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Author Topic: Sinfonia Solenne for Chamber String Orchestra  (Read 20854 times)

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Offline krummholz

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Re: Sinfonia Solenne for Chamber String Orchestra
« Reply #20 on: June 28, 2021, 05:00:29 PM »
Quote from: k a rl h e nn i ng on June 28, 2021, 04:50:30 PM
To be clear, I didn't mean an additional quartet, but having each line switch from tutti to one player,  or even one desk, as they say.

No, I understood what you meant, and I was being stupid... with NP MIDI messages it's actually easy to change the number of players in each string section on the fly, as it were. So no need to create a new score with an extra quartet section. The only difficulty will be preparing a rendering, because of NP's timing problems. I do my splicing in Audacity, and it's really only possible to join two passages if they're separated by a silence, otherwise you get a click (or worse) that's hard or impossible to remove.
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Offline k a rl h e nn i ng

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Re: Sinfonia Solenne for Chamber String Orchestra
« Reply #21 on: June 28, 2021, 05:03:02 PM »
Quote from: krummholz on June 28, 2021, 05:00:29 PM
No, I understood what you meant, and I was being stupid... with NP MIDI messages it's actually easy to change the number of players in each string section on the fly, as it were. So no need to create a new score with an extra quartet section. The only difficulty will be preparing a rendering, because of NP's timing problems. I do my splicing in Audacity, and it's really only possible to join two passages if they're separated by a silence, otherwise you get a click (or worse) that's hard or impossible to remove.

You use Sibelius?
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Karl Henning, Ph.D.
Composer & Clarinetist
Boston MA
http://www.karlhenning.com/
[Matisse] was interested neither in fending off opposition,
nor in competing for the favor of wayward friends.
His only competition was with himself. — Françoise Gilot

Offline krummholz

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Re: Sinfonia Solenne for Chamber String Orchestra
« Reply #22 on: June 28, 2021, 05:06:58 PM »
Quote from: k a rl h e nn i ng on June 28, 2021, 05:03:02 PM
You use Sibelius?

Yes, Sibelius plus the amazing (even with its flaws) NotePerformer.
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Offline k a rl h e nn i ng

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Re: Sinfonia Solenne for Chamber String Orchestra
« Reply #23 on: June 28, 2021, 05:22:29 PM »
I'm not familiar with NotePerformer at all ....
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Karl Henning, Ph.D.
Composer & Clarinetist
Boston MA
http://www.karlhenning.com/
[Matisse] was interested neither in fending off opposition,
nor in competing for the favor of wayward friends.
His only competition was with himself. — Françoise Gilot

Offline krummholz

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Re: Sinfonia Solenne for Chamber String Orchestra
« Reply #24 on: June 28, 2021, 06:02:09 PM »
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Offline k a rl h e nn i ng

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Re: Sinfonia Solenne for Chamber String Orchestra
« Reply #25 on: June 29, 2021, 04:32:41 AM »
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Karl Henning, Ph.D.
Composer & Clarinetist
Boston MA
http://www.karlhenning.com/
[Matisse] was interested neither in fending off opposition,
nor in competing for the favor of wayward friends.
His only competition was with himself. — Françoise Gilot

Offline krummholz

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Re: Sinfonia Solenne for Chamber String Orchestra
« Reply #26 on: June 29, 2021, 03:27:22 PM »
I've tried reducing the ensemble to soloists for all three Interludios, and for the reprise of Interludio I in Fuga III. It doesn't work for Interludio II or III (and really not even for any part of Interludio III). I'm still mulling about Interludio I and its reprise (it's both, or neither). Feels a bit gimmicky to me, but extending the solo quartet past the reprise to the A major phrase, with the tutti very quietly coming in with the modulation to E major, is admittedly kind of nice. Hmmm. Still mulling...
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Offline krummholz

