Europe at War

[Florestan]

The commentators clearly fail to see the difference between Turkey ruled by Erdoğan, and the Turkey before Erdoğan.
Two entirely different things. Turkey has no longer a secular, western orientation as mapped out by Greece-born Atatürk, its (ideological) allegiances to the US and Europe are long gone. Erdoğan is the muslim version of Orbán (or Trump): authoritarian, nationalistic, conservative, xenofobe, opportunistic and corrupt.

Well, Erdogan (like Orban) was democratically elected several times yet Turkey is blamed by the West for being an authoritarian state. Had he been toppled the first time by a military coup, a Turkey ruled by the ensuing junta would probably have been much more in line with Ataturk's vision (which he implemented himself manu militari) and much more pro-Western yet it would have been blamed by the West for not being a democratic state.

damned if you do, damned if you don't.

[Que]

Well, Erdogan (like Orban) was democratically elected several times yet Turkey is blamed by the West for being an authoritarian state. Had he been toppled the first time by a military coup, a Turkey ruled by the ensuing junta would probably have been much more in line with Ataturk's vision (which he implemented himself manu militari) and much more pro-Western yet it would have been blamed by the West for not being a democratic state.

damned if you do, damned if you don't.

Being democratically elected doesn't guarantee anything. Even Putin was democratically elected. And as you know there are more ominous examples in European history. You're not damned if you do, and damned if you don't: you have to respect the rule of law, the rules of democracy, human rights, an independent judiciary and a free press to be democratic.

But my point was that ideologically the Turkish junta was a reliable and loyal strategic partner of the west, or rather: that Erdoğan is not.

[Florestan]

ideologically the Turkish junta was a more reliable and loyal strategic partner of the west.

This actually raises an interesting question: the Turkish Army used to be the guardian of secularism and modernism as well as the world's leading expert in successfull coups yet Erdogan managed to tame them into complete political irrelevance. How on earth was he able to do that?

[Todd]

The commentators clearly fail to see the difference between Turkey ruled by Erdoğan

Erdoğan put his name to the article, so he is the commentator.  I don't know if he wrote it or not. 

Well, Erdogan (like Orban) was democratically elected several times yet Turkey is blamed by the West for being an authoritarian state.

Something similar happened in Iraq after it started holding elections.  Western liberalism is not as popular outside of western liberal countries.  Democracy will not always lead to the proper outcomes from a western liberal outlook.

But my point was that ideologically the Turkish junta was a reliable and loyal strategic partner of the west, or rather: that Erdoğan is not.

This is the western imperial mindset.  Allies must adhere to western ideals as well as being allies.  That world is eroding.  Foreign policy must adapt.

[MusicTurner]

     With the planned increases both countries will be over 2%. Right now Finland is at 1.5% and will increase by 70% above that.

My understanding is that the Finnish budget is actually already considered to be around 2%, because for example the Home Guard expenses plus a few more aren't included in the lower estimate.

Denmark has joined the No Russian Gas Club, because of the refusal to pay in rubles, but the economical damage here is said to be quite limited.

The new EU sanction packet is said to reduce oil import from Russia by 60% soon, and 90% at the end of the year, so quite comprehensive.

Germany's 100 billion Euro boost in the defense budget was agreed upon in the Bundestag parliament.

The big question is of course whether Russia wil be able to cope with the sanctions in the longer game, and whether the opposition abroad towards Russia will gradually erode. There are all sorts of reports on the likely prospects, some of them saying Russia is planning for a war-like situation spanning 5-10 years ahead. Other, contrasting reports say that Russian elites are increasingly against the war, and/or that Putin is physically severely sick.

[Que]

Denmark has joined the No Russian Gas Club, because of the refusal to pay in rubles, but the economical damage here is said to be quite limited.

Ditto for the Netherlands.

The new EU sanction packet is said to reduce oil import from Russia by 60% soon, and 90% at the end of the year, so quite comprehensive.

The exemption on demand of Viktor Orbán applies to Russian oil that enters the EU through a pipe line that runs to Hungary, Slovenia and Czechia. Since that pipe line runs through Ukrainian territory and considering Orbán's hostile attitude towards Ukraine and Ukranian interests,  some "accident" might happen to it pretty soon.... hopefully...

[Todd]

Germany's 100 billion Euro boost in the defense budget was agreed upon in the Bundestag parliament.

