Queen Elizabeth II has died

[Pohjolas Daughter]

Love it!  At first I wasn't certain who was asking the question, but I could then see that the Queen's mouth was open. 

Oh, and by the way, when I first looked at your corgi cartoon the other day, I hadn't noticed that it's nametag said "UK" on it.     Even more poignant.

PD

[Florestan]

Monarchy is not good and desirable in practice in the contemporary world.

The universe is change; life is opinion. - Marcus Aurelius, Meditations

People would rather believe than know - E.O. Wilson

[Karl Henning]

What is really silly is to believe that a republic is intrinsically better than a monarchy and that a republican government can, and will, work irrespective of the social, economic, cultural, religious and political traditions and particularities of any given nation. This naively optimistic and grossly reductionist view (a relic of the long-discredited Enlightenment rationalism) is given a big lie when one considers the Spanish-speaking South American republics, whose history, ever since their establishment until well into the twentieth century, is an almost uninterrupted succession of civil wars, coups and authoritarian rulers mostly of the military sort, none of which was ever heard of during the 300 years of the Spanish Crown rule in the relevant parts of the continent.

Especially true considering the hard lessons that America is learning about the power bad-faith actors have to destroy the system.

[vandermolen]

Love it!  At first I wasn't certain who was asking the question, but I could then see that the Queen's mouth was open. 

Oh, and by the way, when I first looked at your corgi cartoon the other day, I hadn't noticed that it's nametag said "UK" on it.     Even more poignant.

PD

Thanks PD - glad you enjoyed them.
This made me smile too:

[SimonNZ]

Spanish-speaking South American republics, whose history, ever since their establishment until well into the twentieth century, is an almost uninterrupted succession of civil wars, coups and authoritarian rulers mostly of the military sort, none of which was ever heard of during the 300 years of the Spanish Crown rule in the relevant parts of the continent.

Whether a particular monarchy is "good" and "desirable" is for the people of that nation to decide. What foreigners think or wish in respect to it is at best irrelevant and at worst presumptuous.

The way the peoples of South America decided they wanted the Spanish monarchy? The way they were happy with that rule?

[Florestan]

The way the peoples of South America decided they wanted the Spanish monarchy? The way they were happy with that rule?

It was not "the peoples" who decided to get rid of the Spanish rule. It was the local elites. They replaced the monarchy with their own rule, from which ordinary people benefitted little, and least of all the indians. Tellingly, a large number of the latter actually fought alongside the royalists. Also tellingly, Simon Bolivar ended up greatly and notoriously disillusioned with the outcome of his "liberation".

[SimonNZ]

I think you're willing to give a pass to oppression slavery and murder if it's done in the name of the greater good of Christianity.

That's what we're talking about here isn't it? Not monarchy but Christianity. If another faith or ideology had put their boot on the necks of the people's of South America you wouldn't be painting such a rose tinted history.

[Florestan]

That's what we're talking about here isn't it? Not monarchy but Christianity.

On the contrary, we're (or at least we've been until you chimed in) talking about monarchy not Christianity.

[Todd]

Tellingly, a large number of the latter actually fought alongside the royalists.

What does this tell?  This is standard strategic thinking that native peoples all over the Americas engaged in.  It does not demonstrate in any way that the native peoples liked or trusted their allies, only that their allies were seen as marginally less odious than their enemies. 

[Fëanor]

What does this tell?  This is standard strategic thinking that native peoples all over the Americas engaged in.  It does not demonstrate in any way that the native peoples liked or trusted their allies, only that their allies were seen as marginally less odious than their enemies.

Well after all the lessor evil is the lessor evil.

So for example after the "French & Indian Wars", the British Parliament, (not the King mind you), imposed a ban on settlement roughly east of the Appalachian mountain chain to prevent antagonizing the indigenous peoples.  This was resented by American colonists who wanted to move to the west, (obviously displacing the natives).  Not the least resentful were wealthy land speculators, such as George Washington, who intended seize control of large tracts of land and parcel it out to small  settlers at a large profit.  This aspect of objection to British rule is less commonly mention by Americans who'd rather talk about the Stamp Tax, etc.