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Re: Sinfonia Solenne for Chamber String Orchestra
« Reply #27 on: June 29, 2021, 06:27:43 PM »
And here's a demo of that idea, for the curious - also with the quartet and tutti alternating a couple of times in the passage after the Interludio I reprise. I'm not sure it does much for the work as a whole, since the solo quartet is only used in two places, widely separated in time, but it's a nice touch that might grow on me.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1PZofmQlDlrZGOUyHwtOWz8ybLQVVZpBU/view?usp=sharing

Interludio I starts at 3:43, the reprise at 18:38.
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Offline krummholz

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Re: Sinfonia Solenne for Chamber String Orchestra
« Reply #28 on: June 30, 2021, 08:34:52 AM »
Better, because it makes the soloistic "thread" integral to the music: the above, PLUS start both Fuga I and Fuga III with the soloists, and then continue with tutti. The soloists are heard only at the most intimate moments, 4 times in all.

Demo:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1eFVP92q_1fWhvpE3simDZt_vvYkaBDAF/view?usp=sharing
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Offline k a rl h e nn i ng

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Re: Sinfonia Solenne for Chamber String Orchestra
« Reply #29 on: June 30, 2021, 10:44:55 AM »
Quote from: krummholz on June 30, 2021, 08:34:52 AM
Better, because it makes the soloistic "thread" integral to the music: the above, PLUS start both Fuga I and Fuga III with the soloists, and then continue with tutti. The soloists are heard only at the most intimate moments, 4 times in all.

Demo:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1eFVP92q_1fWhvpE3simDZt_vvYkaBDAF/view?usp=sharing


Will listen this evening, thanks!
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Karl Henning, Ph.D.
Composer & Clarinetist
Boston MA
http://www.karlhenning.com/
[Matisse] was interested neither in fending off opposition,
nor in competing for the favor of wayward friends.
His only competition was with himself. — Françoise Gilot

Offline krummholz

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Re: Sinfonia Solenne for Chamber String Orchestra
« Reply #30 on: June 30, 2021, 12:37:29 PM »
Quote from: k a rl h e nn i ng on June 30, 2021, 10:44:55 AM
Will listen this evening, thanks!

Thanks. Having listened straight through 3 times now, I don't think it quite works - but I'll be interested to hear what you think. My feeling is, at best it's an optional way to perform the piece, but it was originally conceived without soloists and they'll probably strike some listeners as a gimmick - 2 out of 3 times, that was my impression.
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Offline krummholz

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Re: Sinfonia Solenne for Chamber String Orchestra
« Reply #31 on: June 30, 2021, 03:52:36 PM »
I keep going back and forth on this. Listened again and my only objection was that the soloists are abandoned after the 4th appearance. Bringing them back, fleetingly, in mm. 723-9 seems to supply needed "closure". Listen to this instead of the above, please.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1AKPjncsRybu-mz3FbapNLhGxAzlBEJcZ/view?usp=sharing
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Offline k a rl h e nn i ng

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Re: Sinfonia Solenne for Chamber String Orchestra
« Reply #32 on: June 30, 2021, 04:05:49 PM »
Quote from: krummholz on June 30, 2021, 03:52:36 PM
I keep going back and forth on this. Listened again and my only objection was that the soloists are abandoned after the 4th appearance. Bringing them back, fleetingly, in mm. 723-9 seems to supply needed "closure". Listen to this instead of the above, please.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1AKPjncsRybu-mz3FbapNLhGxAzlBEJcZ/view?usp=sharing


My brain is done in for the day, but I shall listen when 'tis again fresh in the morning!
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Karl Henning, Ph.D.
Composer & Clarinetist
Boston MA
http://www.karlhenning.com/
[Matisse] was interested neither in fending off opposition,
nor in competing for the favor of wayward friends.
His only competition was with himself. — Françoise Gilot

Offline k a rl h e nn i ng

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Re: Sinfonia Solenne for Chamber String Orchestra
« Reply #33 on: July 01, 2021, 07:29:37 AM »
Quote from: krummholz on June 30, 2021, 03:52:36 PM
I keep going back and forth on this. Listened again and my only objection was that the soloists are abandoned after the 4th appearance. Bringing them back, fleetingly, in mm. 723-9 seems to supply needed "closure". Listen to this instead of the above, please.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1AKPjncsRybu-mz3FbapNLhGxAzlBEJcZ/view?usp=sharing


