where there's either an official rule or an unofficial one that you can't wear a mask...or no one else there will?  But again, they can seldom go out due to circumstances.).  Or maybe they just haven't been reported?  I don't know.  Yes, I understand that it's a privately owned business, but to tell someone that has just told you that they are trying their best to protect their infant who has cystic fibrosis and tell them that they must leave....not even trying to talk to her boss.  Again, if you read the article, it wasn't posted any where about the no mask policy, and they could barely hear her when they entered the establishment and thinking that she (the hostess) just wanted them to remove their masks in order to confirm their ID.  And they were kind enough despite all of that to pay their tab (despite not having received the food that they had ordered).  And now they are even more reluctant to go out...despite being a young couple struggling to get out a couple of times a month and having an infant with serious health issues.

And hopefully it's not a trend.  Fair to them for calling out the establishment and letting people know what the rules are and decide for yourself whether or not you want to spend your money there.  Hopefully, the owner will rethink some things and be willing to be more compassionate and flexible.

Just my thoughts.

Best wishes,

PD
« Last Edit: September 21, 2021, 01:49:49 PM by Pohjolas Daughter »

Online k a rl h e nn i ng

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Re: Coronavirus thread
« Reply #5283 on: September 21, 2021, 12:41:21 PM »
Karl Henning, Ph.D.
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http://www.karlhenning.com/
[Matisse] was interested neither in fending off opposition,
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Re: Coronavirus thread
« Reply #5284 on: September 21, 2021, 12:52:18 PM »
And hopefully it's not a trend. 

It is unfortunately.  I've seen restaurants and other private businesses pop up in the news repeatedly for having anti-mask rules.  Some have anti-vax rules.  This is though the first time I've heard about people being kicked out.  It is usually just a note on the door of the business.

Offline greg

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Re: Coronavirus thread
« Reply #5285 on: September 21, 2021, 01:59:15 PM »
And you think that has nothing to do with the ongoing lawsuits and the impending imposition of compensatory and punitive damages for his lies about the Sandy Hook incident?
It could. I'm not familiar with the rules about what would happen after you pay the 100k, and then later continued saying the same thing again. Also wondering how the parents were negatively affected to merit that much money.

Also curious to hear what mental illness he was diagnosed with.
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Online Pohjolas Daughter

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Re: Coronavirus thread
« Reply #5286 on: September 21, 2021, 02:01:45 PM »
It is unfortunately.  I've seen restaurants and other private businesses pop up in the news repeatedly for having anti-mask rules.  Some have anti-vax rules.  This is though the first time I've heard about people being kicked out.  It is usually just a note on the door of the business.
Anti-vax rules?!   :( What is up there?

PD

Offline greg

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Re: Coronavirus thread
« Reply #5287 on: September 21, 2021, 02:03:46 PM »
It is unfortunately.  I've seen restaurants and other private businesses pop up in the news repeatedly for having anti-mask rules.  Some have anti-vax rules.  This is though the first time I've heard about people being kicked out.  It is usually just a note on the door of the business.
If I saw a note that masks aren't allowed, I wouldn't eat there. And they'd lose my business. So would be a dumb move on their part.
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Offline SimonNZ

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Re: Coronavirus thread
« Reply #5288 on: September 21, 2021, 04:02:35 PM »
It could. I'm not familiar with the rules about what would happen after you pay the 100k, and then later continued saying the same thing again. Also wondering how the parents were negatively affected to merit that much money.

Also curious to hear what mental illness he was diagnosed with.

Self-diagnosis, March 2019:

Conspiracy theorist Alex Jones blames 'psychosis' for his Sandy Hook claims

"The conspiracy theorist Alex Jones blamed various claims he has made, including that the 2012 Sandy Hook elementary school shooting was a hoax, on “psychosis”, according to a deposition given by the Infowars host as part of a Texas lawsuit.

Jones described his conspiracy thinking as a kind of mental disorder in the deposition, which was taken earlier this month for the lawsuit filed against him by the family of a six-year-old who was among 20 children and six adults killed in Newtown, Connecticut, in 2012, the Austin American-Statesman reported.

