Anybody considering leaving Twitter?

Started by Spotted Horses, October 30, 2022, 07:11:59 PM

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Florestan

Quote from: Daverz on November 20, 2022, 11:21:42 PM
Google "social media Rohingya genocide".

Thanks. I wasn't aware of the role FB played in that.
"Art is no excuse for boring people." - Jules Renard

Todd

Social media causes genocide.  The final solution is government control of speech on social media platforms.
The universe is change; life is opinion. - Marcus Aurelius, Meditations

People would rather believe than know - E.O. Wilson

The dollar is our currency, but it's your problem - US Treasury Secretary John Connally to European Finance Ministers, 1971

Spotted Horses

Quote from: Todd on November 21, 2022, 04:39:23 AM
Social media causes genocide.  The final solution is government control of speech on social media platforms.

I do not think that speech itself should be controlled on social media. I think there should be much stricter controls one what social media companies do with your speech on their platforms. I think it should be illegal for social media companies to compile detailed information on a persons behavior on their platform (what they post, what links they click on) and sell this information without explicit permission. And by explicit, I mean to the extent that when you click on a story with headline "Nancy Pelosi's husband was actually attacked by a gay prostitute who he had hired that night" a dialog would pop up saying, "Do you wish to share the fact that you viewed this link with the RNC, Breitbart News, the Russian Intelligence Service, Steve Bannon, and Crackerbarrel?" I think it should be illegal for social media platforms to choose to push content to your feed based on people paying for access to your feed. They should be constrained to show content based on who you follow, not based on who wants you to follow them. I do not claim that such regulations would be easy, or even possible, to implement.

Gurn Blanston

Quote from: JBS on November 20, 2022, 05:17:21 PM
Several have gone to Mastodon.
Following them on Mastodon takes more effort if you are on a Mastodon server that is not "federated" with the server they are on. There doesn't seem to be a way of figuring that out before you set up there.

It's easy to delete your Twitter account, and you have 30 days to change your mind.

I intend to stay on Twitter until/unless it gets unuseable, but I have set up an account on Mastodon.

Reddit has a classical music subreddit, so I set myself up there but have yet to give it any sort of inspection.

Thanks for the info,  I'll look into that.  Also have heard about a new effort by the founder of Twitter but I don't know whether it is real or dreamware so far.  🤠😕
Visit my Haydn blog: HaydnSeek

Haydn: that genius of vulgar music who induces an inordinate thirst for beer - Mily Balakirev (1860)

Todd

Quote from: Spotted Horses on November 21, 2022, 05:09:24 AM
I do not think that speech itself should be controlled on social media. I think there should be much stricter controls one what social media companies do with your speech on their platforms. I think it should be illegal for social media companies to compile detailed information on a persons behavior on their platform (what they post, what links they click on) and sell this information without explicit permission. And by explicit, I mean to the extent that when you click on a story with headline "Nancy Pelosi's husband was actually attacked by a gay prostitute who he had hired that night" a dialog would pop up saying, "Do you wish to share the fact that you viewed this link with the RNC, Breitbart News, the Russian Intelligence Service, Steve Bannon, and Crackerbarrel?" I think it should be illegal for social media platforms to choose to push content to your feed based on people paying for access to your feed. They should be constrained to show content based on who you follow, not based on who wants you to follow them. I do not claim that such regulations would be easy, or even possible, to implement.

There are several different strands going on now.  First, while I am certainly no expert on the Rohingya genocide (and I am certain no one else on GMG is either), the notion that Facebook or any other social media platform caused the genocide or is anything other than an ancillary tool in the horror contradicts the little I have read on the topic written by experts.  The military, which is primarily Burmese, is driving the genocide, and like other military governments around the world from time to time, they use all manner of propaganda tools to whip the public into a frenzy.  (Fortunately, Americans and Europeans are so sophisticated and well-educated that established propaganda tools and techniques stretching back to WWI can never have an effect on them.) 

Second, legislation would be needed to prevent the sale of personal information, which is currently signed away in terms of service.  It is very difficult to envision how such legislation could pass given the business models used by social media companies, where sale of personal data is a major revenue source.  Remember that old adage (in the current age), if something is free, you're the product.  Perhaps a better model would be to establish paid social media, where contractual terms expressly forbid sale with explicit legal remedies and use of consumer-friendly jurisdictions selected for arbitration or litigation.  I do not know how successful a paid model would be; consumers want everything for free.

