Author Topic: Coronavirus thread  (Read 231631 times)

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Offline (: premont :)

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Re: Coronavirus thread
« Reply #80 on: March 14, 2020, 02:20:02 PM »
. If you had cancer, or pneumonia, or diabetes or any other life-threatening condition, the probability that you'll die from seasonal flue is not much less than that of dying from Covid-19.

This is an unsubstantiated claim on you part.

As soon as a word has left the lips, not even the fastest horse can catch up with it.

Offline SimonNZ

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Re: Coronavirus thread
« Reply #81 on: March 14, 2020, 02:31:58 PM »
...and no reason to casually dismiss their potential deaths when with the right reaction and attitudes to guarding against the virus they could live a further x years or decades to do who knows what.

But, meh, they're just the old and sick, so fuck 'em.

Offline Pohjolas Daughter

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Re: Coronavirus thread
« Reply #82 on: March 14, 2020, 02:36:58 PM »
I'm beginning to see little signs of civilizational slippage, i.e. things that indicate people are dealing with an unprecedented crisis. My local library just closed for the duration, and today they sent me an overdue notice, indicating that the items I checked out are overdue. The due date is listed as 1962. This has never happened to me before.

I wondered how large a fine I would have to pay, but their website contained this notice:

"You may have received a message saying that your items are overdue...by about 58 years. Obviously, this is not correct (unless you have invented time travel, in which case: we have some questions). We think that the issue occurred when we were resetting due dates. We've put in a ticket with our tech company."
Thank you so much for making me laugh!  I really needed that.   :)  My local library is closed for a while...who knows for exactly how long....lots of other public places including schools closed too.  I suspect that there will be a lot of "play it by ear" as far as the authorities goes.  I wish that we had a national policy to direct things.  Rather than a town-by-town or (better) emanating from the state level.  I'm, I think, lucky in that it seems that our town is being more on the proactive side.  It's still hard though as decisions are being made at different levels depending upon who has the authority to make them.

PD

Offline Florestan

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Re: Coronavirus thread
« Reply #83 on: March 14, 2020, 02:46:42 PM »
This is an unsubstantiated claim on you part.

Is it really? Are you really going to tell me that the seasonal flue kills people who have no pre-existing, life-threatening condition?
« Last Edit: March 14, 2020, 02:50:38 PM by Florestan »
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Offline Pohjolas Daughter

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Re: Coronavirus thread
« Reply #84 on: March 14, 2020, 02:48:31 PM »
Governments across the world are advised by experts and are taking drastic measures, so yes I am taking this very seriously indeed. It is predicted that in the UK 80% of the population will be infected, the symptoms for some will be so mild that they will not even realise they have it, however, 1% are predicted to die, and of course for those aged over 65 the % of deaths shoots up. The affect on stock markets and businesses, large and small, worldwide is catastrophic.
I've been stunned by what I've seen happen to the markets; I don't know in detail what happened elsewhere, but when Pres. Trump was talking on Friday about the new measures to be taken, it was heartening to see the market react positively (up around 700 points).  Anyone who is either close to or is retired's blood pressure surely went up!

And yes, it's scary to see/hear about the risks to people who are middle age and older.  How do you protect everyone?  Also, how do you protect health care workers....people who are healthy are buying up the needed masks.  I spoke recently to one construction worker who was doing some demolition work inside a house and he told me of the problems trying to get masks to protect him from the dust/debris.

PD

Offline Pohjolas Daughter

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Re: Coronavirus thread
« Reply #85 on: March 14, 2020, 02:49:44 PM »
Hah! Book to the Future!
Very clever Karl!! ;D

Marc

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Re: Coronavirus thread
« Reply #86 on: March 14, 2020, 02:50:58 PM »
Thank you so much for making me laugh!  I really needed that.   :)  My local library is closed for a while...who knows for exactly how long....lots of other public places including schools closed too.  I suspect that there will be a lot of "play it by ear" as far as the authorities goes.  I wish that we had a national policy to direct things.  Rather than a town-by-town or (better) emanating from the state level.  I'm, I think, lucky in that it seems that our town is being more on the proactive side.  It's still hard though as decisions are being made at different levels depending upon who has the authority to make them.

