Mozart Piano Concertos

Started by Mark, September 08, 2007, 03:01:39 PM

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Elgarian

Quote from: DavidW on February 11, 2010, 01:36:54 PM
Elgarian's review turns me off more than Johan van Veen's review does.

I'm not trying to convert anyone, David. I'm just enjoying writing about my new enthusiasm.

Bulldog

Quote from: Elgarian on February 11, 2010, 01:39:04 PM
Not wrong - just... unnecessary. Perhaps I underestimate the dangers of volume control adjustment.

Sometimes a reviewer just can't win.  If Johan had not mentioned the volume issue, some folks might have been irked when they started playing the set.  Ultimately, the reviewer has to write what he/she wants to say and leave it at that.

I looked at a few other reviews.  MusicWeb loved it, one Fanfare reviewer had mixed feelings, another Fanfare reviewer thought it wonderful, and Mr. Distler over at ClassicsToday found it greatly flawed.

This has all made me very interested in the set; that the keyboardist is the daughter of one of my all-time favorite pianists just ups the enticement.  However, I don't generally want to acquire box sets, so I don't know at this point how I will proceed.

DarkAngel

#222
Quote from: Bulldog on February 11, 2010, 01:54:05 PM
Sometimes a reviewer just can't win.  If Johan had not mentioned the volume issue, some folks might have been irked when they started playing the set.  Ultimately, the reviewer has to write what he/she wants to say and leave it at that.

I looked at a few other reviews.  MusicWeb loved it, one Fanfare reviewer had mixed feelings, another Fanfare reviewer thought it wonderful, and Mr. Distler over at ClassicsToday found it greatly flawed.

This has all made me very interested in the set; that the keyboardist is the daughter of one of my all-time favorite pianists just ups the enticement.  However, I don't generally want to acquire box sets, so I don't know at this point how I will proceed.

The sound for Sofronitzsky gave me no problems at all, clear and finely detailed with very three dimensional soundstage, loudness was nothing unusual perhpas instead of 11 o'clock I listen at 10 o'clock volume.........and I have a very high end stereo ($10,000+) and headphone system, expert reviewer for some reason was bothered by it, very strange to make a big deal about it because I don't hear the problem

Just to show how different taste can be Jed Distiller at Classicstoday did not like Sofronitsky and says best he has heard is the Bilson......I find the Bilson to be somewhat ordinary and distant opaquely recorded fortepiano, my least favorite fortepiano version (despite excellent orchestral work by Gardiner)

Bulldog

Quote from: DavidW on February 11, 2010, 01:36:54 PM

I'm not going to look into it, Elgarian's review turns me off more than Johan van Veen's review does.  If Elgarian hates Mozart until he hears this recording out of many, I don't jump to the conclusion that it's revelatory.  I think it more likely that it's just quirky, unorthodox and just strange so that it doesn't sound like Mozart, and that's why he likes it.  If someone who really loves Mozart says to check it out... then maybe.  But I've already heard fine HIP recordings and I don't need an overpriced no name performer to add to the collection just for the sake of quirkiness.

Don't like those no-name performers?  Some of my favorite recordings come from the no-name category; conversely, I've thrown out many recordings from big-name artists.  Also, she has a name - Sofronitsky, and it's a time-honored name in the keyboard performance category.

DavidW

Quote from: Bulldog on February 11, 2010, 03:05:48 PM
Don't like those no-name performers?  Some of my favorite recordings come from the no-name category; conversely, I've thrown out many recordings from big-name artists.  Also, she has a name - Sofronitsky, and it's a time-honored name in the keyboard performance category.

But she hasn't made that name for herself.  You can say well it's in the blood, but I would say maybe, maybe not.  Yes I shouldn't have said "no name", that's what happens I when I use a cliche expression instead of expressing myself plainly.  You've caught me there.

DavidW

But I'll tell you what Bulldog-- if you listen to those recordings as you said you might, and you give it an enthusiastic endorsement then I will put my money down for one volume.  I will  give it a try.  Not the whole box set, but one cd for sure.

eyeresist

Quote from: Clever Hans on February 11, 2010, 07:36:19 AM
What keeps me from getting the Sofronitzki set is the following review:
http://www.musica-dei-donum.org/cd_reviews/Mozart_KeyboardConcertos_Sofronitzki_Huss.html
Comments?

Regardless of the reviewer's expertise, I can't take this seriously:

Regarding the expanded forces for the early transcribed sonatas, he says "This isn't chamber music anymore, and the result is pretty disastrous." You'd expect some sort of explication after this, but all you get is "the balance between the keyboard and the orchestra is highly unsatisfactory." Unsatisfactory how? He doesn't say.

He also complains about "little differentiation between the notes and too few dynamic shades. Any use of agogical means to create a captivating and rhetorically convincing musical discourse are virtually absent." It sound to me like he wants that overstated, self-conscious "expressive" rubato that I can't stand, but which some take as an indicator of quality. I'm not against rubato, but I think it should sound like a natural expression of the music, not a pose enforced by the musician.

His complaint that "the recording volume [is] too high" is silly. A higher mastering level is something to note, but not to condemn.


Quote from: Tyson on February 11, 2010, 11:59:30 AMThe orchestral portion is FAR better than when she did her cycle with Tate.  But, alas, her playing is just as demure and overly-pretty now as it was back then.  Too bad, and I won't be picking up any more releases if they happen to come out.
The sample on the recent Gramophone disc was actually the first I'd heard of Uchida's Mozart, and I was unimpressed. I don't think the dull, reticent sound helped any.