Third, your suggestion of using some type of pop-ups or other notifications to warn of sale of information, while perhaps appealing on the surface, would probably not be particularly meaningful.  For instance, people know smoking is bad for them, cigarette packs come with explicit written warnings, and in some countries explicit images are used as well, yet that all fades into the background for smokers.  Pop-ups already appear all over online, and at least some people - and I suggest almost all people - just click right on through.  Tabloid stories are popular and will remain so.  Forever.
The universe is change; life is opinion. - Marcus Aurelius, Meditations

People would rather believe than know - E.O. Wilson

The dollar is our currency, but it's your problem - US Treasury Secretary John Connally to European Finance Ministers, 1971

Todd

The universe is change; life is opinion. - Marcus Aurelius, Meditations

People would rather believe than know - E.O. Wilson

The dollar is our currency, but it's your problem - US Treasury Secretary John Connally to European Finance Ministers, 1971

Todd

Apparently, it's not over:

Musk says granting 'amnesty' to suspended Twitter accounts

Musk appears to be serious about his commitment to actual free speech, not the kind of heavily censored speech fashionable among the self-appointed intelligentsia.  Who knows how long Twitter will last? 

The universe is change; life is opinion. - Marcus Aurelius, Meditations

People would rather believe than know - E.O. Wilson

The dollar is our currency, but it's your problem - US Treasury Secretary John Connally to European Finance Ministers, 1971

DavidW

Quote from: JBS on November 20, 2022, 05:17:21 PMReddit has a classical music subreddit, so I set myself up there but have yet to give it any sort of inspection.

I checked out that subreddit awhile back but it seemed to me to be much more performing-centric as opposed to collecting/recording focused like this community.

Anyway Elon Musk wants to buy Reddit next.  Of course I don't know how he will turn Twitter around to profitable if he mass fires essential staff.

71 dB

Quote from: DavidW on November 25, 2022, 02:26:20 PMAnyway Elon Musk wants to buy Reddit next.  Of course I don't know how he will turn Twitter around to profitable if he mass fires essential staff.

Oh boy! I guess he wants to own everything, because less is never enough...

I am really tired of the World as it is in 2022. It feels like the craziest people call all the shots. Sane people have been marginalized in the the World where only the most lunatic voices are heard.
Spatial distortion is a serious problem deteriorating headphone listening.
Crossfeeders reduce spatial distortion and make the sound more natural
and less tiresome in headphone listening.

My Sound Cloud page <-- NEW track "Jazzz"

Gurn Blanston

I deleted my Twitter account yesterday.  Life is too short to bother taking part in every 21st century clusterfuck that comes down the road.  Pity, I largely enjoyed the time I spent there. 

🤠
Visit my Haydn blog: HaydnSeek

Haydn: that genius of vulgar music who induces an inordinate thirst for beer - Mily Balakirev (1860)

amw

I've seen a number of mutual followers on Twitter suspended over the last few days as they get mass reported by far-right trolls on false charges of "promoting violence" or similar (the Twitter algorithm is known for automatically suspending any account that is frequently reported for rules violations; such suspensions might previously have been reversed by the content moderation team, but that entire team has apparently been fired).

I have also, in the wake of a mass shooting at a LGBTQ club in the USA this month, noticed a significant uptick in people on the "mainstream right" claiming the killer was justified, that "gender ideology" and "wokeness" are a form of violence against which mass murder is justifiable as "self-defense", and promising that every LGBTQ person and their supporters will meet the same fate. Such people were never uncommon, but now Mr. Musk himself is replying to some of the more notorious trolls (such as LibsofTikTok) approvingly and with claims that he is trying to "prevent the West from committing suicide" in response to posts about how, e.g., the existence of drag queens promotes pedophilia, or it is not possible to be transgender, etc. These people feel that they were previously "unfairly censored" (even though most were never banned from the site and had thousands or millions of followers) and are now emboldened to push their agenda on others.

I don't see this as a reason to leave the site (it's easy to block such people) but it is definitely becoming a chore to log in. Social media plays no role whatsoever in genocide of course. If it just so happens to cause hundreds of thousands of heavily armed and easily suggestible people to believe that they must commit mass shootings of LGBTQ people to protect their children, and incidentally giving them the names, addresses and times at which "someone should do something", that is just those people exercising their free speech and no steps can be taken to stop them. Certainly there have been no similar periods in US history where a politically motivated press spread false accusations of sexual crimes against a reviled minority over decades, indirectly encouraging vigilante killings and riots as well as a set of repressive laws disenfranchising that minority, and if that had happened, well, there's absolutely no way it could have been prevented.

