EJ Moeran

[vandermolen]

Ian Maxwell refers to the circumstances and consequences of Moeran's injury as "the most sensational aspect of the Moeran Myth", to which he gives elaborate and meticulous attention (beginning on page 154), concluding much of what has been believed isn't factual, - "persuasive but unsupported stories" as he puts it, - and really digs into things in provocative and eye-opening fashion to support that judgment (the summary of which begins on page 181).  It's fascinating, and does at least render "shrapnel in the head and its effects" open to question (a key element of Maxwell's case is speculative, however). We've perhaps accepted Geoffrey Self's sketch of Moeran's life (my only substantial resource up to now, apart from CD notes, - and whose own sources Maxwell repeatedly picks apart) too uncritically, - and not only in reference to the "war wound" issue.  Good to have beliefs challenged, even with no definitive outcome, - though not quite so comfortably and authoritatively being able to repeat what we thought we knew can be a bummer.

BTW, that "motoring incident" referred to in the press clipping Roasted Swan reproduces is treated in detail by Maxwell also.

It's Roasted Swan who first alerted me to Maxwell's study in this thread awhile back, for which I am very grateful.

Yes, although it does not destroy what it describes as 'the Moeran Myth' as it shows that there was clearly some evidence of the shrapnel wound to the head. Very interesting though.

[calyptorhynchus]

I'm just reading that thesis now. A pretty good read.

I think that Moeran is one of those composers who is endlessly patronised, but in reality he wrote very well-crafted music and hardly ever wrote a dull note.

[vandermolen]

I'm just reading that thesis now. A pretty good read.

I think that Moeran is one of those composers who is endlessly patronised, but in reality he wrote very well-crafted music and hardly ever wrote a dull note.

I agree.

[calyptorhynchus]

Maxwell's thesis is pretty convincing except for one thing: he argues that Moeran's war service was not long and, compared to others who served in the trenches, not as traumatic (Moeran didn't serve in the trenches but was a motorbike messenger, so was backwards and forwards from the front line and not stuck in the trenches under bombardment (though when he was wounded it was the result of being shot at, so being in a fairly close combat situation)). His war wound seems to have been less serious than has been portrayed, he soon recovered from it, and there is no evidence of his having a metal plate put in his skull to treat a war wound (if he did have a plate it may have been as a result of a motor vehicle accident later in his life).

Maxwell explains Moeran's later alcoholism as a result, not of a head wound, or PTSD caused by his time in the trenches, but as a result of his association with Philip Heseltine (Peter Warlock) from 1925 onwards. However, I am pretty sure that it is almost unheard of for someone who had no problems with alcohol before suddenly choosing to become a heavy drinker around the beginning of middle age. Like other addictions, basically unless you begin early you never get hooked. So I suspect either that:

1. Moeran began drinking at school when he was away from home and managed to keep his drinking under control until living in the same house as Hestletine brought it out in the open.
2. He began drinking in the Army in Britain, and continued in France and Ireland and after the War and then it got worse after 1925. (In Goodbye to All That Robert Graves incidentally reveals that he acquired a heavy drinking habit in the trenches. This was because of the drinking culture of the officer corps and the stress of being the trenches.)

I agree with Maxwell that Moeran's drinking was not a result of PTSD (because it probably began before he was exposed to combat) but I don't think that it only began in 1925.

However, these are just quibbles, what's important is the music, and Moeran's music is very good, and it's good that he managed to complete what he did despite his alcoholism.

(Beethoven was a heavy drinker throughout his life too!)

[J]

Whatever the remaining ambiguities, I agree Maxwell pretty convincingly debunks any notion that Moeran's war experience and a war wound was directly and primarily responsible for his later difficulties with alcohol and otherwise.  Just how much their origin should now be shifted to the Eynsford cottage hiatus and problematic influence of Heseltine is debatable (as you suggest), but Maxwell has uncovered such an abundance of details and plausibly interpreted them, so as to make one's understanding of Moeran much fuller and more nuanced than previous sources allowed for.

[Roasted Swan]

However, these are just quibbles, what's important is the music, and Moeran's music is very good, and it's good that he managed to complete what he did despite his alcoholism.

You have hit the nail on the head.  The context of how the music came to be written is valuable and interesting but ultimately whether it engages people today will be because the music itself has merit nothing else.