Jones said he “almost had like a form of psychosis back in the past where I basically thought everything was staged, even though I’m now learning a lot of times things aren’t staged”. [slow clap emoji goes here]

Jones blamed his mental state on “the trauma of the media and the corporations lying so much, then everything begins – you don’t trust anything anymore, kind of like a child whose parents lie to them over and over again, well, pretty soon they don’t know what reality is”.

The defamation suit was filed in Travis county, Texas, where Jones’ media company is based. In August, the judge presiding denied Jones’ request to dismiss the case.

Jones’ attorneys have defended his speech in court as “rhetorical hyperbole”, but denied it was defamation. In the deposition, Jones continued to voice conspiratorial suspicions about the Sandy Hook shooting.

“I still think that there was a man in the woods in camo … and just a lot of experts I’ve talked to, including retired FBI agents and other people and people high up in the Central Intelligence Agency, have told me that there is a cover-up in Sandy Hook,” Jones said.

A similar lawsuit has been filed in Connecticut. Several families in that suit say Jones’ comments have tormented them and subjected them to harassment and death threats by his followers, some of whom have accused them of being actors.

On Friday, a federal judge in West Virginia allowed another defamation case against Jones to proceed. The suit was filed on behalf of Brennan Gilmore, who captured footage of a fatal car attack on counterprotesters during a far-right rally in Charlottesville in August 2017.

In a statement, Andrew Mendrala, supervising attorney with the Civil Rights Clinic at Georgetown Law, said: “Victims of vile conspiracy theories should take comfort … today’s decision shows that the law will protect victims of baseless lies by holding people like Alex Jones accountable for the harm they cause.”

Maybe you didn't see him on Joe Rogan. He went on and on about how he was wrong and changed his mind on that.

Did he beg the forgiveness of the parents he cruelly insulted and put at risk? Did he ask his followers to also beg their forgiveness and admit the error of their ways? Will he dedicate the rest of his life to being a cautionary tale of the dangers of misinformation, conspiracy and threat? (No, I'm not going to go listen to Joe fucking Rogan to find out).

Because this isn't the kind of thing that a simple yers-later "my bad" excuses.


« Last Edit: September 21, 2021, 04:09:39 PM by SimonNZ »

Offline greg

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Re: Coronavirus thread
« Reply #5289 on: September 21, 2021, 04:34:46 PM »
Self-diagnosis, March 2019:

Jones blamed his mental state on “the trauma of the media and the corporations lying so much, then everything begins – you don’t trust anything anymore, kind of like a child whose parents lie to them over and over again, well, pretty soon they don’t know what reality is”.
Sounds more like his excuse for being reckless. The media and corporations are liars, and you shouldn't automatically trust what they say, but to say that you are getting psychosis from it is nonsense, just an excuse.




A similar lawsuit has been filed in Connecticut. Several families in that suit say Jones’ comments have tormented them and subjected them to harassment and death threats by his followers, some of whom have accused them of being actors.
That brings an interesting question of where to draw the line. Like how much are you responsible for what your audience does? I guess it would depend on what he said specifically, alone saying that they are crisis actors shouldn't really be enough, but telling your audience to hunt them down would be without a doubt a serious offense. This reminds me of youtube channels where they parody/"roast" other youtubers, but people in their audience find the person being roasted and try to doxx them, or cause mischief, even though that was not their intent at all (eventually leading them to have to put disclaimers telling people to NOT go after them). Those channels end up getting banned. The nutjobs ruin it for everyone.
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Offline SimonNZ

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Re: Coronavirus thread
« Reply #5290 on: September 21, 2021, 04:54:02 PM »
You're forgetting that that's not how stochastic terrorism works. You don't have to plan a specific event for a specific day, you just have to whip up your followers with fear, anger and outrage to such a fever pitch that its certain that something will happen, and it doesn't matter where or when so long as they identify the "correct" enemies - while the inciter maintains a plausible deniability.. (see: Trump, Donald)

DavidW

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Re: Coronavirus thread
« Reply #5291 on: September 22, 2021, 03:11:27 AM »
Anti-vax rules?!   :( What is up there?