[Todd]

Not the least resentful were wealthy land speculators, such as George Washington, who intended seize control of large tracts of land and parcel it out to small  settlers and a large profit.

Mt Vernon faces west for several reasons.

The British obviously cared only about British interests and did not care about native peoples when they passed the law, and the law did not prevent war with Pontiac in any event.  The law did, however, represent another injustice suffered by the colonists.   Also, it is worth pointing out that Britain was running a most lucrative slave trade at the same time, and not just to the thirteen colonies.  The Crown and Parliament acted duplicitously to suppress and exploit the colonists, all the while acting in a most immoral manner.  As everyone knows, British evils became no longer sufferable.

[Fëanor]

Mt Vernon faces west for several reasons.

The British obviously cared only about British interests and did not care about native peoples when they passed the law, and the law did not prevent war with Pontiac in any event.  The law did, however, represent another injustice suffered by the colonists.   Also, it is worth pointing out that Britain was running a most lucrative slave trade at the same time, and not just to the thirteen colonies.  The Crown and Parliament acted duplicitously to suppress and exploit the colonists, all the while acting in a most immoral manner.  As everyone knows, British evils became no longer sufferable.

The American Declaration of Independence included a long rant directed at the "present King of Great Britain", (George III), that included a long list of injustices.  These injustices, such as they were, were imposed by Parliament and, though signed off by the King, were by no means instigated by him.

The stark truth  is that the American colonies had be largely ignored by the British government at mostly allowed to "do their thing" until after the French & Indian War.  It was only after that war that American grievances came to the fore.  This was a result of the British Government's feeling that the American colonies ought to pay a portion of the huge cost of the war in North America that had been largely in their defense.  Added to that was the colonists' disappointment that they couldn't exploit the former French territories.

[vandermolen]

Light artist projects image of the Queen and Prince Philip into the skies above Switzerland:

[ritter]

Unfortunately, in the era of mass culture, it appears inevitable that a solemn occasion like the death of Britain's longest serving monarch will be surrounded by, or downright degenerate into, kitsch.

[vandermolen]

Unfortunately, in the era of mass culture, it appears inevitable that a solemn occasion like the death of Britain's longest serving monarch will be surrounded by, or downright degenerate into, kitsch.

Yes, I must admit that there is a kitsch-like quality to it.

[ritter]

And I must admit it's rather cleverly done...

Good day to you, Jeffrey!

[Fëanor]

The British obviously cared only about British interests and did not care about native peoples when they passed the law, and the law did not prevent war with Pontiac in any event.  The law did, however, represent another injustice suffered by the colonists.   Also, it is worth pointing out that Britain was running a most lucrative slave trade at the same time, and not just to the thirteen colonies.  The Crown and Parliament acted duplicitously to suppress and exploit the colonists, all the while acting in a most immoral manner.  As everyone knows, British evils became no longer sufferable.

The legitimate complaint of the America colonists is that the British Government was imposing laws for the benefit of UK interests, not the colonists, and that those laws were passed by a Parliament where they had no representation.  Beyond that, the American colonists, and especially the colonial elites, were every bit as self-interested as the British and despised the natives and slaves far more.

It's gratuitous in this context to mention the British slave trade.  To be sure British slave traders and estate holder, principally in the Caribbean, benefited grossly from slavery.  But American slaves and slave holders, (after Independence), soon came to hugely outnumber British slaves and slave holders.

Britain freed all its slaves in peacefully 1833, albeit with compensation to slave holders but none to slaves.  America freed slaves only with the 14th Amendment in 1868 after a bloody Civil War that killed more Americans than any war before or since.  Neither slave holders nor slave received any compensation.  Americans are still struggling to acknowledge that its Black citizens are fully equal.

Americans' righteousness about their history can be tedious at times.

[Pohjolas Daughter]

So, how many here are planning to watch (and also are able to) watch the funeral on Monday?  The time difference here is pretty rough (even for a morning person).

PD

p.s.  I believe that Monday is a bank holiday in the UK?  Obviously, not so here in the US.

[MusicTurner]

I might watch a report with some of the key moments ...

[vandermolen]

And I must admit it's rather cleverly done...

Good day to you, Jeffrey!

And to you too Rafael