Bulldog

Quote from: DavidW on February 11, 2010, 03:27:34 PM
But I'll tell you what Bulldog-- if you listen to those recordings as you said you might, and you give it an enthusiastic endorsement then I will put my money down for one volume.  I will  give it a try.  Not the whole box set, but one cd for sure.

The problem is the high cost of the set - about $90.  I have Anda, Schiff, Perahia, Barenboim, Bilson, Levin etc.  Will I get $90 of value out of another set?  If it's a great set, it's worth much more than the sales price.  If not, I've wasted my money except for informational purposes.  A tough decision that I'll wait on.

Elgarian

Quote from: DavidW on February 11, 2010, 01:36:54 PM
If Elgarian hates Mozart until he hears this recording out of many, I don't jump to the conclusion that it's revelatory.
Just a gentle corrective, if I may - I've never hated Mozart, though until relatively recently I've been more or less indifferent. I'm delighted to say that that general situation has changed quite rapidly, not because of one quirky set of piano concertos, but because of a whole series of (mostly HIP) discoveries right across the board, nearly all of which have been revelatory (to me). I actually now probably possess more Mozart CDs than Elgar CDs, and they're even catching up on my collection of Bob Dylan bootlegs. I am a thoroughly converted man.

Elgarian

Quote from: Bulldog on February 11, 2010, 01:54:05 PM
Sometimes a reviewer just can't win.  If Johan had not mentioned the volume issue, some folks might have been irked when they started playing the set.  Ultimately, the reviewer has to write what he/she wants to say and leave it at that.

Yes of course, and I made too big a deal out of it. I think I was thrown by the fact that he seemed to be presenting it as a negative observation, whereas actually it's just an observation.

Bulldog

Quote from: Elgarian on February 11, 2010, 08:57:32 PM
Yes of course, and I made too big a deal out of it. I think I was thrown by the fact that he seemed to be presenting it as a negative observation, whereas actually it's just an observation.

He did present it as negative.  Johan's likely has some optimal volume setting, and it's thumbs down for any recording that isn't on target. :D

Elgarian

Quote from: Bulldog on February 11, 2010, 09:16:08 PM
He did present it as negative.  Johan's likely has some optimal volume setting, and it's thumbs down for any recording that isn't on target. :D

I suppose he would regard me as a shockingly self-indulgent volume-control twiddler. (I've tried to give it up, but you know how it is....)

eyeresist


Clever Hans

In case it hasn't been noted,
Brautigam is recording the complete piano concertos for BIS with Die Kölner Akademie. Recording was to have started in November.
http://www.koelnerakademie.com/index.php?id=3&L=1


DarkAngel

#234
QuoteIn case it hasn't been noted,
Brautigam is recording the complete piano concertos for BIS with Die Kölner Akademie. Recording was to have started in November.
http://www.koelnerakademie.com/index.php?id=3&L=1

Great news..........
Look like eventually we will have Brautigam fortepiano sonatas/concertos trifecta: 
Haydn > Mozart > Beethoven

It will be hard to resist buying as each CD is released during the recording process, but I will do my best to wait for eventual reduced price BIS boxset.....even if that takes a long time (I failed in the Beethoven sonatas and have been buying each full price CD)

 

DavidRoss

"Maybe the problem most of you have ... is that you're not listening to Barbirolli." ~Sarge

"The problem with socialism is that sooner or later you run out of other people's money." ~Margaret Thatcher

Bunny

#236
Quote from: DarkAngel on February 12, 2010, 03:58:50 AM
Great news..........
Look like eventually we will have Brautigam fortepiano sonatas/concertos trifecta: 
Haydn > Mozart > Beethoven

It will be hard to resist buying as each CD is released during the recording process, but I will do my best to wait for eventual reduced price BIS boxset.....even if that takes a long time (I failed in the Beethoven sonatas and have been buying each full price CD)

 

The Mozart has been a box set for quite some time, albeit in different packaging.  I have had these for years! and it was given the 10/10 in December of 2000.  The Haydn was a new box set release, and the Beethoven cycle is still ongoing, so I'm a little confused as to what you are referring to!  Btw, there are not many Beethoven discs left for release: only one or two for the sonatas (might include some of the other solo music) and perhaps one more for the other solo piano music. 

 

Franco

Quote from: Bunny on February 12, 2010, 06:28:12 AM
The Mozart has been a box set for quite some time, albeit in different packaging.  I have had these for years! and it was given the 10/10 in December of 2000.

 

That's the one I have and it is a very good set no matter how it is packaged.

DarkAngel

#238
Quote from: Bunny on February 12, 2010, 06:28:12 AM
The Mozart has been a box set for quite some time, albeit in different packaging.  I have had these for years! and it was given the 10/10 in December of 2000.  The Haydn was a new box set release, and the Beethoven cycle is still ongoing, so I'm a little confused as to what you are referring to!  Btw, there are not many Beethoven discs left for release: only one or two for the sonatas (might include some of the other solo music) and perhaps one more for the other solo piano music. 

 

Bunny was referring to post directly above mine saying Brautigam will begin to record complete Mozart piano concertos (in addition to existing sonatas boxset) and I will "try" to wait for eventual reduced price boxset before purchase

Franco

Yes, DA, I understand - but I prefer the Mozart PC using modern piano (the orchestra seems to dwarf the fp, and there are other reasons) - but I do like solo fortepiano recordings, and was commenting on the older packaging of the Brautigam Mozart sonatas.