PD

Restaurant owners putting up signs saying that the vaccinated are unwelcome and a health risk to their loyal customers due to the danger of "infection" by the vaccine.  Sadly I'm not joking.  Others just say that they are unwelcome because the vaccinated are un-American or un-patriotic.

Online Pohjolas Daughter

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Re: Coronavirus thread
« Reply #5292 on: September 22, 2021, 03:14:13 AM »
Restaurant owners putting up signs saying that the vaccinated are unwelcome and a health risk to their loyal customers due to the danger of "infection" by the vaccine.  Sadly I'm not joking.  Others just say that they are unwelcome because the vaccinated are un-American or un-patriotic.
:(  :'(

PD

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Re: Coronavirus thread
« Reply #5293 on: September 22, 2021, 03:42:51 AM »
Self-diagnosis, March 2019:

Conspiracy theorist Alex Jones blames 'psychosis' for his Sandy Hook claims

"The conspiracy theorist Alex Jones blamed various claims he has made, including that the 2012 Sandy Hook elementary school shooting was a hoax, on “psychosis”, according to a deposition given by the Infowars host as part of a Texas lawsuit.

Jones described his conspiracy thinking as a kind of mental disorder in the deposition, which was taken earlier this month for the lawsuit filed against him by the family of a six-year-old who was among 20 children and six adults killed in Newtown, Connecticut, in 2012, the Austin American-Statesman reported.

Jones said he “almost had like a form of psychosis back in the past where I basically thought everything was staged, even though I’m now learning a lot of times things aren’t staged”. [slow clap emoji goes here]

Jones blamed his mental state on “the trauma of the media and the corporations lying so much, then everything begins – you don’t trust anything anymore, kind of like a child whose parents lie to them over and over again, well, pretty soon they don’t know what reality is”.

The defamation suit was filed in Travis county, Texas, where Jones’ media company is based. In August, the judge presiding denied Jones’ request to dismiss the case.

Jones’ attorneys have defended his speech in court as “rhetorical hyperbole”, but denied it was defamation. In the deposition, Jones continued to voice conspiratorial suspicions about the Sandy Hook shooting.

“I still think that there was a man in the woods in camo … and just a lot of experts I’ve talked to, including retired FBI agents and other people and people high up in the Central Intelligence Agency, have told me that there is a cover-up in Sandy Hook,” Jones said.

A similar lawsuit has been filed in Connecticut. Several families in that suit say Jones’ comments have tormented them and subjected them to harassment and death threats by his followers, some of whom have accused them of being actors.

On Friday, a federal judge in West Virginia allowed another defamation case against Jones to proceed. The suit was filed on behalf of Brennan Gilmore, who captured footage of a fatal car attack on counterprotesters during a far-right rally in Charlottesville in August 2017.

In a statement, Andrew Mendrala, supervising attorney with the Civil Rights Clinic at Georgetown Law, said: “Victims of vile conspiracy theories should take comfort … today’s decision shows that the law will protect victims of baseless lies by holding people like Alex Jones accountable for the harm they cause.”

Did he beg the forgiveness of the parents he cruelly insulted and put at risk? Did he ask his followers to also beg their forgiveness and admit the error of their ways? Will he dedicate the rest of his life to being a cautionary tale of the dangers of misinformation, conspiracy and threat? (No, I'm not going to go listen to Joe fucking Rogan to find out).

Because this isn't the kind of thing that a simple yers-later "my bad" excuses.




