Mozart Piano Concertos

Started by Mark, September 08, 2007, 03:01:39 PM

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staxomega

Quote from: SonicMan46 on August 30, 2022, 09:35:02 AM
price to me is basically $41 even w/ the steep shipping (plus the Euro & Dollar are at par).  Dave :)

I noticed the bolded part as well when I made an order last week, quite nice as it's not uncommon for me to make orders with JPC. One of the smartest finance people I know said he would be shorting the Euro on leverage many years ago if he wasn't restricted to what he could trade in his personal account. I didn't have the cojones to do it. I think it will be inevitable before the Euro goes down to what it opened at which was around 0.75 +/- a few cents.

Enjoy the Immerseel, that is my favorite PI cycle, I wrote about it some thread. I like Brautigam as well but the Immerseel is enough for me after discarding Bilson. I don't understand nor can I hear Hurwitz's extreme reaction to the Brautigam.

Que

Quote from: hvbias on August 31, 2022, 02:05:21 PM
I don't understand nor can I hear Hurwitz's extreme reaction to the Brautigam.

Let me guess: he hates it?  ;) 

He shouldn't bother to comment on anything HIP - we already know his opinion: he hates it. 

Jo498

I now got the first volume of the Kirschnereit (K 414, 449 and D major Rondo) and it's very good although in a fairly mainstream way. As a cycle Kirschnereit might be competitive with most on modern instruments, also because of excellent sound. This one has been put in a cardboard box, maybe I'll get this at some stage, even if I don't really want another cycle (because overload from K 466 onwards).

And I found the old hungaroton disc with Kocsis in  K 238, 456 and 595. It's very similar to the one with C major concertos, I liked it a little less as 456 seemed a bit rushed in all three movements (595 is fleet but does not feel rushed). I prefer Kocsis to Schiff but the little details Vegh provides in 456 or the "rhetorics" in the slow movement do add another dimension. I am not rushing for the one with 414/488 and I think the Philips disc is clearly the best, because of the best orchestra and sound.
Tout le malheur des hommes vient d'une seule chose, qui est de ne savoir pas demeurer en repos, dans une chambre.
- Blaise Pascal

SonicMan46

Quote from: hvbias on August 31, 2022, 02:05:21 PM
I noticed the bolded part as well when I made an order last week, quite nice as it's not uncommon for me to make orders with JPC. One of the smartest finance people I know said he would be shorting the Euro on leverage many years ago if he wasn't restricted to what he could trade in his personal account. I didn't have the cojones to do it. I think it will be inevitable before the Euro goes down to what it opened at which was around 0.75 +/- a few cents.

Enjoy the Immerseel, that is my favorite PI cycle, I wrote about it some thread. I like Brautigam as well but the Immerseel is enough for me after discarding Bilson. I don't understand nor can I hear Hurwitz's extreme reaction to the Brautigam.

Thanks for the Immerseel comments - really enjoyed my Spotify sampling of his recordings and expect the physical discs to sound even better - played Bilson again and same reaction, i.e. when Gardiner's band comes in, the pianist seems off the stage!  ;D

Agree w/ Que about Hurwitz disliking (at times hating) period instruments but he can vary considerably about Brautigam - signed into my ClassicsToday account and looked at the Ronald B. reviews - many of the 10/10 ones were by Jed Distler, but in the attachment (click to enlarge) I put together a composite image of Hurwitz reviews - the top row castigates his performances, however, the bottom row he rates as 10/10s!  So an interesting exercise, i.e. Hurwitz can be like a yo-yo, I guess -  :laugh:  Dave

Wanderer

Quote from: Jo498 on August 27, 2022, 11:31:17 AM
What about ... Kirschnereit?

He's neither bad nor excellent. Mostly ranging from good to very good to good again.

Wanderer

Quote from: SonicMan46 on November 22, 2021, 09:40:18 AM
Well, taking a cue from Que, I've been listening on Spotify to Kristian Bezuidenhout on the two CDs...

His third installment (with concertos Nos. 9 & 18) is being released tomorrow. Samples sound very enticing!