PD

Proactivity, yeah. Saw a lovely short vid on the telly this evening, about volunteers who called the (known) elderly and the weaker people of their area on a daily basis, to ask if they wanted to have a little chat and/or if they could get them some groceries or medicin. Normally they were visited by acquaintances or by family, but since the higher risk that's not possible anymore, so they came up with this solution. One old man wanted to thank a volunteer who delivered some stuff (he wasn't allowed to bring it inside though) by shaking his hand. "No no, we can't do that!" the guy said.
 
(I did not see a volunteering librarian ringing up elderly people to say that they should return their 1726 copy of Gulliver's Travels though.)

Offline Florestan

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Re: Coronavirus thread
« Reply #87 on: March 14, 2020, 02:56:53 PM »
.they're just the old and sick

I'm sorry to state it but the old and sick are going to die much earlier than the young and healthy --- and I'm greatly puzzled that anyone can be morally opposed to a mere biological fact.
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Offline SimonNZ

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Re: Coronavirus thread
« Reply #88 on: March 14, 2020, 03:01:24 PM »
I'm sorry to state it but the old and sick are going to die much earlier than the young and healthy --- and I'm greatly puzzled that anyone can be morally opposed to a mere biological fact.

And I'm saying that more will die than need to with an "its just the flu" reaction. Which you seem unconcerned about. That doesn't mean anyone needs to freak out or panic, but they should be trusting the advice of medical experts.

Marc

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Re: Coronavirus thread
« Reply #89 on: March 14, 2020, 03:14:41 PM »
[…]
But, meh, they're just the old and sick, so fuck 'em.

Doctors have been dying too, btw. But hey, they could have known that it can be a dangerous job sometimes.
And they drink and smoketoomuch anyway.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vQODVsl5pFY

<a href="https://www.youtube.com/v/vQODVsl5pFY" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer" class="bbc_link bbc_flash_disabled new_win">https://www.youtube.com/v/vQODVsl5pFY</a>

Offline k a rl h e nn i ng

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Re: Coronavirus thread
« Reply #90 on: March 14, 2020, 03:21:53 PM »
Karl Henning, Ph.D.
Composer & Clarinetist
Boston MA
http://www.karlhenning.com/
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nor in competing for the favor of wayward friends.
His only competition was with himself. — Françoise Gilot

Offline Holden

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Re: Coronavirus thread
« Reply #91 on: March 14, 2020, 03:27:38 PM »
In another episode from "Dumb and Dumber" I see that the NZ Prime Minister has effectively closed the country's borders to everyone except Pacific Islanders.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/120279430/coronavirus-prime-minister-updates-nz-on-covid19-outbreak

Sounds good, but it's not. For a start, the horse has already bolted so what's the point of closing the stable door? While NZ has recorded six confirmed cases of the virus you can safely assume that there are many more. This is 'knee jerk' of the highest order.

Also, why are Pasifika exempt? Are the immune to the disease? It's the only reason I can think of. The fact is that Fiji, Samoa, Rarotonga, etc, have all had many international visitors over the last couple of months leaving the strong possibility that some of their citizens are infected as well.

As I said in a previous post, at least our government here in OZ is encouraging us to carry on as normally as possible but the whole affair reminds me of "Chicken Licken"

So what can we do other than stockpile goods we will probably take years to consume? How about looking after those who are most likely to be affected by this - our senior citizens. Put a plan into place to minimise the risk for them. Put a plan in place to make sure that they get the best possible protection. This alone should help reduce eventual fatalities.

As an aside, I was in Aldi yesterday and noticed that frozen foods are the next thing that people are stockpiling. Now a freezer can only hold so much and I wonder if Harvey Norman's are witnessing panic buying in their white goods section. :D
Cheers

Holden

Marc

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Re: Coronavirus thread
« Reply #92 on: March 14, 2020, 03:34:20 PM »
[…]
So what can we do other than stockpile goods we will probably take years to consume? How about looking after those who are most likely to be affected by this - our senior citizens. Put a plan into place to minimise the risk for them. Put a plan in place to make sure that they get the best possible protection. This alone should help reduce eventual fatalities.