"I was the party who was really traumatized" doesn't pass the sniff test.
Karl Henning, Ph.D.
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http://www.karlhenning.com/
[Matisse] was interested neither in fending off opposition,
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Re: Coronavirus thread
« Reply #5294 on: September 22, 2021, 03:45:26 AM »
Some of these lines will be wearisomely familiar:

"Experts say trumpeting ivermectin risks discouraging people from getting vaccinated; instead they just take an unproven drug when they get very sick with COVID-19. But Lorigo has built a potentially lucrative brand as the go-to guy for desperate people willing to buck science in the pandemic’s fourth wave.

Not that he sees it that way. In fact, Lorigo argues—without evidence—that doctors, hospitals, and “Big Pharma” are the ones turning people away from ivermectin in chase of their own profits.

Ralph Lorigo has built a potentially lucrative brand as the go-to guy for desperate people willing to buck science in the pandemic’s fourth wave. Now doctors are speaking out.
Karl Henning, Ph.D.
Composer & Clarinetist
Boston MA
http://www.karlhenning.com/
[Matisse] was interested neither in fending off opposition,
nor in competing for the favor of wayward friends.
His only competition was with himself. — Françoise Gilot

Offline greg

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Re: Coronavirus thread
« Reply #5295 on: September 22, 2021, 02:53:01 PM »
You're forgetting that that's not how stochastic terrorism works. You don't have to plan a specific event for a specific day, you just have to whip up your followers with fear, anger and outrage to such a fever pitch that its certain that something will happen, and it doesn't matter where or when so long as they identify the "correct" enemies - while the inciter maintains a plausible deniability.. (see: Trump, Donald)
Oh, that media buzzword.
So mainstream media such as CNN doesn't do this at all, right?

Ultimately people are responsible for their own actions. People can say whatever they want, if people are dumb enough to act on it then that's their fault. Obvious incitement to violence is currently the line (I think legally IIRC), but if you take "stochastic terrorism" seriously then you are moving the line closer and closer to authoritarianism and censorship/restriction of speech, and we all know how much happiness that provides people around the world. And the problem with that is you never know exactly where the line is. So some offhand comment that you have made in the past that wasn't intended to do any harm is taken out of context years later and then imagine getting into legal trouble for it.

That is the way China runs- last story I heard was about a fashion model who had photos from years ago wearing the WWII Japanese flag as a shirt, and the CCP recently found it and deleted everything from the internet and ended her career. And an actor who took some vacation photo in front of some historical monument or shrine, not knowing the significance or meaning of it, and same happened to him. Sounds like a psychologically fun system to live under.
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Online OrchestralNut

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Re: Coronavirus thread
« Reply #5296 on: September 22, 2021, 03:41:18 PM »
Restaurant owners putting up signs saying that the vaccinated are unwelcome and a health risk to their loyal customers due to the danger of "infection" by the vaccine.  Sadly I'm not joking.  Others just say that they are unwelcome because the vaccinated are un-American or un-patriotic.

WOW!  ???

What an incredibly strange and demented world we live in.

Offline (: premont :)

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Re: Coronavirus thread
« Reply #5297 on: September 22, 2021, 03:50:29 PM »
Being particularly at risk I am going to get my third Pfizer jab in four days. However, since all corona restrictions have been abandoned in my country, I still have to be very careful.
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Offline Holden

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Re: Coronavirus thread
« Reply #5298 on: September 22, 2021, 03:57:48 PM »
Restaurant owners putting up signs saying that the vaccinated are unwelcome and a health risk to their loyal customers due to the danger of "infection" by the vaccine.  Sadly I'm not joking.  Others just say that they are unwelcome because the vaccinated are un-American or un-patriotic.

David, both of us know that they don't inject you with any form of Covid but this is not actually wide spread knowledge which is a pity.
Cheers

Holden

Offline SimonNZ

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Re: Coronavirus thread
« Reply #5299 on: September 22, 2021, 06:57:53 PM »
Oh, that media buzzword.
So mainstream media such as CNN doesn't do this at all, right?


There is nothing in any way resembling the paranoid conspiracy fever dreams of an Alex Jones on CNN or similar. Suggesting there is is utter ridiculous. Instead of taking some youtubers word for it turn it on right now and see for yourself.