Sir Arnold Bax

[André]

I googled 'england river 4 steps' and it led me to it  .

[Oates]

I googled 'england river 4 steps' and it led me to it  .

Impressive work André - why didn't I think of that! I generally find that more recent Bax and Moeran releases use Irish landscapes.

[vandermolen]

I googled 'england river 4 steps' and it led me to it  .

Ah, unlike me, you are obviously a lateral thinker André!

[André]

My recent Bax-o-thon gives me a heightened appreciation for the composer's stature. I held the symphonies in very good esteem, but when I started listening last week, my recollection of them was not work-specific, but rather generic in terms of the baxian orchestration, phraseology and structure. The thing is, I hadn't listened to any in at least 4 years, and Bax is no Tchaikovsky, so specific themes and melodies do not readily imprint themselves in the memory.

Thanks to the comparative listening of the 7 symphonies in a short period of time I now 'get' each work's specific character as well. Generally speaking I find the works ending with a slow epilogue more convincing and memorable than those ending with big, loud statements. But all of them have memorable moments and I'm sure the composer knew exactly what he was doing at every juncture.

FWIW, here's a tentative ranking of the works and versions I listened to, based on a scale of 10

1- Lloyd-Jones 8, Thomson 9, Fredman 8
2- Lloyd-Jones 7, Thomson 10
3- Lloyd-Jones 8, Thomson 10
4- Thomson 8
5- Lloyd-Jones 9, Thomson 8
6- Lloyd-Jones 9, Thomson 8, Bostock 8
7- Lloyd-Jones 8, Thomson 9, Leppard 10

I was most taken with symphonies 3, 7, 6 (true masterpieces), then 1 and 2. Still not sure where to place nos 4 and 5.

[Symphonic Addict]

Interesting analysis, André. These works reveal their secrets with patience, and I agree with you about the symphonies that conclude quietly, I feel there is more naturalness and cohesiveness. For me, the ones I have more affinity with are 1, 2, 3 and 6.

[André]

Ah, unlike me, you are obviously a lateral thinker André!

I had to google it to figure out what lateral thinking is  . I have no idea if that's true. Here's what I did:

- first, identify the waterfall as a man-made structure, and an old one at that. Plus, it makes for a very nice postcard (or LP cover)-type image. That is an objective fact.

- second, recognize that the British have a deep, abiding love of nature and love nothing more than give a name to structures, places and picturesque spots. That is a subjective opinion, maybe even a cliché.

- third, google the words I mentioned, which led me to similar structures, such as this one:

.

The structure is identical (has the same function) and is called a weir.

- go back to google and input 'England, weir'. It was one of them. It took me about 5 minutes.

Did I think laterally ?

[Scion7]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JuZJWkXk89k



Arnold and Harriet disentangle ...

[vandermolen]

I had to google it to figure out what lateral thinking is  . I have no idea if that's true. Here's what I did:

- first, identify the waterfall as a man-made structure, and an old one at that. Plus, it makes for a very nice postcard (or LP cover)-type image. That is an objective fact.

- second, recognize that the British have a deep, abiding love of nature and love nothing more than give a name to structures, places and picturesque spots. That is a subjective opinion, maybe even a cliché.

- third, google the words I mentioned, which led me to similar structures, such as this one:

.

The structure is identical (has the same function) and is called a weir.

- go back to google and input 'England, weir'. It was one of them. It took me about 5 minutes.

Did I think laterally ?

It's very impressive - like Sherlock Holmes 
I enjoyed your comparative ratings of the symphonies. I need to listen again to the Lloyd Jones cycle although recall being very impressed by No.6. I don't know if you know the Leppard No.5 which like his No.7 is very special. I don't rate the Bostock No.6 as negatively as many do. As a complete cycle my favourite is Thomson. I like come of the early recordings, Goossens in No.2, Barbirolli in No.3 and Handley's Guildford No.4 (the first Bax LP release) despite the Hammond organ.

[vandermolen]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JuZJWkXk89k



Arnold and Harriet disentangle ...

I've always liked 'November Woods', especially Boult's recording.

[Biffo]

Mention of the Orchestral Works (Chandos edition) elsewhere prompted me to check my collection. I have collected Volumes 1 - 7 as CDs sporadically over the years but was surprised to find I didn't have Vols 8 & 9. I remedied this but bought them as lossless downloads (Vol 8 is temporarily out of stock as a CD). I  hope to listen to them fairly soon.

