Europe at War

[Florestan]

Christ has risen

Indeed He has risen!

We are given the choice between good and bad, free to decide

Indeed. God can save nobody against their own will.

[Todd]

If you really believe this is good for the USA you are delusional

I know that effective European integration would establish a strategic challenger to the US, and perhaps, over time, an enemy that the US would have to go to war with.  Europeans do not place American economic or security interests above European economic and security interests.  The two sets of interests overlap in many cases, but they are distinct.  Despite the standard narrative that a/the transatlantic "partnership" serves as the basis of some type of unique framework that will preserve world peace forever, and deter bad actors from shenanigans (which is clearly not the case), it is in fact only a temporary arrangement that will disintegrate at some point.  The supreme strategic goal of the US should be the avoidance of great power war.  As such, the US should take steps to prevent the establishment of another near peer.  Given Europe's splintered, violent, fractious history, preventing effective integration of Europe should be simple enough.  It is much better to partner with specific European powers in a fluid, transactional way.  The current war gives the US the ability to do that to an extent.  The AUKUS deal shows that even with bold talk of a unified front, even the current administration will act in US interest first, which every administration should.  More like that needs to be done.  Basically, Nixon and Kissinger were right five decades ago, and the US needs to elect new administrations that are hostile to a unified Europe, but competent enough to take effective, disruptive action. 

[Florestan]

My friends, I'm smiling at the thought of the signature of a "virtual acquaintance" of yore: I don't belong to an organized religion; I'm Eastern Orthodox."

Many moons ago I did consider converting to Roman Catholicism. I thank God Almighty that eventually I came to my senses and desisted. I was baptized an Eastern Orthodox, I am a faithful Eastern Orthodox by personal, conscious choice and I will die a faithful Eastern Orthodox.

[Florestan]

I know that effective European integration would establish a strategic challenger to the US, and perhaps, over time, an enemy that the US would have to go to war with.

Jezus Maria!

Doamne, Maica Domnului!

No, really, you lost me right here right now!

If you really believe that (1) EU is an enemy to the USA, and (2) a war between USA and EU is more probable than a war betwwen USA and Russia then you are not only delusional, you are plainly a madman (and it pains me to write it).

[Harry]

Jezus Maria!

Doamne, Maica Domnului!

No, really, you lost me right here right now!

If you really believe that (1) EU is an enemy to the USA, and (2) a war between USA and EU is more probable than a war betwwen USA and Russia then you are not only delusional, you are plainly a madman (and it pains me to write it).

Todd is out to annoy everyone with his silly delusional ramblings.

[Florestan]

Given Europe's splintered, violent, fractious history,

As different from the USA's smooth as silk history...

Just ask the American Indians... or the French... or the Mexicans... .or the fellow Americans of the Confederation...

Yet despite all that, I'd rather live under US's hegemony than Russia's.

[71 dB]

I'm an Eastern Orthodox. 

The main religion in Finland is germanic Evangelical Lutheran Christianity. My parents also belong to that Church and so did I before I resigned from it because my personal beliefs do not agree well with the church. I'm simply like anyone born anywhere in the World in any family background without the belief in deities, an atheist.

[Todd]

If you really believe that (1) EU is an enemy to the USA, and (2) a war between USA and EU is more probable than a war betwwen USA and Russia then you are not only delusional, you are plainly a madman (and it pains me to write it).

It is 2022.  A unified Europe does not exist.  Over time, were a unified Europe to come into existence, it would pose a greater economic threat to the US than Russia has since the collapse of the USSR, and over time, given the importance of economic interests, Europe could pose a military threat that could result in war between the US and Europe.  Such a scenario, as unlikely as it may seem now, is at least a couple decades out, and would be easy to prevent: prevent effective European integration.  Again, this is not a new outlook.  This has been contemplated for at least a half century now.

Russia is still a powerful nation state, and still the closest near peer in terms of military power to the US, despite triumphalist assessments online of Russian capabilities.  The real Russian threat to US security is Russia's nuclear arsenal.  Russian military actions in Chechnya, Georgia, and Ukraine do not threaten US security.  (Likewise, Soviet misbehavior in Hungary and Czechoslovakia had no impact on US security.)  Possible Russian actions may impact US economic interests, primarily in commodity markets.  We see some of that now.  Some of it is self-inflicted.

As different from the USA's smooth as silk history...

Of course US history is brutal.  The history of all great powers is brutal.  That is how they become great powers. 

It should be noted though that there has been no war between North American nation states since 1848, unless one counts the whole Pancho Villa episode.  Contrast that with European history since 1848. 

[Florestan]

The main religion in Finland is germanic Evangelical Lutheran Christianity. My parents also belong to that Church and so did I before I resigned from it because my personal beliefs do not agree well with the church. I'm simply like anyone born anywhere in the World in any family background without the belief in deities, an atheist.

I have no problem whatsoever with you being an atheist. On the contrary, I'm sure that should we ever met in person, we'd get along just fine. 

[Florestan]

there has been no war between North American nation states since 1848, unless one counts the whole Pancho Villa episode. 

You're being disingenuous here --- and you know it only too well.

[Karl Henning]

Jezus Maria!

Doamne, Maica Domnului!

No, really, you lost me right here right now!

If you really believe that (1) EU is an enemy to the USA, and (2) a war between USA and EU is more probable than a war betwwen USA and Russia then you are not only delusional, you are plainly a madman (and it pains me to write it).

Who knows what he really believes? If he knows, himself.

[Todd]

You're being disingenuous here --- and you know it only too well.

It is a factual statement.  There has been no war between North American nation states since 1848, at the conclusion of one of the most successful land grab wars in human history. 

[Karl Henning]

I have no problem whatsoever with you being an atheist. On the contrary, I'm sure that should we ever met in person, we'd get along just fine. 

Indeed!

[Florestan]

There has been no war between North American nation states since 1848

What North American nation states were there in 1848?

[Todd]

What North American nation states were there in 1848?

I suspect you know the answer.

[Karl Henning]

What North American nation states were there in 1848?

Have to admit this has the look of just trolling on someone's part.

[Florestan]

I suspect you know the answer.

Well, yes, I know it: none, zilch, nada, nechevo.

Which only stresses my point: you're being disingenuous.

[71 dB]

I have no problem whatsoever with you being an atheist. On the contrary, I'm sure that should we ever met in person, we'd get along just fine. 

Religion comes between people only when it is radicalized.  0:)

[Scion7]

technically speaking, the native American nations did not form formal states, you'd have to go to Central and South America to find that sort of level of civilization

[Florestan]

technically speaking, the native American nations did not form formal states, you'd have to go to Central and South America to find that sort of level of civilization

Only if by civilization you mean having one's heart, lungs, liver and loins eaten.

Thank God the Spanish conquest and rule put an end to such abominations.