JBS

Apparently some of those accounts were suspended immediately after Andy Ngo directly complained about them to Musk.

Hollywood Beach Broadwalk

Todd

Quote from: amw on November 26, 2022, 07:08:55 AMand incidentally giving them the names, addresses and times at which "someone should do something"

I am pretty close to a free speech absolutist, but doxxing can be viewed as criminal behavior, an online form of menacing, which is a misdemeanor in many jurisdictions, and along with targeted threats (against specific people) should result in bans online.  These are the only forms of online activity that should result in bans.  Both behaviors are very common across the political spectrum.  Ask SCOTUS justices.



Quote from: amw on November 26, 2022, 07:08:55 AMCertainly there have been no similar periods in US history where a politically motivated press spread false accusations of sexual crimes against a reviled minority over decades, indirectly encouraging vigilante killings and riots as well as a set of repressive laws disenfranchising that minority, and if that had happened, well, there's absolutely no way it could have been prevented.

The contemporary world is special, unique, and unprecedented in every way.
The universe is change; life is opinion. - Marcus Aurelius, Meditations

People would rather believe than know - E.O. Wilson

The dollar is our currency, but it's your problem - US Treasury Secretary John Connally to European Finance Ministers, 1971

JBS

Quote from: Todd on November 26, 2022, 07:27:14 AMI am pretty close to a free speech absolutist, but doxxing can be viewed as criminal behavior, an online form of menacing, which is a misdemeanor in many jurisdictions, and along with targeted threats (against specific people) should result in bans online.  These are the only forms of online activity that should result in bans.  Both behaviors are very common across the political spectrum.  Ask SCOTUS justices.



The contemporary world is special, unique, and unprecedented in every way.

I believe amw was referring to posting copies of advertising or summarizing publicly advertised information about planned events, not individual's private information.

Hollywood Beach Broadwalk

k a rl h e nn i ng

Quote from: Gurn Blanston on November 26, 2022, 05:54:01 AMI deleted my Twitter account yesterday.  Life is too short to bother taking part in every 21st century clusterfuck that comes down the road.  Pity, I largely enjoyed the time I spent there. 

🤠
C'est vraiment dommage!
Karl Henning, Ph.D.
Composer & Clarinetist
Boston MA
http://www.karlhenning.com/
[Matisse] was interested neither in fending off opposition,
nor in competing for the favor of wayward friends.
His only competition was with himself. — Françoise Gilot

Todd

Quote from: JBS on November 26, 2022, 08:08:16 AMI believe amw was referring to posting copies of advertising or summarizing publicly advertised information about planned events, not individual's private information.

Depending on language used, such activity could easily and lawfully be construed as either menacing or issuing a threat.  Inclusion of dates, times, and places is what makes the difference.  It turns vague unpleasantries into imminent dangers.  Such speech can be suppressed based on statute and case law.  Lots of stuff should be done about lots of things.  Specificity is needed for it to be something other than griping.
The universe is change; life is opinion. - Marcus Aurelius, Meditations

People would rather believe than know - E.O. Wilson

The dollar is our currency, but it's your problem - US Treasury Secretary John Connally to European Finance Ministers, 1971

Florestan

Quote from: Todd on November 26, 2022, 07:27:14 AMI am pretty close to a free speech absolutist

Free speech is great. Thoughtful speech is greater.  ;D

"Art is no excuse for boring people." - Jules Renard

Todd

The universe is change; life is opinion. - Marcus Aurelius, Meditations

People would rather believe than know - E.O. Wilson

The dollar is our currency, but it's your problem - US Treasury Secretary John Connally to European Finance Ministers, 1971

k a rl h e nn i ng

Karl Henning, Ph.D.
Composer & Clarinetist
Boston MA
http://www.karlhenning.com/
[Matisse] was interested neither in fending off opposition,
nor in competing for the favor of wayward friends.
His only competition was with himself. — Françoise Gilot

Florestan

Quote from: Todd on November 26, 2022, 09:47:11 AMPerhaps.

Quote from: k a rl h e nn i ng on November 26, 2022, 10:45:20 AMNice!

I confess I paraphrased Kierkegaard's dictum: People demand freedom of speech as a compensation for the freedom of thought which they seldom use.
"Art is no excuse for boring people." - Jules Renard