[André]

I don't have the Lyrita 5 and 7. It's available, but quite expensive, so I'll pass for now. 

[André]

Mention of the Orchestral Works (Chandos edition) elsewhere prompted me to check my collection. I have collected Volumes 1 - 7 as CDs sporadically over the years but was surprised to find I didn't have Vols 8 & 9. I remedied this but bought them as lossless downloads (Vol 8 is temporarily out of stock as a CD). I  hope to listen to them fairly soon.

My suggestion to Chandos (repackage all 9 discs in a space-saving box) was replied today:

Dear Sir,
This idea has been looked at many times and each time we could not justify the cost of a 9 CD box set against minimal sales. We would need a minimum of 1000 unit sales to make this workable

[Roasted Swan]

My suggestion to Chandos (repackage all 9 discs in a space-saving box) was replied today:

Chandos are probably right- I'm an arch Bax-completist but unless they released these as "studio-masters" (whatever that really means!) I probably wouldn't buy that set again......

[vandermolen]

My suggestion to Chandos (repackage all 9 discs in a space-saving box) was replied today:

That's sad but at least they bothered to reply.

[vandermolen]

Thoroughly enjoyed this CD today - both the Symphony and the atmospheric Nympholept:

[Maestro267]

There are definitely more "profound" Bax symphonies, but No. 4 is definitely one of my favourites. The organ-undepinned climax to the first movement always gives me goosebumps.

[vandermolen]

There are definitely more "profound" Bax symphonies, but No. 4 is definitely one of my favourites. The organ-undepinned climax to the first movement always gives me goosebumps.

The finale does that for me as well.

[relm1]

I just discovered "Spring Fire"!  Wow, what an excellent and evocative work.  I highly recommend this gorgeous work.  The recording I am listening to is Chandos/Vernon Handley from the 1980's.  This work predates all his symphonies and is basically a gigantic tone poem in symphonic scale.  I think this work might be the perfect introduction to those not familiar with this composer because it blends his symphonies with luxurious french influences and tone poems.  To my ears it also mixed Scriabin's contemporaneous late poems in influence.  Fantastic work!

[Roasted Swan]

I just discovered "Spring Fire"!  Wow, what an excellent and evocative work.  I highly recommend this gorgeous work.  The recording I am listening to is Chandos/Vernon Handley from the 1980's.  This work predates all his symphonies and is basically a gigantic tone poem in symphonic scale.  I think this work might be the perfect introduction to those not familiar with this composer because it blends his symphonies with luxurious french influences and tone poems.  To my ears it also mixed Scriabin's contemporaneous late poems in influence.  Fantastic work!

Of all the "unknown" Bax that got rediscovered via the Chandos series and the 1983 Centenary celebrations Spring Fire is probably the most interesting.  I agree with your description completely.  It really is quite unlike any other British composition of that time and occupies a sound world that is unlike anything else Bax wrote.  There are various stories about the premiere that never was and how it was (is) such a complex score that no orchestra/conductor wanted to tackle it at the time.  But I do find it extraordinary that Bax - at the height of his fame/influence in the 20's & 30's - never pushed to have such a major score played.  He must have known its worth and he certainly knew how much effort would have gone into creating such a large-scale work.  My guess is that by the time of that greater fame Bax was on a different aesthetic path - initially the "Irish" influence and then later his more rugged "Northern" style.  Neither of which fitted with the ecstatic impressionism of Spring Fire.  The fact that it stayed in an error-strewn manuscript didn't help.

I'm sure you know that Mark Elder is a great admirer of the score.  Unfortunately his studio recording while technically fine doesn't somehow achieve the wild release and visionary rapture it needs.  By all accounts his concert performance in Chicago was remarkable and also its worth hearing the Proms performance he gave  on YouTube

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jh6Q6S3SPeY&t=1s

That said - I think the Handley was and remains a very fine 1st recording.

[Symphonic Addict]

The other day I was listening to this disc:



His choral works seem to get few mentions. Certainly pleasant music, especially when you want to indulge yourself with opulent orchestrations and lush harmonies and sonorities. Enchanted Summer for two sopranos, chorus and orchestra was the highlight (and the longest work on the CD). These works represent Bax with a "happy" facet. Don't expect warlike or belligerent passages here.