Author Topic: Op 61  (Read 5538 times)

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Online André

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Re: Op 61
« Reply #80 on: December 20, 2020, 01:05:53 PM »
I assume it’s less controversial than her performance of the Tchaikovsky concerto ? Or is it not ?  ???

Handelian

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Re: Op 61
« Reply #81 on: January 26, 2021, 11:38:52 PM »


Wild woman Patricia Kopatchinskaja teamed with Philippe Herreweghe.  Ms Kopatchinskaja is prone to having ideas and then executing on those ideas.  Crazy, right?  Herreweghe starts with a tutti that sounds like a scaled up version of what Bohren went for.  The overall timing of 22'41" puts this on the swift side, and the winds are nicely prominent.  Kopatchinskaja enters daringly slowly, then accelerates as she ascends, generating a lovely sound, and as the movement unfolds, she plays with an improvisatory and fantastic style, embellishing, stripping away vibrato for long stretches, and generally just letting rip.  It's novel and fresh compared to so many other versions, though people more concerned with perceived traditional style may not like what they hear.  Or maybe they will.  The cadenza is even more likely to divide opinion.  Kopatchinskaja opts for the Op 61a cadenza, which she transcribed herself again, and she wrote two violin parts, both of which she plays, which of course means overdubbing is used.  It is definitely contrived, but it also definitely works, and it adds something unique to the survey.  After the crackling, highly interventionist opener, Kopatchinskaja delivers one of the greatest imaginable Larghettos.  Swift overall, it never really sounds it, and Kopatchinskaja plays just about as dolce as one can imagine when needed, yet she also plays with no little verve in some places.  It comes off as a perfectly realized blend of middle and late Beethoven.  Herreweghe's support is top notch; he gets great playing from the band, delivers finely scaled tuttis, yet also cedes to the soloist, and it ends with her cadenza, which both jars and sounds inevitable.  The briefest of pauses leads to a Rondo where she leaps around in a Mendelssohnian way, adds rustic flair aplenty, and lightens the mood while still keeping things bold and inventive, yet still light.  It's quite an accomplishment.  It's brilliant.  It's one of the best ever.

Just to agree with you on the performance but if you look at the film made of it, the soloists duets with the orchestra leader. I don’t think it is overdubbed therefore. It certainly isn’t if this is the same performance of the Beethoven. Certainly one of my favourite performances but unfortunately has become very scarce on CD at the moment

Offline Todd

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Re: Op 61
« Reply #82 on: January 27, 2021, 05:48:51 AM »
I don’t think it is overdubbed therefore.


The recording is overdubbed.
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Handelian

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Re: Op 61
« Reply #83 on: January 28, 2021, 08:44:55 AM »

The recording is overdubbed.

How do you know that? She plays the same cadenza in concert and that isn’t overdubbed
« Last Edit: January 28, 2021, 09:35:16 AM by Handelian »

Online Brian

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Re: Op 61
« Reply #84 on: January 28, 2021, 11:27:09 AM »
How do you know that? She plays the same cadenza in concert and that isn’t overdubbed
This essay about the recording says it's overdubbed, and the BBC also reports "multi-tracking herself."

Handelian

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Re: Op 61
« Reply #85 on: January 28, 2021, 11:37:54 AM »
This essay about the recording says it's overdubbed, and the BBC also reports "multi-tracking herself."

Are they right though because in the concert performance on YouTube she plays the cadenza with the leader of the orchestra. Nothing overdubbed there.

Online Brian

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Re: Op 61
« Reply #86 on: January 28, 2021, 11:46:32 AM »
Are they right though because in the concert performance on YouTube she plays the cadenza with the leader of the orchestra. Nothing overdubbed there.
If I owned the recording I would look in the booklet to see what it says, but I don't, so I'm trusting the people who do.

Handelian

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Re: Op 61
« Reply #87 on: January 28, 2021, 12:11:59 PM »
If I owned the recording I would look in the booklet to see what it says, but I don't, so I'm trusting the people who do.

Yes I don’t own the recording either but I have watched the concert and there is no overdubbing in the cadenza which appears to be the same. So unless it specifically says on the booklet it is overdubbed I don’t know why they are assuming it is

Offline Todd

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Re: Op 61
« Reply #88 on: January 28, 2021, 04:33:32 PM »
The recording is overdubbed.
The universe is change; life is opinion. - Marcus Aurelius, Meditations

Everything dies - Alien Bounty Hunter, The X-Files

Everyone dies - William Barr, United States Attorney General

Offline amw

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Re: Op 61
« Reply #89 on: January 28, 2021, 04:41:29 PM »
Page 18 of the booklet:



It doesn't particularly matter, from an aural perspective, whether overdubbing is used or whether the cadenza is just played with a second violinist; presumably the first option is preferred in a studio recording and the second option is preferred in live performance.
« Last Edit: January 28, 2021, 04:44:04 PM by amw »

Handelian

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Re: Op 61
« Reply #90 on: January 28, 2021, 11:33:31 PM »
Page 18 of the booklet:



It doesn't particularly matter, from an aural perspective, whether overdubbing is used or whether the cadenza is just played with a second violinist; presumably the first option is preferred in a studio recording and the second option is preferred in live performance.

Thanks for clearing that up. It seemed to be a big deal to the BBC reviewer and I couldn’t see why as it was done successfully anyway in public performance. Not sure why theyoved-dubbed i the recording though.