Quiz: Mystery scores

[Maciek]

Nor have I....well, I think I played through the first one once, but wasn't hooked enough to continue on to no 2! I think this is his 'op 1' isn't it?

Hm, could be. Let me check...

Nope, actually his recently published (was that last year?) Piano Sonata seems to be his first piece still in existence (it's from 1934). Then come the Symphonic Variations (1936-8 and that was his debut public performance, IIRC - I just remembered that). Then there's the Lacrimosa (1937 - it was performed at his funeral, again: IIRC). So these two pieces would come as number 4 (1940-41). But there's no telling if he hadn't written something in between anyway - so many of his scores perished during WWII! (I don't think he ever used opus numbering anyway...)

BTW, last week I discovered that Naxos liner notes (at least the ones to Lutoslawski's 1st Symphony disc), are not an original text plus 2 translations: they are actually 3 different texts with different authors, written in English, French and German! That was quite a shock! Does everyone already know this or did I just discover something new?

Polish pride retained....

It's not as easy as it sounds.

(although I'd rather you didn't)

It's still my favorite thread - just a very time-consuming one. So I sometimes intentionally stay away. 0:)

[lukeottevanger]

Hm, could be. Let me check...

Nope, actually his recently published (was that last year?) Piano Sonata seems to be his first piece still in existence (it's from 1934). Then come the Symphonic Variations (1936-8 and that was his debut public performance, IIRC - I just remembered that). Then there's the Lacrimosa (1937 - it was performed at his funeral, again: IIRC). So these two piece would come as number 4 (1940-41). But there's no telling if he hadn't written something in between anyway - so many of his scores perished during WWII! (I don't think he ever used opus numbering anyway...)

Yes, I didn't mean an actual opus 1 (which is why I used ''s), but I thought I'd read somewhere (can't remember where, but then for some reason I've been reading a lot about Polish composers recently  ) that this was his first published work, or first acknowledged work, or something of that ilk. Something basically = to an op 1.

BTW, last week I discovered that Naxos liner notes (at least the ones to Lutoslawski's 1st Symphony disc), are not an original text plus 2 translations: they are actually 3 different texts with different authors, written in English, French and German! That was quite a shock! Does everyone already know this or did I just discover something new?

It depends on the disc; they do it quite often, I'm not sure why (could it be something to do with copyright?). Often, too, the second and third notes are the first ones but reduced in information content.

It's still my favorite thread - just a very time-consuming one. So I sometimes intentionally stay away. 0:)

I'm not quite sure that's allowed 

[Guido]

no.200 is there to taunt me? hmm... I'm assuming that means its a cello work, but none of the solo part is visible so I'll have to think. My immediate thought was Schelomo by Bloch with all those surging and highly chromatic runs... But this is just a first impression... I believe that Schelomo has a harp and a celeste part so this fits too...

[lukeottevanger]

Go with your first impression - it hasn't let you down!

[Guido]

Guido Gatti wrote of Schelomo,

The violoncello, with its ample breadth of phrasing, now melodic and with moments of superb lyricism, now declamatory and with robustly dramatic lights and shades, lends itself to a reincarnation of Solomon in all his glory. The violoncello part is of so remarkably convincing and emotional power that it may be set down as a veritable masterpiece; not one passage, not a single beat, is inexpressive; the entire discourse of the soloist, vocal rather than instrumental, seems like musical expression intimately conjoined with the Talmudic prose.

which neatly summarises my own feelings about this piece too.

[lukeottevanger]

That's very nice - thanks for that. It is, indeed, in its way and on its own terms, a 'perfect piece', as much as that can be possible, isn't it?

[Guido]

That's very nice - thanks for that. It is, indeed, in its way and on its own terms, a 'perfect piece', as much as that can be possible, isn't it?

Yes, I agree completely. I wish I could add to Guido Gatti's commentary and wax on about it, but I think he has it there perfectly - it's just what music is meant to be like! I think Sean would aprove of it wholeheartedly!

[lukeottevanger]

Clues to the first lot of my remaining ones. Remember there is a link between these pieces, but only of the Maciek type; also remember, as unearthed by Mark, that two [one now] of these pieces are by Tippett:

187 - the composer is very well known, but above all for one piece, one of the most popular works in the repertoire. One feature of his writing, which is evident in the first and last pieces of the very famous piece, is also evident here. Holst - The Perfect Fool

188 - this fugue is based on a complex set of relationships between three composers - the subject is by one, and the two countersubjects are by two others, one of whom is the composer of the work as a whole.
Tippett - Fantasia Concertante on a theme by Corelli

191 - this is not Tippett, as Mark guessed. It is a piano concerto, one of my favourites, and often compared to Ravel's G major Concerto. The extract given is most of the piano's first music in the second movement, and I chose it because it contains many of this composer's idiosyncratic harmonic fingerprints.

