USA Politics (redux)

[Pohjolas Daughter]

I think that this poll from Seven Letter Insight was quite interesting.  Republicans and Democrats were ask various questions as to who and what they would support including issues like for or against a peaceful transition to a Biden presidency, etc.:  https://thehill.com/homenews/527138-two-thirds-of-gop-voters-support-trump-running-for-president-in-2024-survey

Currently, I'm listening to the live Michigan Board of State Canvassers meeting...quite interesting to hear from Christopher Thomas who "is a fellow with BPC's Democracy Project. Thomas is retired from the Michigan Department of State on June 30, 2017 after 40 years of election administration service, which included 36 years as Michigan's Director of Elections. Thomas worked for Democratic and Republican Secretaries of State.
While employed by the Michigan Secretary of State, Thomas administered the Michigan election law, campaign finance act and lobbyist disclosure law and served as Secretary to Board of State Canvassers. He began his election administration career in 1974 in Washington, D.C. with the Clerk of the U.S. House of Representatives and the Federal Election Commission."

And now Daniel Baxter:  https://www.eac.gov/sites/default/files/event_document/files/BIOv.2.Daniel%20A.%20Baxter.pdf

Norman Shinkle (on the board) grilled Christopher Thomas about what reasons one could adjourn and delay the vote (per Michigan statute).  Mr. Thomas, towards the end, that he didn't know.... maybe if one or two people were sick, but that basically, the board must vote and didn't have any reason to wait forty days.

I don't know how many of your general populace will be allowed to speak (as of the beginning of the meeting, over 700 had signed up to either speak or have their comments read).

PD

[Pohjolas Daughter]

     
     You can watch on C-SPAN.

Thanks.  It's streaming fine at the other website, but nice to know that there are options! 

Are you watching it Drogulus?

PD

[drogulus]

I guess Trump follows the currently popular philosophy of "never give up on your dream, keep fighting and you will get what you want in the end" .

     

     Trump says he was inspired by this book. In particular it told him to never admit defeat.

Thanks.  It's streaming fine at the other website, but nice to know that there are options! 

Are you watching it Drogulus?

PD

     It's on another tab while I defeat fascism in this one. So, I'm listening along.

[Karl Henning]

     It's on another tab while I defeat fascism in this one. So, I'm listening along.

Goldarnit! Are you doing enough against Communism, though?!

[drogulus]

Goldarnit! Are you doing enough against Communism, though?!

     No matter what I do, it's never enough.

[Karl Henning]

     No matter what I do, it's never enough.

I feel ya.

[T. D.]

Some levity:

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/11/23/trump-fears-giuliani-and-other-biden-vote-challenge-lawyers-are-fools.html

[Pohjolas Daughter]

     

     Trump says he was inspired by this book. In particular it told him to never admit defeat.

     It's on another tab while I defeat fascism in this one. So, I'm listening along.

You're a busy man!

I can see that Mr. Shinkle is not to be swayed. 

Interesting to hear the comments and debate.

PD

[Pohjolas Daughter]

Some levity:

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/11/23/trump-fears-giuliani-and-other-biden-vote-challenge-lawyers-are-fools.html

He should just disassociate from everyone, non? 

PD

[drogulus]

You're a busy man!

I can see that Mr. Shinkle is not to be swayed. 

Interesting to hear the comments and debate.

PD

     He's taking the position that a post certification audit or recount can happen before he certifies the result. For this he wants to adjourn. That's exactly how much sense it makes. He wants what he can't have.

[Pohjolas Daughter]

     He's taking the position that a post certification audit or recount can happen before he certifies the result. For this he wants to adjourn. That's exactly how much sense it makes. He wants what he can't have.

I know.  He and a lawyer (sorry, I don't recall his name) are trying to argue that this is applicable:  Section 168.842.  The lawyer, in particular, got into it with Aaron Van Langevelde — Republican, vice chair in which he was arguing that the state canvassers did have more authority (basically, that it didn't need to be defined specifically) vs. what Mr. Van Langevelde was arguing.

PD

[Herman]

Wow, the mayor of Jackson MI, Derek Dobies, has a contribution to the hearing at the board of canvassers, talking about the harrassment by Republican "observers" during the vote counting .

[drogulus]

I know.  He and a lawyer (sorry, I don't recall his name) are trying to argue that this is applicable:  Section 168.842. 
PD

The board has power to adjourn from time to time to await the receipt or correction of returns, or for other necessary purposes, but shall complete the canvass and announce their determination not later than the fortieth day after the election.

     There's no other necessary purpose for the board to adjourn. They have a quorum. Any audit or recount would come after certification.

     Brater just made the point. We can put this one to rest.

[T. D.]

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/11/23/trump-loses-pennsylvania-ballot-lawsuit-seeking-to-block-biden-win.html
Trump campaign suffers new court loss in attempt to block Biden's win in Pennsylvania

[Herman]

A non-party affiliated observer, named Elizabeth Temkin (from the U of M), talks about the relentless harrassment she observed coming from Republican affiliated observers during the vote counting at a city precinct (i.e. many black voters). She spent seven hours there as an observer and noted that some of the Republican observers challenged every single ballot just to make life miserable for the counters and to slow down the process as much as possible.

Another UofM student, Sean Brennan (speaking from the beautiful Law School building), talks about similar behavior at the vote counting location in Ann Arbor; Republican observers harrassing vote counters unmasked, getting too close and challenging every singe ballot indiscriminatedly, which is against the law. When this Law Student told him this, the Republican observer said he wasn't there to observe the law but to do what the republican party told him to do. Sabotage the count.

This is also worthwhile since the Diner Cop thought it was his task to mention that A Trump had not attempted to steal the elections and B there had been no voter harrassment, so all those predictions were false.

Alternative facts...

[Karl Henning]

The Sweaty Clown Car's Wolverine State boondoggle is over:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/michigan-vote-certification/2020/11/23/c435ed24-2d52-11eb-bae0-50bb17126614_story.html

[Todd]

This is also worthwhile since the Diner Cop thought it was his task to mention that A Trump had not attempted to steal the elections and B there had been no voter harrassment, so all those predictions were false.

Contrary to what has been written on GMG, Trump did not attempt to steal the election.

Question to moderators, does Herman get a pass on using nicknames for board members, as opposed to politicians?

[Karl Henning]

The Sweaty Clown Car's Wolverine State boondoggle is over:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/michigan-vote-certification/2020/11/23/c435ed24-2d52-11eb-bae0-50bb17126614_story.html

Incidentally: Detroit had more vote errors in 2016 when Trump won Michigan by a narrow margin. He didn't object then.

[BasilValentine]

Contrary to what has been written on GMG, Trump did not attempt to steal the election.

Of course he didn't! How could anyone think threatening state legislators in order to coerce their disenfranchisement of millions of voters in Michigan was an effort to steal an election? That's just absurd.

[Todd]

Of course he didn't! How could anyone think threatening state legislators in order to coerce their disenfranchisement of millions of voters in Michigan was an effort to steal an election? That's just absurd.

I should like to see evidence that supports this.  Preferably, it would meet a standard rather higher than the evidence offered for his impeachment trial.

Last I saw, in the failing New York Times, Michigan certified the vote for Biden, so all the sound and fury was and is for nothing.

Maybe Trump's nefarious deeds in the Wolverine State can be added to the voluminous list of charges that can be brought in 2021, or whenever.