That's what's been happening in most countries, I think/hope.

Quote
As an aside, I was in Aldi yesterday and noticed that frozen foods are the next thing that people are stockpiling. Now a freezer can only hold so much and I wonder if Harvey Norman's are witnessing panic buying in their white goods section. :D

Yeah, when their freezers are stuffed with food they might slow down, the selfish bastards. And then indeed they will be stockpiling freezers without a doubt. Stockpiling can be addictive. Well, at least some parts of the economy are making money.

Offline SimonNZ

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Re: Coronavirus thread
« Reply #93 on: March 14, 2020, 03:44:17 PM »
In another episode from "Dumb and Dumber" I see that the NZ Prime Minister has effectively closed the country's borders to everyone except Pacific Islanders.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/120279430/coronavirus-prime-minister-updates-nz-on-covid19-outbreak

Sounds good, but it's not. For a start, the horse has already bolted so what's the point of closing the stable door? While NZ has recorded six confirmed cases of the virus you can safely assume that there are many more. This is 'knee jerk' of the highest order.

Also, why are Pasifika exempt? Are the immune to the disease? It's the only reason I can think of. The fact is that Fiji, Samoa, Rarotonga, etc, have all had many international visitors over the last couple of months leaving the strong possibility that some of their citizens are infected as well.

As I said in a previous post, at least our government here in OZ is encouraging us to carry on as normally as possible but the whole affair reminds me of "Chicken Licken"

So what can we do other than stockpile goods we will probably take years to consume? How about looking after those who are most likely to be affected by this - our senior citizens. Put a plan into place to minimise the risk for them. Put a plan in place to make sure that they get the best possible protection. This alone should help reduce eventual fatalities.

As an aside, I was in Aldi yesterday and noticed that frozen foods are the next thing that people are stockpiling. Now a freezer can only hold so much and I wonder if Harvey Norman's are witnessing panic buying in their white goods section. :D

Did you even read the text of the article you linked to?

Because it answers all of the questions you just asked and contradicts your conclusions.

Marc

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Re: Coronavirus thread
« Reply #94 on: March 14, 2020, 04:04:49 PM »
Did you even read the text of the article you linked to?

Because it answers all of the questions you just asked and contradicts your conclusions.

I tried to open the link and read the article, but my virus software closed it after 10 seconds and said that a virus attack was blocked. :laugh:

(No kidding though. Tried it 3 times.)

Offline drogulus

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Re: Coronavirus thread
« Reply #95 on: March 14, 2020, 04:22:26 PM »

     I would not assume that the new virus will only kill people who would die otherwise from seasonal flu. I used to get bad cases of the flu and since I started getting yearly flu shots, which now means the extra strong version for older people, I don't get flu serious enough to develop into bronchitis.

     We're dealing with excess deaths. People protected by flu shots will die.
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Offline SimonNZ

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Re: Coronavirus thread
« Reply #96 on: March 14, 2020, 04:24:38 PM »
I tried to open the link and read the article, but my virus software closed it after 10 seconds and said that a virus attack was blocked. :laugh:

(No kidding though. Tried it 3 times.)

There's probably better and more info elsewhere, but here's what that one says:

Coronavirus: Everyone coming to New Zealand must isolate for 14 days, Prime Minister Ardern says

"From midnight Sunday, everyone arriving in New Zealand will have to isolate themselves for 14 days, Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern has announced.

The tighter border controls were announced during an update by the prime minister on New Zealand's response to the Covid-19 outbreak on Saturday afternoon. She said while it is not realistic for New Zealand to only have a handful of coronavirus cases, the changes would slow the spread of infection.

"New Zealand has today, relative to other countries, a small number of cases," Ardern said.

"We must plan and prepare for more cases. We must go hard and we must go early. We must do everything we can to protect the health of New Zealanders."

The restrictions apply to New Zealand citizens and residents as well as international visitors.

