Tchaikovsky

[Scion7]

Heck, why should anyone in 2016 have trusted me? 

Can we even trust you NOW?!?!!  BA-HA-HA-HA-HA!! 

[Atriod]

I actually reviewed a Sladkovsky album for MusicWeb back in 2016 and enjoyed it enough to be curious about his subsequent album releases. Don't know who Gregor Tassie is at all, but that's kind of Jens' point - with MW, you really need to keep track of the writers and their expertise (or lack). Heck, why should anyone in 2016 have trusted me? 

MusicWeb can get pretty crazy if you dig deep, like this massive Mahler 1 survey. http://www.musicweb-international.com/classrev/2022/Feb/Mahler-sy1-survey-LD.pdf

That's the first time I heard of Andrea Battistoni and he is now my favorite current performing conductor.

[Brian]

MusicWeb can get pretty crazy if you dig deep, like this massive Mahler 1 survey. http://www.musicweb-international.com/classrev/2022/Feb/Mahler-sy1-survey-LD.pdf

That's the first time I heard of Andrea Battistoni and he is now my favorite current performing conductor.

Wow, this is an amazing survey and truly does justice to the original MW Mahler survey by Tony Duggan. I didn't think Duggan's thoroughness and integrity could be surpassed, but here we go. This is giving me quite a few ideas for future listening. (Particularly interested to know that although this author doesn't love the F-X Roth "HIP" Titan, he does think the Roth performance with SWR is one of the best ever.)
EDIT: Is there a page that lists all the Mahler surveys? They for some reason don't have it listed on their "composer resources" page.

[Atriod]

Wow, this is an amazing survey and truly does justice to the original MW Mahler survey by Tony Duggan. I didn't think Duggan's thoroughness and integrity could be surpassed, but here we go. This is giving me quite a few ideas for future listening. (Particularly interested to know that although this author doesn't love the F-X Roth "HIP" Titan, he does think the Roth performance with SWR is one of the best ever.)
EDIT: Is there a page that lists all the Mahler surveys? They for some reason don't have it listed on their "composer resources" page.

I'm not sure, I came across this from a Google search.

[Brian]

I'm not sure, I came across this from a Google search.

Thanks. Found his survey of the Seventh as well. Regrettably the guy who updated the survey of the Fourth turned in only six pages of terse summaries of other people's reviews.

[DavidW]

Thanks. Found his survey of the Seventh as well. Regrettably the guy who updated the survey of the Fourth turned in only six pages of terse summaries of other people's reviews.

It seems like it is a major project and it will take years for all of the symphonies to be done.  It is astonishingly comprehensive!  I haven't seen anything like this since the Eroica project, and even then that was just looking at timings.

[Atriod]

I have finished my latest "Symphony Cycle Survey". You're here, so you know it's Tchaikovsky.


A Survey of Tchaikovsky Symphony Cycles

Without first looking, how many complete (1-6) sets do you think exist?

I'm always surprised how much work these end up being. And then it's still not complete or 100% accurate. Any discovered flaws would therefore be appreciated if brought to my attention! Thanks ever so much.

Great job with this list, I thought the tangled mess of Ken-Ichiro Kobayashi's recordings wouldn't be covered but you did a really good job. There is just one you missed  his most recent recording with Kobaken and His Friends Orchestra. I think Kazuo Yamada has a cycle spread across various labels. Takashi Asahina has recorded 4-6 several times.

For release dates where you have a question mark:

Kobayashi/Czech Phil. Tchaikovsky 5 - 2012 (Exton Lab Gold line, basically just fancier packaging in a Japan XRCD style digipak instead of a jewel case. So release dates for Exton releases can vary as they sometimes reissue the same live date several times in different packaging styles/catalog numbers)
Lazarev/Yomiuri Nippon Tchaikovsky 2 - 2007
Lazarev/Yomiuri Nippon Tchaikovsky 3 - 2006
Lazarev/Yomiuri Nippon Tchaikovsky 5 - 2005

My impressions with numerous Kobayashi recordings - super romantic, hot, heavy as Hurwitz calls them "panting" style. Some like the ones with the LSO are not that great, just too much mush. My favorites from him are the partial Arnhem cycle and the best of his 5s is with the Czech Phil (overall an uneven cycle though). The Manfred with Czech Phil is the greatest performance of it I've heard.

Lazarev - an easily accessible recording for him in the west is him conducting Shostakovich Symphony 11. Spirited interpretations of Tchaikovsky that don't go for any extremes.

I have been extremely impressed with what I've heard from the Japanese orchestras.

[SurprisedByBeauty]

Great job with this list, I thought the tangled mess of Ken-Ichiro Kobayashi's recordings wouldn't be covered but you did a really good job. There is just one you missed  his most recent recording with Kobaken and His Friends Orchestra. I think Kazuo Yamada has a cycle spread across various labels. Takashi Asahina has recorded 4-6 several times.

Thanks so much for the help! Now I have to track down "Kobayashi V", though? Oy veh. :-) Fortunately, I can only find a Fifth with the "Kobaken" Orchestra, not a complete cycle. Phew. Or am I missing something? Similarly, I can only find a チャイコフスキー Fifth with  Kazuo Yamada, nothing else. (Sapporo, that one.)

So my strong feeling is by all means question his objectivity but he is writing from the standpoint of simple (gushing?) enthusiasm not personal economic gain!  I'm not going to criticise someone for being a fan.....

