USA Politics (redux)

[drogulus]

     The Decline of Republican Demonization

     Paul Krugman muses on why Repubs are "low energy" in opposition to Biden's legislative agenda.

     My preferred explanation, which Krug mentions, is that Repubs no longer have the chops, and lost the ability to formulate counterproposals that even meet the dismally low threshold of "Republican alternative". The rot is so deep they couldn't even agree on repealing and (heh!) replacing OCare when they had control.

Whether this is accurate or not... This is about the most unflattering thing you could say about the moderate left, though. 



(to clarify, i'm not talking about health care)

     I don't know why you think that. I certainly don't agree that the kind of strategizing involved in getting from "it's too radical to ever happen" to "keep your dirty government hands off my ObamaCare!" is something to complain about. I sometimes complain about the timidity of moderates who think Mitch is the All Powerful Oz. That's what he wants you to think.

[greg]

I don't know why you think that. I certainly don't agree that the kind of strategizing involved in getting from "it's too radical to ever happen" to "keep your dirty government hands off my ObamaCare!" is something to complain about. I sometimes complain about the timidity of moderates who think Mitch is the All Powerful Oz. That's what he wants you to think.

It sounds like a paranoid right-wing perspective, though.

"Try to get what they can get" and "ex-radical" sounds like left moderates want the same thing extreme leftists want, the difference being that left moderates are just playing the long game, and extreme leftists are going for revolution (short game, and unrealistic). Which would be like saying people left moderates are communists in disguise.

Maybe it's the way you phrased it?

[T. D.]

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-03-26/arrest-of-georgia-lawmaker-sharpens-debate-on-voting-bills

The arrest of a Black Georgia state lawmaker who was seeking entry to Governor Brian Kemp's closed-door signing of a sweeping election law is placing a sharper scrutiny on Republican-led statehouses' pursuit of voting restrictions.

State Representative Park Cannon, a Democrat, was released from jail early Friday after she was handcuffed and arrested by two White Georgia State Patrol officers as supporters demanded to know what law she violated.

She had knocked on Kemp's office door in the statehouse where he was signing a law that changes voting access rules in Georgia. Often a public ceremony for popular bills, the bill-signing took place behind closed doors with no media presence.

The incident prompted a range of angry protests, including from Georgia's newly elected Democratic senators, Raphael Warnock and Jon Ossoff.

"I am not the first Georgian to be arrested for fighting voter suppression. I'd love to say I'm the last, but we know that isn't true," Cannon tweeted after her release from jail. She blasted the bill signed by Kemp as a hateful measure restricting "many methods of voting" that "serve no purpose other than to keep voters from exercising their constitutional right to vote."

[71 dB]

But the only pattern here is Rich people, not Rich white men.

Yes, being rich is by far most important. Being also white and male helps a little bit more. 

I think that problem is over... not seeing any news about that more recent than 3 weeks ago.

Well, it SEEMS like that if you only follow MSM news coverage. They don't give a fuck. You need to follow independent journalists to know what is happening in the country.

Can Texas Be Ground Zero for National Rent Strike?

https://www.youtube.com/v/ttmqU92tjKc

[Fëanor]

     He is not lefty enough to satisfy the demands for performative leftism. The purpose of moderate left pols is to enact what the left wants and can realistically get. The point is to succeed in making aspirations "ex-radical".

Indeed there is effectively no Left in the USA, at most a Center-left, contrary the fear mongering of Republicans and Alt-right.

[drogulus]

It sounds like a paranoid right-wing perspective, though.

"Try to get what they can get" and "ex-radical" sounds like left moderates want the same thing extreme leftists want, the difference being that left moderates are just playing the long game, and extreme leftists are going for revolution (short game, and unrealistic). Which would be like saying people left moderates are communists in disguise.

Maybe it's the way you phrased it?

     I'm talking about the process by which solutions go from radical to accepted, which requires a delicate dance between the center and progressives. I don't think revolutionaries are part of that. They want to overthrow the system, not evolve it.