People travelling from the Pacific Islands to New Zealand will be exempt, unless they show symptoms of coronavirus.

The new measures mean New Zealand will have the strongest border restrictions in the world, apart from Israel and some Pacific Islands, which have effectively closed their borders.

As of midnight Saturday, no cruise ships will be able to dock in New Zealand until June 30.

Strict new border exit rules to the Pacific Islands will also be put in place.

Anyone with coronavirus symptoms will not be allowed to travel there and those who have been to other overseas countries will have to wait 14 days before going to the Pacific Islands.

Close or casual contacts of confirmed cases of Covid-19 will also be barred from travelling to the Pacific Islands. All travellers' temperatures will be taken before they leave for the Pacific Islands.

Travel restrictions would be reviewed in 16 days, the prime minister said.

Ardern urged New Zealanders not to travel overseas unless it was absolutely necessary.

We have significant capacity for testing, Ardern said. "It is there and available." There are enough resources for 550 people to be tested per day.

Medical practitioners would use their clinical judgement when deciding who needed to be tested, the prime minister said.

Ardern reiterated public health messages to prevent the spread of infection. "Wash your hands," she repeated three times.

People should also stay home and avoid contact with older people if they're sick and stop greeting each other with a handshake or hongi.

Finance minister Grant Robertson will announce an economic response on Tuesday.

The Government will announce guidelines on large mass events next week too.

In the meantime, people planning on hosting such gatherings should contact their local public health authority, Ardern said.

Soon after the press conference Air New Zealand said it was reviewing the impact of the "new measures announced this afternoon on its operations and will adjust its capacity accordingly. We expect to provide an update on network changes over the next few days".

It comes after a sixth case of the novel coronavirus was confirmed in Auckland.

A man in his 60s who had recently returned from the United States tested positive for the illness on Friday night.

SO WHAT ARE THE NEW RULES FOR NZ?

* Every person entering New Zealand from anywhere in the world will be required to self-isolate for 14 days, excluding the Pacific. These restrictions will all be reviewed in 16 days' time.

* The existing travel ban for China and Iran will continue

* Cruise ships banned from coming to New Zealand, until at least June 30, 2020

* Strict new health measures at the border for people departing to the Pacific

* Measures to help those in self-isolation to be announced next week

* Government will work closely with the aviation sector to encourage airlines to remain active in New Zealand, limiting the impacts on the tourism sector and exporters

* There will be a directive on mass gatherings announced early next week

The prime minister's announcement followed a Cabinet meeting in Auckland on Saturday."

Offline André

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Re: Coronavirus thread
« Reply #97 on: March 14, 2020, 04:26:09 PM »
That's what's been happening in most countries, I think/hope.

Yeah, when their freezers are stuffed with food they might slow down, the selfish bastards. And then indeed they will be stockpiling freezers without a doubt. Stockpiling can be addictive. Well, at least some parts of the economy are making money.

At the height of the epidemic electricity maintenance crews will be affected, too (why shouldn’t they?). So next time there’s a power outing they won’t be able to repair it. All those frozen goods will go to waste...

Consequences (real, imagined and just wacky) are endless...

Offline vandermolen

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Re: Coronavirus thread
« Reply #98 on: March 14, 2020, 04:33:45 PM »
"Courage is going from failure to failure without losing enthusiasm" (Churchill).

'The test of a work of art is, in the end, our affection for it, not our ability to explain why it is good' (Stanley Kubrick).

Offline drogulus

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Re: Coronavirus thread
« Reply #99 on: March 14, 2020, 04:35:08 PM »
I've been stunned by what I've seen happen to the markets; I don't know in detail what happened elsewhere, but when Pres. Trump was talking on Friday about the new measures to be taken, it was heartening to see the market react positively (up around 700 points).  Anyone who is either close to or is retired's blood pressure surely went up!



     I've been retired for just over 5 years, and my reaction is that the market drop is not the big deal, it's the recession that's developing that has me a little concerned. I'm looking at 2 years to get back to the 2020 high, give or take. If it was a typical markety bad news panic it would right itself in weeks.
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