[J]

You have hit the nail on the head.  The context of how the music came to be written is valuable and interesting but ultimately whether it engages people today will be because the music itself has merit nothing else.

Who Moeran was, and us knowing that doesn't impact the "merit" of his music?

[J.Z. Herrenberg]

Who Moeran was, and us knowing that doesn't impact the "merit" of his music?

Knowing about Moeran does add to our understanding of the music. But its quality is something apart from that. I loved the symphony, for instance, on its own musical merits long before I knew anything about Moeran's life.

[vandermolen]

Knowing about Moeran does add to our understanding of the music. But its quality is something apart from that. I loved the symphony, for instance, on its own musical merits long before I knew anything about Moeran's life.

Yes, me too, apart from what I read on the back of the old Neville Dilkes EMI LP sleeve. I'd never heard of him and impulse bought the LP, featuring the Symphony, from the Harrods Record Dept. in London, where I was working  (in the silk department  ) during my university holidays. I remember that I was entitled to a staff discount on the LP! When I got home and played it, it was a revelation to me and I never looked back with Moeran.
Currently enjoying this CD of even older recordings:

[vandermolen]

Have just read through this entire thread with much pleasure, notwithstanding many posts from me repeating more or less the same information  . Made me realise how much I miss those members who have disappeared from the forum, including the starter of the thread. Anyway, I look forward to reading more of the Moeran dissertation posted by Greg.

[Roasted Swan]

One of the great wonders of the internet is being able to access unknown/previously inaccessible papers on any kind of subject.  Moeran seems to have prompted a few doctoral theses in his time.  Aprt from the one recently discussed there is also;

"A critical study of the life and works of E J Moeran" (Melbourne 1982) - https://minerva-access.unimelb.edu.au/handle/11343/35509
and
"An exploration of the compositional idiom of E. J. Moeran with specific focus on his cello concerto" (Sydney university 2010) - https://ses.library.usyd.edu.au/handle/2123/8800

Most interesting I have found the copies and description of the sketches for the 2nd Symphony - https://www.musicologyireland.com/jsmi/index.php/journal/article/view/81/89

The article by Fabian Huss accompanying these sketches seems to have been removed..... but here's another link I found

This analysis of the sketches shows the real struggle Moeran had later in his life when his mental health significantly impinged on his ability to compose.  Others have found Martin Yates's reconstruction of Symphony 2 to be effective and compelling.  With other works - Elgar 3 notably - I enjoy reconstructions greatly - there is a sense that only time (or lack of it) really deprived the likes of Elgar/Bruckner/Mahler etc completing works.  With this Moeran I think that the truth is that sadly he had lost the ability to write large coherent structures and that perhaps this work should have been allowed to remain as sketches.  Too much of the  recorded symphony sounds to me like good pastiche Moeran rather than the real thing.  A wholly subjective opinion I know!

[J]

Despite some attractive themes, "Symphony 2" hasn't worn well with me.

[J]

Knowing about Moeran does add to our understanding of the music. But its quality is something apart from that. I loved the symphony, for instance, on its own musical merits long before I knew anything about Moeran's life.

You are "knowing Moeran" in assimilating his music is how I would put it.  Discursive understanding ("knowing about") may come later, but the music (it's merits or quality) is never detached or separate from him previous to that.

[J.Z. Herrenberg]

You are "knowing Moeran" in assimilating his music is how I would put it.  Discursive understanding may come later, but the music (it's merits or quality) is never detached or separate from him previous to that.

I understood your earlier remark to mean that 'knowing about Moeran' in a biographical sense was related to how we assess the quality of his music, its 'merit'.
Of course you also 'know Moeran' by listening to his music. But music is its own process, with its own logic and cogency, and is only related to the composer in a more abstract sense.
So what I said was that knowing about Moeran biographically has no bearing, for me, on how I assess the quality of the music. Just as I don't take Wagner's antisemitism in account in assessing the quality of that man's music.

[Symphonic Addict]

I'm listening to the Fantasy Quartet, for oboe and string trio from here:



A fascinating piece of music, imbued with melancholy and that typical English pastoral air, but not devoid of sparkling and jolly moments either. A most welcome find today.