193 - a composer not noted for his piano music, this is the most interesting of his three or four pieces for the instrument that I know of. Again, there are some harmonic fingerprints associated with this composer here.

194 - this may be the best known piece of this selection, so I won't give any extra clues.

198 - from this composer most famous work, written in memory of his son.
Howells, Hymnus Paradisi

I have a couple un-clued ones more remaining, I think; I'll give clues to them tomorrow.

[Guido]

LO198 is the last movement of Howells Hymnus Paradisi - the fact it was written in memory of his son (like the unfinished cello concerto) and that distinctive trumpet line... astonishing piece.

[Guido]

LO 187 - The Planets by Holst? 7/8 time signature is often used in his works wich is the same clue as I gave for my Holst piece, so I'll try that.

[(poco) Sforzando]

176 - Look at the instrumentation. Two movement piece, a fact reflected in the title,this is the end of the first movement. Composer appears in this sequence of scores twice, but isn't the same composer as 166. Has been on the thread before.

Danses sacrée et profane by Debussy, I believe.

[lukeottevanger]

The Howells and the Debussy correct; the other one is Holst, Guido, but I only said it had a similarity to the composer's most famous work, so it's not The Planets. The similarity I had in mind, among other things, is indeed the irregular time sig.

[J.Z. Herrenberg]

LO 187 - Holst, The Perfect Fool

I think I overlooked that one... this piece is one of my Holst favourites! I first heard it in 1984 on the World Service (Holst Delius Elgar year), under Boult (still the best performance IMO).

[lukeottevanger]

That's correct - this is the beginning of the Dance of the Spirits of Earth, IIRC (I scrubbed out the name!)

[J.Z. Herrenberg]

LO 188 - Tippett, Fantasia Concertante on a theme by Corelli

[lukeottevanger]

Excellent. In the fugue, whose beginning is shown in my score sample, Tippett uses a different Corelli piece than the rest of the Fantasia, one which had been used by Bach as the basis for a fugue - so we have a subject by Corelli, one counter-subject by Bach, and one by Tippett himself. Meirion Bowen points out that

initially, it counterpoises three types of string bowing: lyrical on-the-string bowing for the second violas playing the Corelli theme; off-the-string for the first violas playing Tippett's counter-subject; and, for the cellos playing Bach's counter-subject, loure bowing

He goes on to make a case for the work against those who might see it as running counter to the tedious. limiting and simplistic idea of Hegelian, teleological, one-way 'progress' in music:

Roughly contemporary with Boulez's Le Marteau sans Maitre (1952-4) and Stockhausen's Kontrapunkte no 1 (1952), Tippett's Corelli Fantasia might seem by comparison to be the ultimate in backward-looking nostalgia. It is nothing of the kind. This is a score which deals with essences, with artistic values that remain unaffected from one century to another: and as such, a paean to the art of instrumental lyricism, springing from the very nature of stringed instruments, as understood by Corelli, as understood now. When realised with sensitivity to style, the Corelli Fantasia communicates a rapture and perfection rare in music: and it remains one of the composer's exceptional achievements/

[J.Z. Herrenberg]

Great quote! The whole idea of progress is just too narrow. I'm only now starting to listen to Schnittke, and what I find fascinating about him is the juxtaposition of musical styles. I like that enormously. I am a writer, and my style too moves from biblical elevation, through Baroque complexity, to the rhythms of rap. Every one of us is layered time. And so is art.

Btw - the Corelli Fantasia under Marriner is my favourite recording. I prefer it to the one by Tippett himself.

[lukeottevanger]

Great quote! The whole idea of progress is just too narrow. I'm only now starting to listen to Schnittke, and what I find fascinating about him is the juxtaposition of musical styles. I like that enormously. I am a writer, and my style too moves from biblical elevation, through Baroque complexity, to the rhythms of rap. Every one of us is layered time. And so is art.

Couldn't agree more - there is more than one way to be 'progressive'. Your writing sounds fascinating, btw!

Btw - the Corelli Fantasia under Marriner is my favourite recording. I prefer it to the one by Tippett himself.

I don't know the Marriner - I do like the Tippett reading though. (Did he only do one?)

[Guido]

I knew I recognised that Double bass tune from somewhere - I used to listen to the Perfect Fool a lot... Must dig it out again.

[J.Z. Herrenberg]

Couldn't agree more - there is more than one way to be 'progressive'. Your writing sounds fascinating, btw!

I don't know the Marriner - I do like the Tippett reading though. (Did he only do one?)

I'm busy perfecting a very big first novel, of which parts were published in 2000 already (in a literary magazine). I began writing it in 1996, so it has to fascinate me too, otherwise I couldn't have kept it up for so long... 

The Tippett recording is on Virgin - I think it's the only one. The Marriner with the Academy of St Martin's in the Fields is from the early 1980s. I fell in love with immediately. It's a magical piece.