Jo498

Quote from: Wanderer on September 01, 2022, 10:54:05 AM
He's neither bad nor excellent. Mostly ranging from good to very good to good again.
Which recordings do you think are excellent? Especially of concertos 11-16?
Tout le malheur des hommes vient d'une seule chose, qui est de ne savoir pas demeurer en repos, dans une chambre.
- Blaise Pascal

staxomega

Peter Rösel also recorded several CDs of Mozart Piano Concertos, I have been curious about them if for no other reason they are sponsored by my favorite watch company  :laugh:

But I never bought any as I already have too many of the Mozart Piano Concertos through numerous box sets and haven't ever gone out of my way to buy single discs of the concertos.


Jo498

I caved in and got the Peter Serkin set as I found it for an acceptable price (fortunately, I don't remember exactly how much it usually went for several years ago when it was new). I have not yet listened to the two solo discs (sonatas K 457 and 533/494 as well as fantasias and stuff, including K 475 stretched to 19 min! normal is around 12-13) and I'd have to give the first disc with 449, 450 and the double another go but the concertos seem to be good to excellent, as I hoped for. K 459 is among the best I've heard and I haven't heard a better K 451 (but admittedly have heard far fewer than in the case 453 or 459).
The also benefit from A. Schneider's conducting; like Vegh, Sascha Schneider was both a great string quartet player (Budapest Q) and alert Mozart conductor (although I think Vegh for Schiff has the edge, probably also because of superior sound quality; the 1970s CBS sound is decent but no match for the late 1980s digital Decca, and Vegh also has the Mozarteum all star woodwind players)

The piano+woodwind quintet does not seem quite up there but I don't the piece all that well and have to check with some other recordings (I have Brendel and Kocsis); I certainly don't need another clarinet quintet and used to dislike Stoltzman but this seems also quite interesting, if quite slow.

While it's true that Mozart expands the "symphonic" dimension in several of the concertos beginning with #20 K 466 and I hesitate to call any Mozart "underrated", I do think that the 9 concerti 11-19 are a bit underappreciated, expecially the first 6 of them. Even the chamber scale K 413-14 are really nice and #16 K 451, a piece I overlooked or didn't much like for years, is brilliant. I prefer 16-19 to 21 (the most famous Mozart pc but I never liked it all that much, I preferred 20 and 27 since I first heard them as a teenager), 25 or 26.
Tout le malheur des hommes vient d'une seule chose, qui est de ne savoir pas demeurer en repos, dans une chambre.
- Blaise Pascal

George

For sets I have:

Schiff/Vegh
Perahia
Anda

What other set should I get who would contrast with these and also be great?

Barenboim's first set, Ashkenazy's and Uchida/Tate are on my short list.
"I can't live without music, because music is life." - Yvonne Lefébure

Mandryka

Quote from: George on June 16, 2023, 07:52:06 PMFor sets I have:

Schiff/Vegh
Perahia
Anda

What other set should I get who would contrast with these and also be great?

Barenboim's first set, Ashkenazy's and Uchida/Tate are on my short list.


Horszowski; Zacharias's first set (not Lausanne)
Wovon man nicht sprechen kann, darüber muss man schweigen

Jo498

Barenboim's first if you want something more weighty, "Beethovenian", sometimes a bit slow.
Tout le malheur des hommes vient d'une seule chose, qui est de ne savoir pas demeurer en repos, dans une chambre.
- Blaise Pascal

Todd

Quote from: George on June 16, 2023, 07:52:06 PMBarenboim's first set, Ashkenazy's and Uchida/Tate are on my short list.