[71 dB]

     I'm talking about the process by which solutions go from radical to accepted, which requires a delicate dance between the center and progressives. I don't think revolutionaries are part of that. They want to overthrow the system, not evolve it.

People who go bankrupt this year because of medical bills don't have 100 years to wait for incrementalists to finally reach a M4A system.
"Radical" ideas become accepted among regular people by educating them how the radical label is just a smear tactics to protect the rigged system for the rich.
The progressives are not radical.
Moderate Dems and Republicans are radicalised by corporate money.
Thinking corporate profits are more important and well-being of regular people is radical af.
You just need to educate people about that.
It's not even difficult. You just have to do it, reach out to people.

[drogulus]

"Radical" ideas become accepted among regular people by educating them how the radical label is just a smear tactics to protect the rigged system for the rich.

     I think it works better if you don't try to educate people about the meaning of radical and just make them an offer they can't refuse. Then, when they have some free time they might come to the conclusion that this business of what's radical or what isn't is largely beside the point.

[SimonNZ]

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-03-26/arrest-of-georgia-lawmaker-sharpens-debate-on-voting-bills

The arrest of a Black Georgia state lawmaker who was seeking entry to Governor Brian Kemp's closed-door signing of a sweeping election law is placing a sharper scrutiny on Republican-led statehouses' pursuit of voting restrictions.

State Representative Park Cannon, a Democrat, was released from jail early Friday after she was handcuffed and arrested by two White Georgia State Patrol officers as supporters demanded to know what law she violated.

She had knocked on Kemp's office door in the statehouse where he was signing a law that changes voting access rules in Georgia. Often a public ceremony for popular bills, the bill-signing took place behind closed doors with no media presence.

The incident prompted a range of angry protests, including from Georgia's newly elected Democratic senators, Raphael Warnock and Jon Ossoff.

"I am not the first Georgian to be arrested for fighting voter suppression. I'd love to say I'm the last, but we know that isn't true," Cannon tweeted after her release from jail. She blasted the bill signed by Kemp as a hateful measure restricting "many methods of voting" that "serve no purpose other than to keep voters from exercising their constitutional right to vote."

Knocking on a door gets a black woman arrested? And a State Representative at that?

Anyone still remember (white male) Matt Gaetz and two dozen of his fellow house republicans much more aggressively and threateningly trying to get in and disrupt the "Secret Bunker Testimony" of Laura Cooper?

"LET US IN! LET US IN!": HOW MATT GAETZ, JIM JORDAN, AND HOUSE REPUBLICANS BUSTED INTO TOP SECRET IMPEACHMENT HEARINGS—AND ORDERED PIZZA
Egged on by Trump, they compromised the House's Sensitive Compartmented Information Facility, putting national security at risk. As Rep. Eric Swalwell recalls, they chanted, they yelled, and they ordered pizza—lots of pizza.


and interesting rereading that what a forewarning it now seems

[T. D.]

Knocking on a door gets a black woman arrested? And a State Representative at that?

Anyone still remember (white male) Matt Gaetz and two dozen of his fellow house republicans much more aggressively and threateningly trying to get in and disrupt the "Secret Bunker Testimony" of Laura Cooper?

"LET US IN! LET US IN!": HOW MATT GAETZ, JIM JORDAN, AND HOUSE REPUBLICANS BUSTED INTO TOP SECRET IMPEACHMENT HEARINGS—AND ORDERED PIZZA
Egged on by Trump, they compromised the House's Sensitive Compartmented Information Facility, putting national security at risk. As Rep. Eric Swalwell recalls, they chanted, they yelled, and they ordered pizza—lots of pizza.

and interesting rereading that what a forewarning it now seems

Cheeto Mussolini rewarded Jordan with the nation's highest civilian honor:
https://www.pbs.org/newshour/politics/trump-rewards-gop-ally-rep-jim-jordan-with-medal-of-freedom

Same Jordan who's been widely accused of covering up sexual abuse scandal while a wrestling coach at Ohio State U:

https://www.esquire.com/sports/a35120040/richard-strauss-ohio-state-wrestling-sexual-abuse/

[Karl Henning]

You just need to educate people about that.
It's not even difficult. You just have to do it, reach out to people.