[kyjo]

I'm listening to the Fantasy Quartet, for oboe and string trio from here:



A fascinating piece of music, imbued with melancholy and that typical English pastoral air, but not devoid of sparkling and jolly moments either. A most welcome find today.

+1 Yes, a very fine work! Moeran's small chamber output contains some gems, like the A minor string quartet (I don't know the other one) and the Cello Sonata, a powerful and passionate work:

https://youtu.be/nJ7L5XlBIhk

I've been enjoying this CD as of late, particularly the first two Rhapsodies and the Overture for a Masque:

[asin]B00GK8P1HI[/asin]

I'm struck by the occasional similarities to Braga Santos' earlier style in the bright, breezy, folksy nature of this music. Is it possible that the two composers knew each other's music? Not likely, but not impossible I suppose! I'd certainly like to hear Falletta give a recording of the G minor Symphony, since she's so attuned to Moeran's style throughout the above disc.

[Symphonic Addict]

+1 Yes, a very fine work! Moeran's small chamber output contains some gems, like the A minor string quartet (I don't know the other one) and the Cello Sonata, a powerful and passionate work:

https://youtu.be/nJ7L5XlBIhk

I've been enjoying this CD as of late, particularly the first two Rhapsodies and the Overture for a Masque:

[asin]B00GK8P1HI[/asin]

I'm struck by the occasional similarities to Braga Santos' earlier style in the bright, breezy, folksy nature of this music. Is it possible that the two composers knew each other's music? Not likely, but not impossible I suppose! I'd certainly like to hear Falletta give a recording of the G minor Symphony, since she's so attuned to Moeran's style throughout the above disc.

Agreed on the String Quartet, but the Cello Sonata didn't impress me that much to be honest.

I also hear some English reminiscences on Braga Santos, being VW and Moeran like the closest composers in idiom.

I should revisit that Naxos CD. This also features the Rhapsodies minus the Overture for a Masque:

[vandermolen]

+1 Yes, a very fine work! Moeran's small chamber output contains some gems, like the A minor string quartet (I don't know the other one) and the Cello Sonata, a powerful and passionate work:

https://youtu.be/nJ7L5XlBIhk

I've been enjoying this CD as of late, particularly the first two Rhapsodies and the Overture for a Masque:

[asin]B00GK8P1HI[/asin]

I'm struck by the occasional similarities to Braga Santos' earlier style in the bright, breezy, folksy nature of this music. Is it possible that the two composers knew each other's music? Not likely, but not impossible I suppose! I'd certainly like to hear Falletta give a recording of the G minor Symphony, since she's so attuned to Moeran's style throughout the above disc.

I can see the Braga Santos/Moeran connection. I suspect that Braga Santos may have, most likely, been influenced by the work of Vaughan Williams but who knows? 'In the Mountain Country' is another work that I like, featured on those discs and yes, it would be great to hear Ms Falletta record the Symphony.

[Christo]

I can see the Braga Santos/Moeran connection. I suspect that Braga Santos may have, most likely, been influenced by the work of Vaughan Williams but who knows? 'In the Mountain Country' is another work that I like, featured on those discs and yes, it would be great to hear Ms Falletta record the Symphony.

I once found that the very first chords of Moeran's Sinfonietta (1945) are echoed almost exactly in the opening chords of the scherzo from Braga Santos' Third Symphony, composed three years later (depends a bit on the performance of the Sinfonietta, I took the one by the Philharmonic Orchestra under Sir Adrian Boult, BBC Radio Classics 15656 91632).

Of course you can compare for yourselves now, with Youtube, Braga Santos' scherzo starting at 22:00 exactly:
https://www.youtube.com/v/gEsSJEPiwFM https://www.youtube.com/v/JQxBKV9rs2c

[vandermolen]

I once found that the very first chords of Moeran's Sinfonietta (1945) are echoed almost exactly in the opening chords of the scherzo from Braga Santos' Third Symphony, composed three years later (depends a bit on the performance of the Sinfonietta, I took the one by the Philharmonic Orchestra under Sir Adrian Boult, BBC Radio Classics 15656 91632).

Of course you can compare for yourselves now, with Youtube, Braga Santos' scherzo starting at 22:00 exactly:
https://www.youtube.com/v/gEsSJEPiwFM https://www.youtube.com/v/JQxBKV9rs2c

Yes, I can see/hear what you mean.