If Deutsche Welle is considered a reliable source, that expansion was already under negotiation prior to the Russia invasion, is spread over five years, and then has to be continued or altered after the spending plan is completed.  In other words, it was an exercise in political negotiations turned political theater.

A fun factoid I learned is that about 21% of children living in Germany live in poverty, which is a higher rate than in the US, which is around 18%.  (Yes, definitions of poverty differ.)  Opponents of the increased spending have apparently pointed this out, and presumably will continue to do so.  I don't follow German politics, so perhaps this is all incorrect and/or inconsequential.

[Florestan]

A fun factoid I learned is that about 21% of children living in Germany live in poverty, which is a higher rate than in the US, which is around 18%.  (Yes, definitions of poverty differ.) 

This is actually an interesting topic.

What is the US definition of poverty? A person is considered poor if... what?

[Todd]

What is the US definition of poverty? A person is considered poor if... what?

How the Census Bureau Measures Poverty

[71 dB]

This is actually an interesting topic.

What is the US definition of poverty? A person is considered poor if... what?

Comparing countries this way can be tricky. The poverty lines differ, how much under the line do people live etc. Being a poor child in a country without free school lunch is worse than in a country with free school lunch etc.

[Florestan]

How the Census Bureau Measures Poverty

Thank you.

Let's make a comparison:

Family A has five members: two children, one mother, one father, and one great-aunt.

The family's 2020 poverty threshold (below) is $31,661.

Well, $31,661 a year means $2638 a month. In Romanian currency that's 12,264 RON a month, which means that the aforementioned family is middle class. Low middle class, granted, but solidly so and far from poverty.  I suspect the same equivalence goes for Germany. 

[71 dB]

Thank you.

Let's make a comparison:

Family A has five members: two children, one mother, one father, and one great-aunt.

The family's 2020 poverty threshold (below) is $31,661.

Well, $31,661 a year means $2638 a month. In Romanian currency that's 12,264 RON a month, which means that the aforementioned family is middle class. Low middle class, granted, but solidly so and far from poverty.  I suspect the same equivalence goes for Germany. 

Well, $2638 a month before taxes sounds bad for a family of five members. Maybe in Romania the cost of living is so low that that's "middle class."

I believe if both parents in a family work at a minimum wage job, the earnings together are near that threshold.

In Finland people earning 1,900-6,400 euros (year 2017) a month made the middle class (68 % of people). Thats about $4,200-14,000 per month for two earners in a family.

[Florestan]

Well, $2638 a month before taxes

No, I mean $2638 a month net income.

[71 dB]

No, I mean $2638 a month net income.

Aren't these poverty limits before taxes?

[Florestan]

Aren't these poverty limits before taxes?

I don't know, the website Todd linked to does not specify. In Romania the usual talk is about net income so I assumed it automatically.

[Todd]

I don't know, the website Todd linked to does not specify. In Romania the usual talk is about net income so I assumed it automatically.

Yes, it does: "The income used to compute poverty status includes (before taxes):"

[Florestan]

Yes, it does: "The income used to compute poverty status includes (before taxes):"

Ah, my bad then.

[Karl Henning]

The 'Death Cult' Keeping Russia in Ukraine

Meanwhile, Russia's death cult leaders are growing utterly shrill. Putin's foremost propagandist, Margarita Simonyan, goes on national television to threaten that there are only two acceptable outcomes for this war: Ukraine's defeat or a nuclear apocalypse.

Simonyan is a cynic who knows that her words will be translated for a foreign audience. She wishes to demoralize the West, Ukraine, and sane Russians who want nothing to do with the war. But the fact that her extremist views are considered to be acceptable for a mainstream Russian audience makes it clear that death-worship is not relegated to the country's fringe.

[Mirror Image]

So what's going with this fucking war? Is Putin dead yet or what? Let's get to the bottomline here, folks.

[Madiel]

Thank you.

Let's make a comparison:

Family A has five members: two children, one mother, one father, and one great-aunt.

The family's 2020 poverty threshold (below) is $31,661.

Well, $31,661 a year means $2638 a month. In Romanian currency that's 12,264 RON a month, which means that the aforementioned family is middle class. Low middle class, granted, but solidly so and far from poverty.  I suspect the same equivalence goes for Germany. 

You can't assume the cost of living in different places is the same. What 12,264 buys you in Romania might be very different to what the exchanged currency would buy you in the USA or Germany.