I think you've done a great job.  The piece really breathes now! My feeling after my initial listen some days past was, very nice but it's a long 25 minutes. You have completely remedied this! It wears its duration excellently. Bravissima!
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Karl Henning, Ph.D.
Composer & Clarinetist
Boston MA
http://www.karlhenning.com/
[Matisse] was interested neither in fending off opposition,
nor in competing for the favor of wayward friends.
His only competition was with himself. — Françoise Gilot

Offline krummholz

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Re: Sinfonia Solenne for Chamber String Orchestra
« Reply #34 on: July 01, 2021, 07:38:34 AM »
Quote from: k a rl h e nn i ng on July 01, 2021, 07:29:37 AM
I think you've done a great job.  The piece really breathes now! My feeling after my initial listen some days past was, very nice but it's a long 25 minutes. You have completely remedied this! It wears its duration excellently. Bravissima!

Thank you sir! To be honest, I still have mixed feelings about it... though I think the new version is growing on me. Will continue listening, and mulling...
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Offline krummholz

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Re: Sinfonia Solenne for Chamber String Orchestra
« Reply #35 on: July 01, 2021, 07:43:39 AM »
And then of course, comes the problem of how to notate solo / tutti in Sibelius. There are no predefined keywords for that, and though I could add them to the dictionary, I'd have to make sure they have no effect on playback. I'm using "MIDI messages", essentially coded directives, to control the number of "players" in each section, which would be unintelligible to humans even if they were visible in the printed score (they're not).
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Offline k a rl h e nn i ng

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Re: Sinfonia Solenne for Chamber String Orchestra
« Reply #36 on: July 01, 2021, 07:48:48 AM »
Quote from: krummholz on July 01, 2021, 07:43:39 AM
And then of course, comes the problem of how to notate solo / tutti in Sibelius. There are no predefined keywords for that, and though I could add them to the dictionary, I'd have to make sure they have no effect on playback. I'm using "MIDI messages", essentially coded directives, to control the number of "players" in each section, which would be unintelligible to humans even if they were visible in the printed score (they're not).

No, I don't think it can impact playback, though adding the notation is easy enough.
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Karl Henning, Ph.D.
Composer & Clarinetist
Boston MA
http://www.karlhenning.com/
[Matisse] was interested neither in fending off opposition,
nor in competing for the favor of wayward friends.
His only competition was with himself. — Françoise Gilot

Offline krummholz

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Re: Sinfonia Solenne for Chamber String Orchestra
« Reply #37 on: July 01, 2021, 04:09:43 PM »
Ok I think I'm convinced... now to figure out how to notate it properly, then on to fixing up the score...
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Offline k a rl h e nn i ng

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Re: Sinfonia Solenne for Chamber String Orchestra
« Reply #38 on: July 01, 2021, 04:51:40 PM »
Quote from: krummholz on July 01, 2021, 04:09:43 PM
Ok I think I'm convinced... now to figure out how to notate it properly, then on to fixing up the score...

Very good.
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Karl Henning, Ph.D.
Composer & Clarinetist
Boston MA
http://www.karlhenning.com/
[Matisse] was interested neither in fending off opposition,
nor in competing for the favor of wayward friends.
His only competition was with himself. — Françoise Gilot

Offline Pohjolas Daughter

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Re: Sinfonia Solenne for Chamber String Orchestra
« Reply #39 on: July 02, 2021, 06:56:26 AM »
Quote from: krummholz on July 01, 2021, 07:38:34 AM
Thank you sir! To be honest, I still have mixed feelings about it... though I think the new version is growing on me. Will continue listening, and mulling...
Impressive job!  Wish that I could read music/sing/play anything.  :(  May I ask what instrument(s) you play and how you first became interested in music?

PD
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