I should have pointed out much sooner, that I don't wish to imply monetary gain, by using the phrase "shill review". I'm more liberally interpreting it as something along the lines of "overdue praise for ulterior motives". Sometimes -- often -- the price is as low as flattery or the intent to flatter. But it is true: I'm hyperallergic to gushers, and thus perhaps too harsh in my response. Other than that: What Brian said! 

[Roasted Swan]

Thanks so much for the help! Now I have to track down "Kobayashi V", though? Oy veh. :-) Fortunately, I can only find a Fifth with the "Kobaken" Orchestra, not a complete cycle. Phew. Or am I missing something? Similarly, I can only find a チャイコフスキー Fifth with  Kazuo Yamada, nothing else. (Sapporo, that one.)


I should have pointed out much sooner, that I don't wish to imply monetary gain, by using the phrase "shill review". I'm more liberally interpreting it as something along the lines of "overdue praise for ulterior motives". Sometimes -- often -- the price is as low as flattery or the intent to flatter. But it is true: I'm hyperallergic to gushers, and thus perhaps too harsh in my response. Other than that: What Brian said! 

Fair enough - but take a moment at some point to check out the Sladkovsky performances I linked above.  Perhaps they are not at the level the MWI reviewer implies (ie best ever) but they are good and often very good so I'm pleased to know them.

[vers la flamme]

MusicWeb can get pretty crazy if you dig deep, like this massive Mahler 1 survey. http://www.musicweb-international.com/classrev/2022/Feb/Mahler-sy1-survey-LD.pdf

That's the first time I heard of Andrea Battistoni and he is now my favorite current performing conductor.

Holy shit, this is a PhD thesis. I didn't know there were THAT many Mahler 1's out there.

[Atriod]

Holy shit, this is a PhD thesis. I didn't know there were THAT many Mahler 1's out there.

Hurwitz said his most watched videos by composer were Mahler and by a significant margin. Like when he'd release a review of a new Mahler album they'd be the first to get into the several thousands of views and this was when his channel was still quite early on.

Thanks so much for the help! Now I have to track down "Kobayashi V", though? Oy veh. :-) Fortunately, I can only find a Fifth with the "Kobaken" Orchestra, not a complete cycle. Phew. Or am I missing something? Similarly, I can only find a チャイコフスキー Fifth with  Kazuo Yamada, nothing else. (Sapporo, that one.)

I'll try and double check about Yamada, my friends might have included LPs in that comment.

The new fifth is a single recording not part of a cycle, just mentioned since I could see it becoming a complete or incomplete cycle since it's a "new" orchestra.

[dhibbard]

Great job with this list, I thought the tangled mess of Ken-Ichiro Kobayashi's recordings wouldn't be covered but you did a really good job. There is just one you missed  his most recent recording with Kobaken and His Friends Orchestra. I think Kazuo Yamada has a cycle spread across various labels. Takashi Asahina has recorded 4-6 several times.

For release dates where you have a question mark:

Kobayashi/Czech Phil. Tchaikovsky 5 - 2012 (Exton Lab Gold line, basically just fancier packaging in a Japan XRCD style digipak instead of a jewel case. So release dates for Exton releases can vary as they sometimes reissue the same live date several times in different packaging styles/catalog numbers)
Lazarev/Yomiuri Nippon Tchaikovsky 2 - 2007
Lazarev/Yomiuri Nippon Tchaikovsky 3 - 2006
Lazarev/Yomiuri Nippon Tchaikovsky 5 - 2005

My impressions with numerous Kobayashi recordings - super romantic, hot, heavy as Hurwitz calls them "panting" style. Some like the ones with the LSO are not that great, just too much mush. My favorites from him are the partial Arnhem cycle and the best of his 5s is with the Czech Phil (overall an uneven cycle though). The Manfred with Czech Phil is the greatest performance of it I've heard.

Lazarev - an easily accessible recording for him in the west is him conducting Shostakovich Symphony 11. Spirited interpretations of Tchaikovsky that don't go for any extremes.

I have been extremely impressed with what I've heard from the Japanese orchestras.

I would say perhaps 18 or 20...  I did a survey last year and watched some videos about the "best sounding ones"  so I acquired 6 of them.. but there are several good ones... Markevich and Svetlanov and Jarvi??

[Atriod]

I would say perhaps 18 or 20...  I did a survey last year and watched some videos about the "best sounding ones"  so I acquired 6 of them.. but there are several good ones... Markevich and Svetlanov and Jarvi??

Markevitch is a classic and sounds good. For Svetlanov I have the Melodiya cycle and the two cycles on Exton, one studio and one live. The Melodiya recordings are rough and the performances rather variable. The live Exton has some orchestral mistakes they didn't bother to fix but it's absolutely thrilling ala Mravinsky or Gatti. The studio Exton is fantastic as well. I think I have only heard Paavo and Neeme Jarvi in the ballet music, I might have streamed some symphonies but so long ago I can't remember.

[vers la flamme]

Can't say that Tchaikovsky's symphonies have yet to fully click with me, but I do have two cycles that I listen to from time to time: Markevitch/London/Philips and Karajan/Berlin/DG. I like both for different reasons but I think the Markevitch is better. Also have the Mravinsky/Leningrad 4/5/6, which makes me wish they'd recorded the first three.