I prefer Barenboim's second set, though both are very good.  Zacharias is a must have, whether his EMI or MDG set.  I prefer the MDG set, but either will do just fine.
The universe is change; life is opinion. - Marcus Aurelius, Meditations

People would rather believe than know - E.O. Wilson

Propaganda death ensemble - Tom Araya

Jo498

Barenboim's 2nd (which I don't have complete, missing about 3 disc's worth with earlyish concerti) is also very good, mostly very good sound, although some are live with slight audience noises but I recall the earlier set as a bit more distinctive (for whatever reason IIRC the English chamber orchestra sounds bigger than the Berlin Phil) which includes that some concerti are weaker than in the later one; e.g. K 459 is better with Berlin, IIRC.
Tout le malheur des hommes vient d'une seule chose, qui est de ne savoir pas demeurer en repos, dans une chambre.
- Blaise Pascal

George



After sampling more of the above, I found myself practically hypnotized by Uchida's gorgeous take on the slow movements, so I ordered her set. It arrives tomorrow.
"I can't live without music, because music is life." - Yvonne Lefébure

George



Enjoying a first listen to the penultimate disc in this set, a set that I have quickly fallen in love with. The orchestra sound is dynamic and warm, with a lovely low end sound that I don't often hear in classical recordings. Uchida plays beautifully, with a gentle touch. This just might be the set I would take to the proverbial desert island.
"I can't live without music, because music is life." - Yvonne Lefébure

Pohjolas Daughter

Quote from: George on June 27, 2023, 06:17:37 PM

Enjoying a first listen to the penultimate disc in this set, a set that I have quickly fallen in love with. The orchestra sound is dynamic and warm, with a lovely low end sound that I don't often hear in classical recordings. Uchida plays beautifully, with a gentle touch. This just might be the set I would take to the proverbial desert island.
I'll have to see if I can sample this.  I have her Schubert set which I've enjoyed.  :)

PD
Pohjolas Daughter

Spotted Horses

Quote from: George on June 27, 2023, 06:17:37 PM

Enjoying a first listen to the penultimate disc in this set, a set that I have quickly fallen in love with. The orchestra sound is dynamic and warm, with a lovely low end sound that I don't often hear in classical recordings. Uchida plays beautifully, with a gentle touch. This just might be the set I would take to the proverbial desert island.

I feel like I want to like that set more than I do. I should listen to it some more.

And great to see the word (penultimate) used correctly! It seems like the majority of time people use it to mean "even more ultimate," rather than "second to last." :)

What I really think I need now is the Haebler set. I've ignored Haebler until now (who knows why) but some enthusiastic mentions I've seen somewhere make me think that might be a big mistake. Can't find much of it on streaming, however. There is a colossal box set, though.
There are simply two kinds of music, good music and the other kind. - Duke Ellington

SonicMan46

#598
Well, I forgot to report back on my order from HERE - I never received the box (3rd pic below) , they must have ran out at the time of my order; So still have Bilson in my collection.  Now the dark blue box is available for about $50 USD on Amazon but apparently the 10 CDs are in separate jewel cases, i.e. too BIG a space for my needs.  Dave :)

Quote from: SonicMan46 on August 30, 2022, 09:35:02 AMLast few days I've been doing some comparison of Bilson vs. Immerseel on fortepianos in these works (I own Bilson & Sofronitsky) and have never enjoyed the the balance between Bilson's instrument and Gardiner's orchestra which to my ears 'drowns out' the fortepiano when they are playing together - listening to Immerseel on Spotify and don't have the same aural experience.

SO, I've been looking for Immerseel's box at a decent price and found this place in Brussels La Boitea Musique which apparently 'on sale' has the box pictured at the bottom (10 CDs in cardboard sleeves, I believe) - price to me is basically $41 even w/ the steep shipping (plus the Euro & Dollar are at par).  Dave :)
 

SonicMan46

Piano Concertos on fortepiano w/ Bezuidenhout - just finished listening to 2 of his 3 releases on Spotify and enjoyed, however, the attached reviews have been mixed - plus, these were recorded from 2012 to 2022 and I won't be around if he decides to do a disc every 5 years or so -  ;D

Now, I've not auditioned any of Ronald Brautigam's recordings - his BIS box (last pic below) is expensive; the best price I could find was $72 from PrestoMusic - not bad for 12 SCADs - I own his Mozart sonata jewel case stuffed w/ 6 discs!  Will need to do some Spotify listening of Ronald but any comments from PI aficionados who have heard him?  Thanks - Dave :)

P.S. for those who own Brautigam please comment whether these discs are in thin sleeves or each in its original jewel case (a game breaker for me).