How are you doing with "educating" us?

[71 dB]

How are you doing with "educating" us?

I think a bunch of classical music fans are not statistically relevant and also too much into the thinking of MSM maybe?
Reaching to people means minimum wage workers for example.

[Fëanor]

Thinking corporate profits are more important and well-being of regular people is radical af.
You just need to educate people about that.
It's not even difficult. You just have to do it, reach out to people.

How are you doing with "educating" us?

Granted, Americans take umbrage at us foreigner's criticizing their nation.  After all, theirs is the greatest nation and first and greatest democracy in the world;  how can we lessor folk presume to suggest improvements?

71 dB, expect this sort of reaction.

[Karl Henning]

How are you doing with "educating" us?


Granted, Americans take umbrage at us foreigner's criticizing their nation.  After all, theirs is the greatest nation and first and greatest democracy in the world;  how can we lessor folk presume to suggest improvements?

71 dB, expect this sort of reaction.

I've seen sharper analyses of my oosts in fortune cookies.

[drogulus]

Reaching to people means minimum wage workers for example.

     What reaches minimum wage workers is action to improve their lives. It should not escape notice that Biden is in favor of helping working class people, and this is not just an end but a means of reconnection with an important part of the traditional Dem coalition.
     

[71 dB]

Granted, Americans take umbrage at us foreigner's criticizing their nation.  After all, theirs is the greatest nation and first and greatest democracy in the world;  how can we lessor folk presume to suggest improvements?

71 dB, expect this sort of reaction.

It is not the fault of us foreigners the US sucks at so many things it should excel given how rich country we are talking about. The fact that we foreigners are suggesting improvements tells about how we CARE about the US and its people. First you point out problems. Then you start fixing those problems. In Texas black communities without water are told to take water out of swimming pools and boil the water before drinking it! So, in the richest country in the World people the treated worse than animals. Yes, we foreigners are on point saying the US sucks. The day in the US every person has save clean drinkable tap water the country sucks less.

Yes, Fëanor, we can expect his sort of reaction. I have gotten used to it.

[ritter]

This is really over the top...I am not American, I admire many things of that country, I think there's also many things that can be improved there, but I take strong exception to some bloke in Finland (who barely knows the US, unless it's from propaganda on YouTube) insulting the place day in and day out.

Enough is enough....

[Fëanor]

I've seen sharper analyses of my oosts in fortune cookies.

Perhaps fortune cookies is where you get most of you insights? 

[71 dB]

I've seen sharper analyses of my oosts in fortune cookies.

It would explain a lot if it turned out your political knowledge is from fortune cookies. 

You are so defensive Karl. Relax a bit. This becomes easier for you when you accept the fact outsiders really can provide valuable insight on certain things. Parents moaning about their children doing poorly in school don't hate their children. Similarly we foreigners don't hate the US pointing out things that suck. What I hate is the reasons (oligarchy, corruption, greed etc.) why those things suck, not the country.

I understand it is hard when your worldview get challenged hard, but that's how our understanding increases. I used to support Hillary Clinton in 2016 not knowing the (corporate) Dems are ALSO utterly corrupt. After the election I wanted to know why Hillary lost and started following US politics more closely. I learned the truth and about the reasons why Trump won. I accepted being wrong for three decades about the Dems. I could be still in denial about the truth, but I am not.

[SimonNZ]

This is really over the top...I am not American, I admire many things of that country, I think there's also many things that can be improved there, but I take strong exception to some bloke in Finland (who barely knows the US, unless it's from propaganda on YouTube) insulting the place day in and day out.

Enough is enough....

+1

71s language would be called racism if any other country were the subject.

And now he's learned that people dislike the use of the word"sucks" he puts it in every post. The way a troll would. The way he did when he was told any other term was insulting.